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TiKiMaN1
03-13-07, 01:58 PM
http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cynamite.de%2Fps3%2Fn ews%2Fmore%2Fabwaertskompatibilitaet_der_ps3_so_si ehts_aus%2F80987%2Fabwaertskompatibilitaet_der_ps3 _so_siehts_aus.html&langpair=de%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&prev=%2Flanguage_tools

For the PS3's sake I hope that through Firmware and Emulation updates this is fixed. Maybe this will be fixed at launch. Apparently only one of the following games worked correctly using the new Pal PS3 that will shortly be released.

God of War
MGS 2: Sons of Liberty
MGS 3: Snake Eater
Shadow of the Colossus
Guitar Hero 2
Prince of Persia: The Two Thrones
Okami
GTA: Liberty City Stories
Eragon
Final Fantasy X-2
Ratchet & Clank 3
Lumines Plus

Imbroglio
03-13-07, 02:11 PM
eragon ftw

what european play the MGS series or God of War, do europeans even play guitars, imo sony knows their consumer base and is catering to it, nothing more nothing less:rolleyes:

SebC
03-13-07, 02:14 PM
So not only are you saying that people paying 425 for a console will play Eragon, they are also non-guitar players? Moreover, you're saying we don't love MGS and GOW as much as you do, or more?!

OWA
03-13-07, 02:32 PM
Well, it'll be interesting to see if that is accurate anyway. The Inq. said the site is saying it used 1.50. At least here (in the US), we're on 1.54 already. I thought they also said there was supposed to be a major firmware update before the release but to tell the truth, that might have been part of the rumor thread.

Imbroglio
03-13-07, 03:21 PM
So not only are you saying that people paying 425 for a console will play Eragon, they are also non-guitar players? Moreover, you're saying we don't love MGS and GOW as much as you do, or more?!

no i was being sarcastic and stating how sony only gave BC to eragon because that's what europeans love.... obviously not.

my response ended with :rolleyes: i know europeans play guitar hero and the MGS series and god of war, i was being sarcastic stating that sony thinks their european consumer base only plays eragon and hence why that is the only BC game. sorry to offend, i was trying to be over-the-top sarcastic, i guess not everyone will get that.

Lyme
03-13-07, 03:47 PM
We all know that the Europeans are getting shafted by Sony, the question is by how much. The tale will be told on launch day.

sytaylor
03-13-07, 03:49 PM
I still no a bunch of rich kids at uni asking mommy and daddy for a PS3 on launch day. It will sell just because they loved the PS2. After the early adopter bunch though, it could well struggle.

Bad_Boy
03-13-07, 04:22 PM
This is the most retarded thread you've made in a while tiki. The firmware with the BC update (1.6) for europe isnt even out yet. They tested using 1.5.

TiKiMaN1
03-13-07, 05:24 PM
This is the most retarded thread you've made in a while tiki. The firmware with the BC update (1.6) for europe isnt even out yet. They tested using 1.5.

Apparently you must know something we all don't. How do you know even updating to Firmware 1.6 is all of sudden going to create emulation for a ton of games. Personally I think Europe is in for a surprise....a lack of backwards compatability surprise (worse than expected).:p

By the way how do you get off by calling my thread retarded, let alone one of the most retarded ones in a while? Please tell me the last time I said something like this about you.;)

All I was doing is reporting what a site found in their early attempts with a PAL PS3. I even commented in my original post that I hope this can be cleared up with a Firmware or Emulation update.

Marvel_us
03-13-07, 05:45 PM
Well it was said that the 1.6 update would be the one shipped with the UK PS3s and on launch day the official list will go up.

I'd be surprised if they indeed left out damn near all their biggest titles. Especially after they sent Phil Harrison out to do damage control when all the PS3 nay-sayers kept saying there would only be a "handful" of PS2 BC compatible games. In a couple weeks time we'll know the real deal but for now I wouldn't really worry too much about this news.

SebC
03-13-07, 05:45 PM
oh ok Imbroglio, was probably the "imo" that made me think you were serious

And yeh, I don't think initially they will be able to emulate many games - I'm sure the higher-ranked games would be priority for Sony right now though, so I'm guessing there will be a firmware by european launch that can emulate them well

Bad_Boy
03-13-07, 05:48 PM
Apparently you must know something we all don't. How do you know even updating to Firmware 1.6 is all of sudden going to create emulation for a ton of games. Personally I think Europe is in for a surprise....a lack of backwards compatability surprise (worse than expected).:pBecause its pretty much well known that the BC stuff will be featured in the 1.6 firmware which is coming day and date with the European launch. Which is why sony will put up the list of the working/non-working games on the 23rd from the 1.6 firmware.


By the way how do you get off by calling my thread retarded, let alone one of the most retarded ones in a while? Please tell me the last time I said something like this about you.;) I'm calling this thread retarded, not you. Don't take it personal. It's a pointless thing to post until the new firmware is released. It's like buying a game without the console and asking why the games wont work, it's retarded.


All I was doing is reporting what a site found in their early attempts with a PAL PS3. I even commented in my original post that I hope this can be cleared up with a Firmware or Emulation update.Thats fair, and I'm sure you meant no harm (you are not the only one to post this stuff today, I've seen it on atleast 4 other forums), but it would help if you actually understood the issue at hand. They are basically testing BC without the required firmware in PAL systems.

If 1.6 isnt the actual BC firmware for europe a week+ from now, I'll apologize and eat my crow TiKi, but for now I still think it's plain stupid to even talk about this yet.

Bad_Boy
03-14-07, 05:45 AM
This is for you TiKi..

From the london threespeech event.
* Phil did confirm that the PAL/Euro version of the Playstation 3 currently has over 1200 compatible PS2 titles, with more to be added to the list by the time the console launches. This will be via a necessary firmware upgrade to 1.6 (the consoles were shipped over 4 weeks ago.)
http://www.playthree.net/2007/03/european-ps3-has-over-1200-compatible.html

Lyme
03-14-07, 03:54 PM
This is for you TiKi..

From the london threespeech event.

http://www.playthree.net/2007/03/european-ps3-has-over-1200-compatible.html

That isn't a direct quote from Phil, it is a summary of what he said and may have been mis-interpreted. The last direct quote I read from Phil said something along the lines of: we are aiming for BC of over 1200 titles. Which is not the same as meeting that target. Then again for those people who never owned a ps2, BC makes really no difference unless there is a ps1/2 game they really want to play.

As for BC with the big name titles. These titles generally are successful because they take the hardware to new hights of performance. In doing so the developers usually take non-standard approaches to coding for this additional performance. Providing BC for these games is typically harder and takes much longer than providing it for the titles written in a standard way.

Bad_Boy
03-15-07, 07:21 AM
Why would it be misinterpreted. Threespeech quoted the same number, they are a semi-official site so I doubt they would put a misinterpreted number up there. A couple weeks ago Phil said it would be 1000+, and now he said 1200+, is that hard to believe?

Anyways, my point was that the PAL BC would be in firmware 1.6.

ATI_Dude
03-15-07, 07:41 AM
As for BC with the big name titles. These titles generally are successful because they take the hardware to new hights of performance. In doing so the developers usually take non-standard approaches to coding for this additional performance. Providing BC for these games is typically harder and takes much longer than providing it for the titles written in a standard way.

Good point. This is probably why the PAL consoles still contain the PS2 Graphics Synthesizer (GS). The GS has a rather unique architecture with on-die eDRAM and an insanely wide bus (2560 bits IIRC) which probably can't be emulated 100% by Cell or RSX. Many PS2 games also use palletized textures which have never played well with nVidia hardware. Retaining GS probably means that big titels such as MGS, SotC, Okami and FFXII will work with firmware 1.60.

Lyme
03-15-07, 12:31 PM
Why would it be misinterpreted. Threespeech quoted the same number, they are a semi-official site so I doubt they would put a misinterpreted number up there. A couple weeks ago Phil said it would be 1000+, and now he said 1200+, is that hard to believe?

Anyways, my point was that the PAL BC would be in firmware 1.6.

Bad_Boy I don't think the misleading is intentional, however it is human nature to change the story every time it is retold. I'm sure you remember from your childhood the class activity of getting a number of students to sit in a circle and a short quote would be passed around the circle from person to person. In the end the quote ends up distorted, even when people are trying to preserve it exactly. Point in case, a couple of weeks ago Phil did not say bc would be 1000+ titles, he said they were "aiming" for bc of 1000+ titles.

Is 1200+ hard to belive? Actually it is. The PS1 and PS2 are both pretty complex pieces of hardware. Emulating even 90% of what they do in software is not a easy job. Just take a look at most of the nintendo64 emulators. They have been in development for years and still are quite imperfect.

However, the release of the PS3 in Europe is pretty close, and as I do not live in Europe or want a PS3(yet), it really makes no difference to me if it is true or not. What I care about is the spread of FUD and lies. In my book misquoting is a form of a lie.

kev13dd
03-15-07, 01:26 PM
Is 1200+ hard to belive? Actually it is. The PS1 and PS2 are both pretty complex pieces of hardware. Emulating even 90% of what they do in software is not a easy job. Just take a look at most of the nintendo64 emulators. They have been in development for years and still are quite imperfect.
And how many N64 emulators are designed by the same people who designed the N64? I'm pretty sure if SONY is the one doing the emulating using their own software and hardware that THEY CREATED then they might have a much better shot at creating good emulation that can get 1200+

It sounds to me like Sony is doing their best to achieve perfect emulation for all their games eventually, so that they can claim it as a feature to get people to buy the console. Microsoft on the other hand seems to be using their emulation to steer profit in the direction they want (aka not emulating any previous generation sports titles so that people have to buy the new versions)

Props goes to Sony for at least trying. If they don't hit 1200+ on this try, at least we'll be able to hold them accountable to this number in the future

K

|MaguS|
03-15-07, 03:22 PM
Is 1200+ hard to belive? Actually it is. The PS1 and PS2 are both pretty complex pieces of hardware. Emulating even 90% of what they do in software is not a easy job. Just take a look at most of the nintendo64 emulators. They have been in development for years and still are quite imperfect.


Wait are you so stupid as to compare A proffesional hardware developers emulation team who actually has indepth hardware specs and knowledge of the old consoles to amatures who code on their spare time with incomplete and innacturate hardware details?

You just lost all credibility, oh and don't compare emulating the PS2 to the Xbox on the X360 since with the Xbox to X360 they had complety different drivers and hardware while all they removed from the PS3 in Europe was the CPU of the PS2, the GPU of the PS2 is still in the PS3. So on the graphics end nothing will really need to be emulated unless it was drawn in software by the CPU.

Bad_Boy
03-16-07, 08:38 AM
Bad_Boy I don't think the misleading is intentional, however it is human nature to change the story every time it is retold. I'm sure you remember from your childhood the class activity of getting a number of students to sit in a circle and a short quote would be passed around the circle from person to person. In the end the quote ends up distorted, even when people are trying to preserve it exactly. Point in case, a couple of weeks ago Phil did not say bc would be 1000+ titles, he said they were "aiming" for bc of 1000+ titles.

Is 1200+ hard to belive? Actually it is. The PS1 and PS2 are both pretty complex pieces of hardware. Emulating even 90% of what they do in software is not a easy job. Just take a look at most of the nintendo64 emulators. They have been in development for years and still are quite imperfect.

However, the release of the PS3 in Europe is pretty close, and as I do not live in Europe or want a PS3(yet), it really makes no difference to me if it is true or not. What I care about is the spread of FUD and lies. In my book misquoting is a form of a lie.

Here is the exact quote..
Harrison would not be drawn on specific PS2 titles which will be playable on PS3 on March 23, but it seems the only problem we will have is deciding which ones to play: “The situation is changing every day, but on March 23, we expect the list to include over 1,000 PS2 titles.” That enough for you?


How is 1200 not "over 1,000"? It wouldn't be a surprise if he had a more specific number as the firmware comes closer to release. And it just so happens that he confirmed the number at a later date.

I'm not sure why you are trying to spin that. Why do you even think it's a misquote? They were there at the actual event, and more than one site has reported the same number.