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jAkUp
01-31-03, 11:14 PM
check it out here:
http://www.hardocp.com/article.html?art=NDIxLDQ=


they say the image quality is till not as good as the 9700, but looks better than the old screenshots

Steppy
01-31-03, 11:34 PM
One thing I've noticed all over the place...what ever happened to taking screenshots from identical vantage points when you're trying to compare?

ClyssaN
01-31-03, 11:47 PM
It's good they have corrected the 2xAA screenshots, but i simply think if we want IQ, 4xAA is the minimum, and i think the 4xAA was the target of the nv30, but that remains the same ...

Skynet
02-01-03, 12:16 AM
It's pretty obvious to me that the GeFX only blurs the image to remove the aliasing. Look at the diamond plate floor. The 9700 renders it sharp but the FX blurs it. What a stupid trick. :confused: :mad:

ATI LoVeR 9700
02-01-03, 12:33 AM
Wow... That GeforceFX has some pretty bad AA quality. I don't know what the hell came over them to use Super Sampling as an option for AA...

Bigus Dickus
02-01-03, 02:03 AM
Wow... missing fog, low mininum framerates, horrible texture corruption, AA corruption and poor AA quality.

originally posted by Chalnoth:
To date there is one example of a driver bug in nVidia's drivers, and that's a significant visual quality issue in the xS AA modes in some games. It's statistically impossible to infer anything from one flaw.
Yep, I agree with Chalnoth - the 9700's drivers at the time of reviews were just as bad as the GFFX's are now, but they just didn't notice all of those problems with the 9700 launch.

Problems like stuttering which he makes such an issue out of... oh, but wait - I seem to remember the GFFX having unusually low minimum framerates. Could it be stuttering as well? No... not possible.

Gehenna_CA
02-01-03, 02:44 AM
Did you notice on the UT2k3 shots that at 6xaa the Gffx was ~20fps slower and it looked worse? Boy, that card sure is worth the massive amount of money it costs.:rolleyes:

StealthHawk
02-01-03, 04:22 AM
Originally posted by Skynet
It's pretty obvious to me that the GeFX only blurs the image to remove the aliasing. Look at the diamond plate floor. The 9700 renders it sharp but the FX blurs it. What a stupid trick. :confused: :mad:

uh, is this any worse than what the gf3/4 currently does? and i'm really not sure if the gfFX is blurry. can't tell on this poor monitor. i'll leave the IQ inspections for later, but at this point r9700's doesn't look any sharper.

Hellbinder
02-01-03, 04:44 AM
uh, is this any worse than what the gf3/4 currently does? and i'm really not sure if the gfFX is blurry. can't tell on this poor monitor. i'll leave the IQ inspections for later, but at this point r9700's doesn't look any sharper.


Riiiiiiigggghhhhtt....... :rolleyes:

MuFu
02-01-03, 05:26 AM
Originally posted by ATI LoVeR 9700
Wow... That GeforceFX has some pretty bad AA quality. I don't know what the hell came over them to use Super Sampling as an option for AA...

It's not supersampling, it's RGMSAA. SSAA would most likely look a lot better and take a much bigger fps hit.

MuFu.

MikeC
02-01-03, 05:40 AM
It's getting to a point where screenshots are not as effective in portraying image quailty.

I also agree with Steppy's earlier comment...

"What ever happened to taking screenshots from identical vantage points (and under the same conditions) when you're trying to compare?"

http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?image=MTA0MzYyMDg1OTVjVVNkMzFISXhfNF8xM l9sLmpwZw==

http://www.hardocp.com/image.html?image=MTA0MzYyMDg1OTVjVVNkMzFISXhfNF8xO V9sLmpwZw==

Ratchet
02-01-03, 05:58 AM
There are plenty of games out there that let you save during gameplay so you start in the exact same point each time. MOH:AA, SOF2, IL2-Sturmovik, Hitman2, RtCW, Morrowind, etc, etc. Any of those provide excellent opportunity to test and compare Anti-Aliasing and Anisotropic Filtering.

So, with some planning and clever hard-drive swapping, you can load the exact same positions for each videocard you test.

StealthHawk
02-01-03, 06:02 AM
Originally posted by Hellbinder
Riiiiiiigggghhhhtt....... :rolleyes:
i must be blind then. i even took off the anti-glare screen and the 2x shots on the gfFX still don't look any blurier than the 2x shots on the r9700. we are taking about texture sharpness and not the quality of the edge AA right?

i am correct in saying that you and others are accusing nvidia of simply blurring the screen up with 2x FSAA now like they do with QCA?

let me tell you something else. i've looked at screenshots with QCA and 2x/4x on a gf4, and besides blurry text, the teture quality looks the same to me between them too.

so either i'm not looking in the right place, or my eyes aren't good enough. as long as the text doesn't blur and i can't tell the difference, i really don't give a rat's ass what nvidia does with 2x. the extra performance hit of 4x FSAA on gfFX still doesn't justify the marginal IQ gain over 2x.

as i've stated in another thread, this is not the case for the r9700, whose 4x looks significantly better than 2x as well as nvidia's 4x.

Ratchet
02-01-03, 06:03 AM
Originally posted by MuFu
It's not supersampling, it's RGMSAA. SSAA would most likely look a lot better and take a much bigger fps hit.

MuFu.
I thought the GFFX used Ordered Grid and not Rotated Grid?

StealthHawk
02-01-03, 06:06 AM
Originally posted by Ratchet
I though the GFFX used Ordered Grid, not Rotated Grid?

2x is RGMS.
4x is OGMS.

MuFu
02-01-03, 06:14 AM
Uh huh. The 4xs mode and some of the 6x and 8x modes also have an RGMS component to them.

A kind of *ahem* "proprietary post-filtering" technique as well, it would seem.

MuFu.

MikeC
02-01-03, 06:17 AM
Originally posted by StealthHawk
let me tell you something else. i've looked at screenshots with QCA and 2x/4x on a gf4, and besides blurry text, the teture quality looks the same to me between them too.

Agreed. I would also be interested in seeing the impact of enabling "texture sharpening" in the control panel setting on the GeForce FX. Do you know if any of the reviews happen to use that setting?

MikeC
02-01-03, 06:18 AM
Originally posted by MuFu
Uh huh. The 4xs mode and some of the 6x and 8x modes also have an RGMS component to them.

A kind of *ahem* "proprietary post-filtering" technique as well, it would seem.

MuFu.

:argh:

Heh.

MuFu
02-01-03, 06:20 AM
What?! What did I say, what? WHAT?!

:D

MuFu.

noko
02-01-03, 09:59 AM
I can think of situations where the GF FX would have better AA, some shots with Alpha textures would show the GF FX in the 4xS mode and above looking much better.

MuFu
02-01-03, 10:17 AM
That is true, but if it becomes too much of an issue ATi always have scope to reveal programmable pseudo-random sampling and SSAA functionality. Maybe R350 will support these from the get-go.

MuFu.

noko
02-01-03, 10:42 AM
Thats what I am hoping for :).

digitalwanderer
02-01-03, 11:11 AM
...on correcting it and still being bluntly honest on their analysis that the FX AA solution ain't as good looking as the ATI AA, but [h] is still the home of the nazi-mods so I damn near never go there. (I never read their FX review, but I went back to read their correction....YES I'm still pissed and hung-up on that banning fiasco they had and never addressed!!! :mad: )

[h]=nazi-mods, I don't go there. :p

Blkout
02-01-03, 04:38 PM
Well, there is no question that the ATI AA is far superior to the Nvidia AA and it doesn't take nowhere near the performance hit when enabled as evident by the FPS counter on the screen. I will say this though, the actual colors of the GF FX screenshots look better on NFS HP2 than on the ATI. If you look at the ATI and the Nivida screenshots of the bridge, you can clearly see that the ATI's colors look a little washed out or bland. The Nvidia's colors are more vibrant and the blacks are darker and have more contrast. I would say judging by those screens that the Nvidia has better image quality not counting AA or ASF. But then again, if you look at the screenshots from the other games, its harder to see a color variation from the ATI to the Nvidia card. So that makes me wonder if it was not a setting in the ATI drivers or the NFS HP2 settings that was causing the washed out looking colors.

Regardless, the AA quality of the ATI completely kicks the Nividia's arse!!!

legion88
02-01-03, 04:54 PM
Originally posted by Steppy
One thing I've noticed all over the place...what ever happened to taking screenshots from identical vantage points when you're trying to compare?

It went away of the DoDo.