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kam03
04-13-07, 08:18 PM
AMD is well on its way to releasing the chip it has dubbed the "Core 2 Duo killer", probably Q3-4 2007, and now has decided to reveal exactly how its K10 "Barcelona" chip plans to make that kill.

The first point AMD stress is that moving to the new K10 using Socket F will only need update the BIOS while both desktop and notebook Barcelona versions will be released.

Technically, Barcelona will be able to deliver 4 Floating Points per clock cycle and will feature an increased buffer while all four cores will carry 512 KB of L1 and an L2 cache and all cores will share the 2 MBs of the L3 cache. According to AMD's European technical director, Guiseppe Amato, the main advantage of the new microprocessor compared to Intel's design is AMD's memory connect design.

This information comes from AMD as Intel prepares the ground for its Developer Forum in Beijing next week. If AMD stick to their usual strategy expect more Barcelona information to be unveiled as the Intel event approaches.

Link: http://server1.megagames.com/news/html/hardware/amdunveilsk10-barcelonadetails.shtml

Arioch
04-13-07, 09:03 PM
It would be nice to see AMD release a great CPU again but I won't be changing out my motherboard for a couple years, especially since I got a QX6700 that should be good for a while.

Madpistol
04-14-07, 12:39 AM
It would be nice to see AMD release a great CPU again but I won't be changing out my motherboard for a couple years, especially since I got a QX6700 that should be good for a while.

Have to agree with you. If it's that good that it's worth overhauling an already awesome system, then start saving your pennies. I would like to see some benchmarks though.

I remember when I saw the initial benchmarks for "Conroe" as it was called against an FX-60, and I swear I almost wet myself... That was definately a "I know what I want my next system to be" moment. :)

Maverickman
04-14-07, 11:01 PM
Barcelona may be faster than the current Core2 CPUs, but Intel won't be sitting still either as the new Peryn CPUs will be coming out with the 1333MHz system bus as well as integrated memory controller. Also, we'll see Core2 CPUs running well in excess of 3GHz, and Intel will also have new Quad-core CPUs out. Man, competition is great!!!!:captnkill:

Xion X2
04-14-07, 11:07 PM
The first point AMD stress is that moving to the new K10 using Socket F will only need update the BIOS while both desktop and notebook Barcelona versions will be released.

Maybe I'm having a blonde moment, but this statement is confusing the hell outta me. What the heck is this trying to say? Can't be that Socket F will work on an AM2 board w/ a BIOS update.... right? The thought seems too stupid to even verbalize, but how else can you take it?

Sazar
04-14-07, 11:07 PM
Barcelona may be faster than the current Core2 CPUs, but Intel won't be sitting still either as the new Peryn CPUs will be coming out with the 1333MHz system bus as well as integrated memory controller. Also, we'll see Core2 CPUs running well in excess of 3GHz, and Intel will also have new Quad-core CPUs out. Man, competition is great!!!!:captnkill:

You mean nehalem will have an integrated memory controller.

And yes, I can't wait for the summer :)

superklye
04-14-07, 11:15 PM
Maybe I'm having a blonde moment, but this statement is confusing the hell outta me. What the heck is this trying to say? Can't be that Socket F will work on an AM2 board w/ a BIOS update.... right? The thought seems too stupid to even verbalize, but how else can you take it?
Yeah, I was thinking the same thing but I just assumed it was a massive typo.

Socket F is what...1204 pins?

Sazar
04-14-07, 11:17 PM
1207 pins.

Should be pin-compatible therefore with Barcelona.

Don't know about what will be required and what boards are certified ready to work with Barcelona's requirements.

Amuro
04-14-07, 11:41 PM
Barcelona may be faster than the current Core2 CPUs, but Intel won't be sitting still either as the new Peryn CPUs will be coming out with the 1333MHz system bus as well as integrated memory controller. Also, we'll see Core2 CPUs running well in excess of 3GHz, and Intel will also have new Quad-core CPUs out. Man, competition is great!!!!:captnkill:

But Intel won't have a native quad core till mid 2008 maybe. The first Penryn and Nehalem quad cores will be 2 dual cores packed together.

JayK
04-14-07, 11:53 PM
Maybe I'm having a blonde moment, but this statement is confusing the hell outta me. What the heck is this trying to say? Can't be that Socket F will work on an AM2 board w/ a BIOS update.... right? The thought seems too stupid to even verbalize, but how else can you take it?


The way I'm reading it is that the K10 in socket F will only need a BIOS update. And then also they will be releasing socket AM2 versions for the desktop. And they will release a notebook version as well. I just think they used very poor structure in that sentence.

My 2 cents, take it as you will. :)

Viral
04-15-07, 12:49 AM
K10 is releasing for Socket F first, then it will move onto the desktop (and notebook) sector where it will use Socket AM2+. AM2+ will be pin compatible with socket AM2 and you will be able to use K10 CPU's made for the AM2+ socket in AM2 boards, but you will not be able to use HT3.0. Time will tell how much that will actually matter, though.

Xion X2
04-15-07, 01:10 AM
K10 is releasing for Socket F first, then it will move onto the desktop (and notebook) sector where it will use Socket AM2+. AM2+ will be pin compatible with socket AM2 and you will be able to use K10 CPU's made for the AM2+ socket in AM2 boards, but you will not be able to use HT3.0. Time will tell how much that will actually matter, though.

What is socket F on, then, if it's not for a desktop or notebook?

$n][pErMan
04-15-07, 02:07 AM
AHhhh ... so many new things so fast ... so much to waste money on! :D :p

jAkUp
04-15-07, 02:38 AM
[pErMan']AHhhh ... so many new things so fast ... so much to waste money on! :D :p

Computer hardware is never a waste of money :)

Viral
04-15-07, 02:46 AM
What is socket F on, then, if it's not for a desktop or notebook?

It's for workstations and servers ie, Opteron based. Nothing stopping you from making a gaming pc using socket F, though.

Dazz
04-15-07, 05:15 AM
K10 is releasing for Socket F first, then it will move onto the desktop (and notebook) sector where it will use Socket AM2+. AM2+ will be pin compatible with socket AM2 and you will be able to use K10 CPU's made for the AM2+ socket in AM2 boards, but you will not be able to use HT3.0. Time will tell how much that will actually matter, though.
Spot on the FX will be out first for the 1207pin board then will go mainstream to socket AM2+ which is backward compatible with socket AM2 but some features and performance will be disabled but at least you won't have to overhual the whole system at once :)

Xion X2
04-15-07, 10:20 AM
Servers, d'oh. How could I forget them; the Opty's have always been classified as a server processor.


Barcelona is the Workstation/Server CPU. Agena(-FX) will be the Desktop version. Both should be compatible with current boards.

Ok, so if I understand this right, socket F will be released on a special server-based motherboard with Hyper-Transport 3.0 but will also be released AM2-compatible later on, but with Hyper Transport 1.0. Is this right?

Sounds like a disadvantage to me if it can't use the advanced memory controller techniques that HT 3.0 would bring to the table.

Redeemed
04-15-07, 03:11 PM
Yes you'll need a AM2+ board for stuff like the new energy saving features or HT 3.0.

Correct.

In short Barcelona will be for Opterons and on the Socket F platform only. Then the desktop variant will be released for socket AM2+ later this year. AM2+ procs will be backwards compatible with current AM2 motherboards. If you use an AM2+ proc in an AM2 mobo, you will go without HT3.0 and some other new features (such as independant power planes and what not). But, if running an AM2+ proc on an AM2+ mobo, you will be able to make use of all the new features. ;)

ViN86
04-15-07, 04:01 PM
if this turns out true, kind of makes me glad i held off on an upgrade.

only thing that pisses me off is when Intel moves to DDR3, AMD will be stuck on DDR2 again and they will need an entirely new Core just to support it. however, the fact that they squeeze as much performance as they do due to the integrated memory controller and HT2.0 (soon to be 3.0) is pretty impressive.

Heinz68
04-15-07, 04:19 PM
Barcelona is Opteron server/workstation chip for Socket F ONLY.

AgenaFX is Barcelona version for AMD 4x4 Quad FX Super Gaming Platform (DUAL-Socket F).
Since last year when the 4x4 platform was introduced the new FX line of chips are only for that platform.

Agena is Barcelona version for desktop Socket AM2, AM2+ motherboards. Agena is going to be released later on this year.

I'm sure all the above will need Bios update.

BeHardware (http://www.behardware.com/news/8689/cebit-amd-quad-core-am2-compatibility.html) article about "AMD Quad Core, AM2 compatibility".

Most hardware sites report that the launch of Socket AM3 has been delayed till about mid 2008,
same time as AMD transition to 45nm CPU's, which also means we won't see any AMD's DDR3 supported mobos until that time.

Dangit, it means I'm going to be upgrading before the DDR3 :( or jump on the INTEL (Gorilla) ship :(
Not much to look forward to :)

Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socket_AM3) about the Socket AM3 compability.

Sazar
04-15-07, 04:48 PM
Yah, I am personally salivating over the Agena FX solution :cool:

dual quad cores procs :cool:

That's just folding bliss :D

Sazar
04-15-07, 05:46 PM
lol, true, true :)

But, just think of the raw computing power that can be dedicated :D

I can have 4 or more cores folding @ 90%, I can have 1 or 2 dedicated to media encoding and the rest can be used for whatever else I need them to be used for :D

Pure bliss.

Redeemed
04-16-07, 03:28 AM
True the 8 cores are phenomenal for tasks like that!

Alan Wake was demoed running on a Quad Core- so I'm sure before too much longer 8 cores will be a pheasable setup for gaming.

Saintster
04-16-07, 03:31 AM
Barcelona is Opteron server/workstation chip for Socket F ONLY.

AgenaFX is Barcelona version for AMD 4x4 Quad FX Super Gaming Platform (DUAL-Socket F).
Since last year when the 4x4 platform was introduced the new FX line of chips are only for that platform.

Agena is Barcelona version for desktop Socket AM2, AM2+ motherboards. Agena is going to be released later on this year.

I'm sure all the above will need Bios update.

BeHardware (http://www.behardware.com/news/8689/cebit-amd-quad-core-am2-compatibility.html) article about "AMD Quad Core, AM2 compatibility".

Most hardware sites report that the launch of Socket AM3 has been delayed till about mid 2008,
same time as AMD transition to 45nm CPU's, which also means we won't see any AMD's DDR3 supported mobos until that time.

Dangit, it means I'm going to be upgrading before the DDR3 :( or jump on the INTEL (Gorilla) ship :(
Not much to look forward to :)

Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socket_AM3) about the Socket AM3 compability.

I'm going to try and hold out until mid 2008 to do a total system upgrade.Pretty much skip ddr 2 and move onto ddr3.

Redeemed
04-16-07, 05:07 AM
I'm going to try and hold out until mid 2008 to do a total system upgrade.Pretty much skip ddr 2 and move onto ddr3.

This is probably a good idea.

I've been strongly considering getting a new rig. But really, this Opty185 with dual 8800GTSs is super fast as is. I mean the highest resolution I game at is 1920x1440- and since I'm using a CRT I can always lower it if games become too stressful (of just lower the AA instead).

About when should we expect to see DDR3?