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Lurker28
07-06-06, 05:45 AM
Well I recently upgraded from a OC'd XFX 7800GTX to a brand new XFX 7950GX2. I am having a little bit of a problem here with Oblivion, because it runs IDENTICAL to my 7800GTX.

I use fraps to track my fps in game, and in the city of Anvil (which really works your graphics card) I get 20 fps in some places, so what i will do is save where ever I am looking and do a little test.

With both 7800GTX and 7950GX2, i will get 20FPS in the same exact place and top of that everyone else is pretty much identical as well. I would suspect going from a single gpu to a multi-gpu would really increase my frame rate. At least by 10fps or so in Oblivion. I was quite disappointed to find out it actually did absolutely nothing.

Can anyone help me witht his here is my rigg:

AMD X2 4400+ (OC'd to 2.4ghz, I know not much...noob OC'er)
80GB Raptor HDx2 (Raid 0)
2GB Patriot memory (2-3-2-5)
ABit Fatl1ty Mobo
Audigy 2 ZS

Can anyone give me some advice on how to possibly get some frame rate out of the game, or a setting I could be missing here without sacraficing image quality.

K007
07-06-06, 06:22 AM
Well..give 91.33 a shot...maybe not getting enuf power? Have you tried other games? 3dmark should be a good way to know if the card is giving out its 'uber' juice...or other benchmarks ie VST.

Also make sure that you say the 7950 as a single card. Donno about that motherboard much but i know that ASUS Premium SLI mobo some people set it up as Multi GPU thing in the bios..its actually a single card...

Other things cauld be Power not enuf..or your cpu holding you back

Try other games out..compare it with 3dmark score..make sure you got the new drivers like 91.33..i hear they are pretty solid..check that your pc knows its not a SLI setup...and finally check that your card is getting enuf PSU..

If all of them is checked..then maybe the CPU is holding you back..you cauld also check the temps on the gpus..i hear they get really..REALLY hot..90-100C ftw..

edit: make sure you havent set it to sli, this really cuts the perfermance.

Also make sure your motherboard supports it..maybe the motherboard needs a bios update. you can check this up on nvidia.com under the 7950/compatibilty. - http://www.nvidia.com/content/geforce_gx2_sbios/us.asp?vendor=abit&sortBy=

Xion X2
07-06-06, 10:46 AM
The 91.31's should work fine, if that's what he's using. It's what I used with mine when I still had my GX2.

It sounds like you're running off a single GPU. Make sure that you have "Multi-GPU" enabled on your graphics utility. Also make sure you're running the game in either AFR or AFR2 rendering mode for best performance.

I was getting 55fps on average on my GX2 @ 1680 resolution w/ HDR, so I know that you're way off right now.

The framerate drop in towns, however is normal--though not to the extent that you're experiencing. Oblivion is CPU limited inside towns where lots of people are walking around due to all of the A.I. Even with the GX2 you're going to see significant framerate drops in towns.

CaptNKILL
07-06-06, 11:00 AM
For what its worth, the city areas are extremely CPU heavy, not really all that GPU heavy (considering youre using a 7950). I didnt get any framerate change in the cities going from a 7900GTX to 7950GX2. The biggest difference I found comes from grassy areas. I got a 40-50% performance increase in those areas.

SH64
07-06-06, 12:09 PM
Check the Oblivion forum for some performance tweaks.

Eliminator
07-06-06, 07:05 PM
speaking of tweaks heres some tweaks that doubled my fps in some grassy areas and barely lowered visual quality....
1. go to video options in the game and disable shadows on grass
2. go to the oblivion.ini in my documents and change iMinGrassSize to 105 (minimal visual loss)

Lurker28
07-07-06, 03:04 AM
I'm running the newest POS Nvidia Drivers, 8x.xx series was so much cleaner...too bad I can't go back. It is running on multi-GPU mode, so there is nothing to change there.

I would still think even though cities use up some of the CPU, I would still be able to see a few FPS increase, at least from 20 to 25+....I just do not understand how it does not change.

You would believe that if you spent such a high dollar amount on your GPU and you have a high-medium CPU (4400+ X2) you would be able to see at least decent playable FPS.

Xion X2
07-07-06, 10:48 AM
I would still think even though cities use up some of the CPU, I would still be able to see a few FPS increase, at least from 20 to 25+....I just do not understand how it does not change.

I averaged 35-40 FPS in towns with my GX2 when I still had it, and I have the 4400+ like you. Something's definitely wrong, Lurker. You need to create a signature though so we can all tell what parts you're using. It could be any of a number of issues.

Edit: I see now you listed your rig in your original post. It'd be helpful if you provided your PSU information, too, as to what model, wattage, 12v rail amps. Is that Abit mobo on Nvidia's compatibility list for the 7950?

Xion X2
07-07-06, 10:56 AM
Lurker--if you're still around, you might want to check out jabloom's post on page 3 of this thread. Last one at the bottom, here's the link:

http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=72830&page=3

CaptNKILL
07-07-06, 11:08 AM
I averaged 35-40 FPS in towns with my GX2 when I still had it, and I have the 4400+ like you. Something's definitely wrong, Lurker. You need to create a signature though so we can all tell what parts you're using. It could be any of a number of issues.

Edit: I see now you listed your rig in your original post. It'd be helpful if you provided your PSU information, too, as to what model, wattage, 12v rail amps. Is that Abit mobo on Nvidia's compatibility list for the 7950?
Its not really accurate to compare cities in general. A specific place at a specific time is really the only way to judge if the performance is right or not.

Look at the benchmarks I did in a certain place in the imperial city:
http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=875506&postcount=7

Depending on the situation, the game can be extremely CPU limited or GPU limited. In a CPU limited situation, more graphics power (or even a much lower resolution) will do absolutely nothing for your framerates.

There could be something wrong, but its most likely not graphics related if there is. Make sure you dont have anything running in the background, and do the usual spyware scans on your system.

Youre probably just hitting a CPU wall though. Its sad, but its just one of the major downsides of the engine they use. Morrowind from 2002 is even more CPU heavy than Oblivion when you crank the draw distance up.

Xion X2
07-07-06, 11:20 AM
Its not really accurate to compare cities in general. A specific place at a specific time is really the only way to judge if the performance is right or not.

That's true, but for the most part I would average around 35-40 in the cities when there were several characters on the screen at once. It was pretty consistent.

Youre probably just hitting a CPU wall though. Its sad, but its just one of the major downsides of the engine they use. Morrowind from 2002 is even more CPU heavy than Oblivion when you crank the draw distance up.

The wall shouldn't knock him down to 20FPS, though, unless he has some kind of spyware running in the background like you suggested. Even then, it shouldn't be a consistent 20FPS that he's running at. That's something he would have to clarify for us--whether it stays there or just flashes there occasionally.

Oblivion, at no time, ever dropped below 35FPS on my system when I had my GX2. This was @ 1680x1050 res, in-game 4xAA, 16xAF (utility), all in-game graphics maxed except grass shadows turned off.

CaptNKILL
07-07-06, 11:42 AM
That's true, but for the most part I would average around 35-40 in the cities when there were several characters on the screen at once. It was pretty consistent.



The wall shouldn't knock him down to 20FPS, though, unless he has some kind of spyware running in the background like you suggested. Even then, it shouldn't be a consistent 20FPS that he's running at. That's something he would have to clarify for us--whether it stays there or just flashes there occasionally.

Oblivion, at no time, ever dropped below 35FPS on my system when I had my GX2. This was @ 1680x1050 res, in-game 4xAA, 16xAF (utility), all in-game graphics maxed except grass shadows turned off.

Hmm... well thats very very different than my experience, and I've seen the game on a few different high end systems (one with an A64 X2 @ 2.5Ghz).

Look at the benchmarks I ran. If a single core A64 at 2.475Ghz is getting 13-18fps average in one area, a dual core isnt going to make the framerates skyrocket to 35+fps constant.

The game just isnt consistant enough to say that it will run at Xfps constant on a good machine. Im not saying youre wrong, Im saying that 20fps in this game on a high end machine isnt a sign that something is wrong (even though its anoying).

Xion X2
07-07-06, 01:11 PM
Hmm... well thats very very different than my experience, and I've seen the game on a few different high end systems (one with an A64 X2 @ 2.5Ghz).

Look at the benchmarks I ran. If a single core A64 at 2.475Ghz is getting 13-18fps average in one area, a dual core isnt going to make the framerates skyrocket to 35+fps constant.

The game just isnt consistant enough to say that it will run at Xfps constant on a good machine. Im not saying youre wrong, Im saying that 20fps in this game on a high end machine isnt a sign that something is wrong (even though its anoying).

Actually, I would say if your framerate drops down to 20 in Oblivion anywhere, with an X2 and GX2, then something is definitely wrong. For the first day I had my GX2 I did nothing but play Oblivion and FEAR, and I had FRAPS running the entire time. I watched my frame-counter like a hawk, and it never, ever dipped below 30FPS.

In fact, the benchmarks run on this game agree. Under stress-testing the most demanding part of Oblivion, which are heavy foliage areas with lots of shadows, even the X1800GTO never got below 20FPS:
http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/oblivion_mainstream_performance/page9.asp

I can't find it right now, but the lowest I ever saw the frames drop on the GTX in their benchmarks at 1280 resolution w/ 8xAF + HDR was 24FPS.

Considering the GX2 is about 1.5x the graphics performance of a single GTX, you're looking at no less than 35-40FPS exactly as I said. If yours or your friend's is dropping down to 18-20FPS with the above graphics settings then something's not right on your machines.

Xion X2
07-07-06, 01:21 PM
http://images.tomshardware.com/2006/06/05/geforce_7950_gx2/image012.gif

http://www.tomshardware.com/2006/06/05/geforce_7950_gx2/page11.html

As you can see, these #'s are too low to be an average. An XTX will get much better than an average of 22FPS on the outdoor environments @ 1600 resolution, so even though they don't specify it anywhere that I can see, my guess is that they're taking the lowest recorded framerate on each card, which is what Anandtech and firingsquad did in their benchmarks of Oblivion as well. In fact, that's exactly what they're doing because my GTX was benchmarked on Anandtech at a minimum of 24FPS outdoors on 1280 resolution, and that's exactly what TomsHardware is reporting, too.

Notice that the GX2 gets an absolute minimum of 29FPS @ 1600 resolution.

CaptNKILL
07-07-06, 01:49 PM
Actually, I would say if your framerate drops down to 20 in Oblivion anywhere, with an X2 and GX2, then something is definitely wrong. For the first day I had my GX2 I did nothing but play Oblivion and FEAR, and I had FRAPS running the entire time. I watched my frame-counter like a hawk, and it never, ever dipped below 30FPS.

In fact, the benchmarks run on this game agree. Under stress-testing the most demanding part of Oblivion, which are heavy foliage areas with lots of shadows, even the X1800GTO never got below 20FPS:
http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/oblivion_mainstream_performance/page9.asp

I can't find it right now, but the lowest I ever saw the frames drop on the GTX in their benchmarks at 1600 resolution w/ 8xAF + HDR was 24FPS.

Considering the GX2 is about 1.5x the graphics performance of a single GTX, you're looking at no less than 35-40FPS exactly as I said. If yours or your friend's is dropping down to 18-20FPS with the above graphics settings then something's not right on your machines.
The foliage areas arent CPU limited, the cities are.

I dont know what to tell you. Go to Bravil with fraps running and walk around and tell me what the lowest framerate you get is. Or stand at one end of the imperial market district (by one of the entrance doors at the ends of the district) and look out toward the center.

There isnt anything wrong with our systems.

Just to clarify, in my benchmarks that I linked to earlier, I was testing a single area, without moving, so that was a constant framerate (hence why the average\min\max fps are so similar). If I walk around in the city I get 60fps some times, but other places are just like the one I mentioned.

What the original poster said was that a certain place he tested in a city wasnt showing any performance difference between a 7800GTX and a 7950GX2. He didnt say his average framerates in foliage areas didnt change. I was merely pointing out that its well documented that the game has extremely CPU bound areas where the graphics card doesnt really effect performance all that much, the majority of these areas are in cities.

For more confirmation of this, check out this firingsquad article:
http://www.firingsquad.com/hardware/amd_athlon_64_fx_62_5000/page11.asp

If they had min framerates listed, Im sure you would see drops like the ones I mentioned, and also, as you can see, the graphics related settings make almost no difference in the framerate.

pharma
07-07-06, 07:55 PM
Lurker28,

Not sure this has been mentioned, but set AA to "Application Controlled" in the Nvidia Control Panel. Then set whatever AA you want in the Oblivion Options section.

I found there is an issue when AA is not set to "Application Controlled" when playing Oblivion, not sure why though.

Pharma