A little confused on the NV35, R350, and R400

[PreservedSwine]

Could you guys help me out with this?

Back in their respective development stages, which card was aimed at which target performance level? (Pre NV30 delays)
As I understand it, 1 year ago, things were shaping up to look like this:

NV30 vs R300 ----> similiar release dates, similair performance

NV35 vs R350 ----> similiar release dates, similair performance

NV40 vs R400 ----> similiar release dates, similair performance

Now, with Nvidia missing a cycle, How is the above scenario affected?

Does this mean that the NV35 will be competing w/ the R400? Also, does this mean that this won't be the *same* NV35 that Nvidia was designing one year ago, but a much more robust NV35? Or will it be pretty much the same NV35 they were planning on, basically meaning that the NV35 will not be on the same performance level as the R400?:confused:

[Uttar]

Your understanding is not correct.
The following is what was known or supposed before the GFFX delay:

nVidia, early H1 2001: NV20 ( GF3 )

ATI, early H2 2001: R200 ( Radeon 8500 )
nVidia, mid H2 2001: NV20 Refreshes ( GF3 Ti200 & GF3 Ti500 )

nVidia, early H1 2002: NV25 ( GF4 )
ATI, early H1 2002: 8500LE ( can't really be called a release, however... )

ATI, early H2 2002: R300 ( Radeon 9700 Pro )
nVidia, mid H2 2002: NV30 ( GFFX )

ATI, late H2 2002: R300 Refreshes for mid-end ( Radeon 9500 Pro & Regular )

nVidia, mid H1 2003, NV30 refresh ( what is now known as the Ultra ) and derivatives for both mid-end and low-end ( NV31, NV33? , NV34 )
ATI, mid H1 2003, R350 ( high-end ) & RV350 ( low-end )

ATI, early H2 2003: R400 ( Radeon 10000? )
nVidia, mid H2 2003: NV35 ( GFFX 2? )
( ? ) ATI, late H2 2003: R400 mid-end ( Radeon 9500 Pro pricerange )
nVidia, late H2 2003: NV35 mid-end ( NV36 )

( ? ) nVidia, early H1 2004: NV35 Refreshes for high-end and low-end ( probably no mid-end refresh, NV36 is expected to still be used there )
( ? ) ATI, early H1 2004: R400 high-end refresh, mid-end and low-end too

Anything which begins with " ( ? ) " is something which is not certain at all.

Now, from that list, we get:
NV20 Derivates VS R200 ( winner: NV20 Derivatives )
GF4 VS R200 ( winner: GF4 )
R300 VS NV30 ( winner: NV30, but only by a small margin )
R300 mid-end VS GF4 ( winner: R300 mid-end )
R350 VS NV30 Refresh ( winner: unknown, probably R350 )
NV30 Derivatives VS RV350 & R300 mid-end ( winner: unknown )
R400 VS NV35 ( winner: unknown )
NV36 VS R400 mid-end ( winner: unknown )
NV35 Refresh VS R450 ( winner: unknown )

Okay, so that's what was 95% sure

Here's what's expected right now:

nVidia, early H1 2001: NV20 ( GF3 )

ATI, early H2 2001: R200 ( Radeon 8500 )
nVidia, mid H2 2001: NV20 Refreshes ( GF3 Ti200 & GF3 Ti500 )

nVidia, early H1 2002: NV25 ( GF4 )
ATI, early H1 2002: 8500LE ( can't really be called a release, however... )

ATI, early H2 2002: R300 ( Radeon 9700 Pro )
nVidia, mid H2 2002: NV28

ATI, late H2 2002: R300 Refreshes for mid-end ( Radeon 9500 Pro & Regular )

nVidia, mid H1 2003, NV30 ( Regular ) + NV30 refresh ( Ultra )
ATI, mid H1 2003, R350 ( high-end ) & RV350 ( low-end )
nVidia, late H1 2003, NV30 derivatives for both mid-end and low-end ( NV31, NV33? , NV34 )

ATI, early H2 2003: R400 ( Radeon 10000? )
nVidia, mid H2 2003: NV35 ( GFFX 2? )
( ? ) ATI, late H2 2003: R400 mid-end ( Radeon 9500 Pro pricerange )
nVidia, late H2 2003: NV35 mid-end ( NV36 )

( ? ) nVidia, early H1 2004: NV35 Refreshes for high-end and low-end ( probably no mid-end refresh, NV36 is expected to still be used there )
( ? ) ATI, early H1 2004: R400 high-end refresh, mid-end and low-end too

As you can see, very little changed. NV30 derivatives are slightly delayed, and the NV30 was significantly delayed. Everything else, including the R400 and NV35, is on schedule according to the latest available information.

So, we get:
Now, from that list, we get:
NV20 Derivates VS R200 ( winner: NV20 Derivatives )
GF4 VS R200 ( winner: GF4 )
R300 VS GF4 ( winner: R300, by a signifiant margin )
R300 mid-end VS GF4 ( winner: R300 mid-end by a small margin )
R350 VS NV30 Refresh ( winner: unknown, probably R350 )
NV30 Derivatives VS RV350 & R300 mid-end ( winner: unknown )
R400 VS NV35 ( winner: unknown )
NV36 VS R400 mid-end ( winner: unknown )
NV35 Refresh VS R450 ( winner: unknown )


So, as you can see, the NV35 was targetted against the R400 from day one. And nVidia certainly knows how impressive the R400 is.
It sounds like roles switch really faster in this industry. First, it was Architecture VS Performance with the R200 vs GF3. Then, it was the same thing again with NV30 vs R300, only with the roles switched.
And guess what... Now it'll be R400 vs NV35, with ATI having the architectural advantage once again. The performance between those two cards, however, is still up for grabs. But the NV35 is really a lot more about brute force.


Uttar

[MrNasty]

You have too much time on your hands utter