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jcrox
04-23-07, 05:16 PM
http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=39095

I know, I know...its the Inq but really. It would be incredibly nice to run DX10 games on XP and tell MS to stick their bloated - DRM infected - pretty wrapping paper- of an OS right up their rear end. Or..eke! DX10 on linux :smoking:

nekrosoft13
04-23-07, 05:19 PM
BS

ViN86
04-23-07, 05:49 PM
im calling BS til i see it in action.

yes, im a skeptic.

|MaguS|
04-23-07, 08:46 PM
ROFL

jcrox
04-23-07, 08:46 PM
I'll have to look around and see if I can find it again. There have been people who have made claims that not only would it be possible to have DX10 on XP, it wouldn't even require the type of wrapper thats being discussed in that article.

You don't really think that it's beyond MS to state a "fact" that would essentially boost the sales of one of their newer products do you?

I'm remaining skeptical myself...but I am at the same time wishing for it to be true...I hate Vista

8800gtsfan
04-23-07, 09:39 PM
I believe MS is full of BS that XP cannot run DX10. I too have too many problems with Vista and would prefer to be able to run DX10 in XP.

|MaguS|
04-23-07, 09:40 PM
It's not that it can't run it but its rather that Vista is built around it and it built around vistas driver model.

Shamrock
04-23-07, 11:02 PM
This guy's blog here:

http://alkyproject.blogspot.com/

The project here:

http://www.fallingleafsystems.com/

It's a wrapper, much like there was a glide wrapper long time ago. I really hope this blossoms...Playing C&C3 in Linux would be nice :D

pkirby11
04-23-07, 11:26 PM
Do you really think this will work and if it does work do you think it will work well. I'm sure if DX10 or DX9 for that matter were so easy to reverse engineer and make readilly available for Linux and such it would have already been done.

If it's to good to be true then it probably is. You really think MS is going to let some schmuck do this any ways, there going to slap a lawsuit on this guy so fast he won't be able to sit for a year. I highly doubt this is as good as it sounds and will probably either bomb or work like crap. You all have fun with your crappy DX10 titles on XP while I play them fine on Vista and my 8800GTX or what ever else I get!

DX10 isn't just about Geometry shaders, there is the whole new Driver model it's based upon not to mention Unified shaders and such. What do you think a DX10 games going to do on DX9 hardware? Probably crap it's pants! :D I can't believe anyone would believe this crap.

Shamrock
04-24-07, 01:59 AM
The only thing that might stop this, is a lawsuit.

The only people that have said DX10 was impossible in XP, that I've seen, were from Microsoft.

John Carmack has stated the limitation is artificial for the purposes of pushing vista. From his own mouth.

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=22161

"They're artificially doing that by tying DX10 [DirectX 10] so close it, which is really nothing about the OS. It's a hardware-interface spec. It's an artificial thing that they're doing there.

They're really grasping at straws for reasons to upgrade the operating system. I suspect I could run XP for a great many more years without having a problem with it.

big discussion here:
http://forums.anandtech.com/messageview.aspx?catid=31&threadid=2037179&enterthread=y

LycosV
04-24-07, 03:43 AM
There are two things that will stop this: 1. Lawsuit, 2. Microsoft will just release an update to DirectX that would make the wrapper not work. Look at all the new versions of DirectX 9 we have to install to play the latest games. You don't just need DirectX 9 anymore, you need 9 with (insert month) upgrade.

What follows bellow is my ranting:
What's everyone's problem with Vista. Oh no, Vista drains a few FPS off of my favorite game; frankly get over it. As if the next CPU/GPU combo won't crank out more than the difference. Games ran better in DOS, but we don't use it anymore. Windows has brought us multitasking, plug & play, unified driver models, networking for the masses, DirectX. If you think that here, with your familiar XP is good enough for you, then step aside with those who don't know how to program their VCR's. The technology train isn't stopping and the day it does will be a sad day indeed.

kev13dd
04-24-07, 03:55 AM
There are two things that will stop this: 1. Lawsuit, 2. Microsoft will just release an update to DirectX that would make the wrapper not work. Look at all the new versions of DirectX 9 we have to install to play the latest games. You don't just need DirectX 9 anymore, you need 9 with (insert month) upgrade.

What follows bellow is my ranting:
What's everyone's problem with Vista. Oh no, Vista drains a few FPS off of my favorite game; frankly get over it. As if the next CPU/GPU combo won't crank out more than the difference. Games ran better in DOS, but we don't use it anymore. Windows has brought us multitasking, plug & play, unified driver models, networking for the masses, DirectX. If you think that here, with your familiar XP is good enough for you, then step aside with those who don't know how to program their VCR's. The technology train isn't stopping and the day it does will be a sad day indeed.
Driver support? Cost? Required hardware upgrades? Bugs?

There are a lot of reasons people are against Vista more than just "takes framerate from game I'm playing". My two biggest are cost and driver support. A ton of games still won't work in Vista

K

ASUSEN7900GTX
04-24-07, 03:59 AM
well Ms is going out stron against piracy and is in SP1 put alot of crap making youre computer well not as you want it to be.

DRM, HRm Decryp validate everything i guess all the games you wanna play will need to be validated so taht they arenīt illegal

besides taht you will need HDMI/HDCP compaitble hardware or you wanoīt be able to watch HD material properly or perhaps not at all

who the heck wantīs that kinda OS no me thatīs for sure

ASUSEN7900GTX
04-24-07, 04:07 AM
besides unified driver support is out

vista demands a uniqe code for the the specific card you have

ohh man HFS

it means prably a codec for HDMI SPDI-F all these separate codecs for all singals out-put as in-put is a effect of DRM

they are making youre computer theirs controlling everything in it cards chipsets ciruits everything is going to be checked if it isnīt correct no go

what heck who need Vista when i can have Xp Linux take youre pick.

if this is what it takes to play crysis on DX10 all the other DX10 games

then iīd rather be without DX10 i donīt want MS to snoop around in my computer even if it contains nothing but still itīs my computer my privacy naa to heck with MS

Wolfhound
04-24-07, 06:08 AM
:bs:

NaitoSan
04-24-07, 06:14 AM
I'm glad I'm one of people that has Vista working flawless. I love Vista! :) And I doubt DX10 will comie out for XP.

superklye
04-24-07, 07:30 AM
Well...isn't MS bringing Aero and a few other Vista-only "enhancements" to XP at some point?

nekrosoft13
04-24-07, 08:17 AM
Well...isn't MS bringing Aero and a few other Vista-only "enhancements" to XP at some point?

no, never

nekrosoft13
04-24-07, 08:23 AM
The only thing that might stop this, is a lawsuit.

The only people that have said DX10 was impossible in XP, that I've seen, were from Microsoft.



of course DX10 would be possible on XP, but not in its current phase.

you have to take few things in to play

1) DX10 is wrapped around Vista core system which is different then xp

2) for DX10 to work on XP, you also gonna need a driver, neither ati or nvidia will make a dx10 driver for XP

3) vista driver can't be ported/forced on XP because of different driver model.

4) all this wrapper will do(if it actually works) is emulate dx10 on dx9 hardware, just like glide wrappers used to do couple years ago.

5) did i mention the new driver model?

superklye
04-24-07, 09:59 AM
no, never
You sure about that? I distinctly remember reading somewhere back when all the Longhorn betas were hot **** WinFS (before it was canned) was coming to XP along with Aero and a few other of Vista's interface enhancements. I'm trying to find a link...

EDIT: Here we go...

http://www.microsoft-watch.com/content/operating_systems/winfs_to_be_available_on_windows_xp.html

Microsoft decided to back-port both Avalon and Indigo to older versions of Windows — Windows XP and Windows Server 2003 — in order to maintain backward compatibility and help seed the application-development market, officials said. But it made no such promises for WinFS, which resulted in many developer, customer and industry-watcher questions about WinFS' fate.

nekrosoft13
04-24-07, 10:11 AM
time passes, things change

superklye
04-24-07, 10:28 AM
time passes, things change
Well that's what I was asking. I haven't heard anything about those NOT coming to XP and they were slated to, so "never" isn't really valid.

Tygerwoody
04-24-07, 10:35 AM
I'll believe it when i see it. These rumors happen at least once a month and eventually fade away. I have faith this rumor(as well as this thread) will fade away shortly. If you want Direct X 10 you will have to buy Windows Vista. Period.

Zelda_fan
04-24-07, 11:02 AM
I know, I know...its the Inq but really. It would be incredibly nice to run DX10 games on XP and tell MS to stick their bloated - DRM infected - pretty wrapping paper- of an OS right up their rear end. Or..eke! DX10 on linux :smoking:

Seeing that MS created DX10 and has exclusive rights to do with it whatever they want, I seriously doubt they are going to "tell MS to stick their bloated - DRM infected - pretty wrapping paper- of an OS right up their rear end."

ASUSEN7900GTX
04-24-07, 11:10 AM
vista shall never operate my computer period.

unless they make it less "big brotherish" control freaks MS can go and stick their head where the sun dosenīt shine and smell the........


why am i so angry at MS well read about vista after the SP1 in a swedish comp magazine man you should see what they are implementing you canīt do anything without having all drivers codecs I/O stuff validated or needing a special driver for everything i mean chipsets cards pci-e slots everything.

so no Vista for me the iīd rather be without a computer

and no game can make me mind change DX10 or not