Thinking of trying Linux...

[911medic]

...but I have one big hangup: gaming.

Linux (especially Ubuntu, which intrigues me) has been getting a lot of press lately, and I'm interested in it as an alternative to Windows. It's free, it's different, it sounds so configurable.

But--gaming. One of my main uses for both my laptop and desktop is gaming. I have a fairly extensive catalog of (relatively) current games, all designed for Windows.

I understand a limited number of games get ported to Linux, but to me, this implies two things:

1) Games that will run on Linux are limited in number and often only ported to Linux significantly later (sometimes years) than they're available for Windows,

2) My current catalog will be useless on a Linux system.

I am a total newbie here. Are my concerns justified? I've switched from MS Office to OpenOffice, I use free AVG antivirus and free ZoneAlarm firewall (behind a hardware router firewall); I'd like to try what sounds like a great free operating system, which is maturing more and more.

But my gaming...I need my gaming... :D

[911medic]

*crickets chirping*

I'll take this to mean that yes, my concerns are justified.

Maybe someday...

[wnd]

Yes, you are right. Currently, most games get never ported to GNU/Linux. Those that do, well, you never know when they come out. While Linux executable for UT2004 was released on the CD/DVD, Linux client for Neverwinter Nights was delayed for a year.

Cedega (http://www.transgaming.com/index.php?module=ContentExpress&file=index&func=display&ceid=29) and Wine (http://www.winehq.org/) can help with some titles, but both run limited selection of games, and most of them have issues. For Cedega, see http://cedegawiki.sweetleafstudios.com/wiki/Main_Page. There's also a list of games at WineHQ.

If you spend most of your time playing games, GNU/Linux probably isn't for you -- at least not yet. Personally, I use Linux for everything, but occasionally boot to Windows to play games I cannot run otherwise.

[911medic]

Thanks for replying.

Hopefully someday things will be different. Not that I have problems with Windows, but I like alternatives.

[atriq]

Here's a couple places you may find helpful:

Wine Application DB (http://appdb.winehq.org/) - Lists detailed information if/how windows applications run via wine.
Linux-Gamers (http://linux-gamers.net) - Self-Explanitory, also includes tutorials on installing many games, native and wine'd.

[grey_1]

Here's a couple places you may find helpful:

Wine Application DB (http://appdb.winehq.org/) - Lists detailed information if/how windows applications run via wine.
Linux-Gamers (http://linux-gamers.net) - Self-Explanitory, also includes tutorials on installing many games, native and wine'd.
Agreed on these. Honestly though, there are so many distros with so many different kernels..even a great tweak may not work well sometimes.

If you do try linux out I would highly reccomend a debian based distro like Ubuntu. Learn some of the quirks and spend time chatting Ubuntus user forums. I think you'll like it.

[evilghost]

The native Linux client for Quake4 was released 15 days after the release of the game; not really that bad (but I had to wait, ugh).

AFAIK icculus does most of the porting and did so for the UT2004 game as well, http://www.icculus.org

What does your current catalog look like?

[911medic]

Here's a couple places you may find helpful:

Wine Application DB (http://appdb.winehq.org/) - Lists detailed information if/how windows applications run via wine.
Linux-Gamers (http://linux-gamers.net) - Self-Explanitory, also includes tutorials on installing many games, native and wine'd.Thanks...I've taken a look at Wine, and I think it was over at Linux-Gamers that I was reading a thread about how slow/infrequent it was that games got ported to Linux.

[911medic]

Agreed on these. Honestly though, there are so many distros with so many different kernels..even a great tweak may not work well sometimes.

If you do try linux out I would highly reccomend a debian based distro like Ubuntu. Learn some of the quirks and spend time chatting Ubuntus user forums. I think you'll like it.Yeah, Ubuntu was what I was considering. I don't mind doing some tweaking, but to take the time and effort only to have it come up short on gaming would be a big drawback for me.

[911medic]

The native Linux client for Quake4 was released 15 days after the release of the game; not really that bad (but I had to wait, ugh).

AFAIK icculus does most of the porting and did so for the UT2004 game as well, http://www.icculus.org

What does your current catalog look like?Well, the ones I'm currently playing are HL2, STALKER, FarCry, and FEAR/Extraction Point. Occasionally some Quake4 or UT2004. I rarely play Doom3 & Call of Duty 2, and I have a variety of older games that I don't play anymore (or at least very rarely).

[Sazar]

*crickets chirping*

I'll take this to mean that yes, my concerns are justified.

Maybe someday...

I have a dual boot ubuntu/vista ultimate box.

I've spent about 2 days with ubuntu so far. I just don't have time to keep fiddling round with stuff to make it work when Vista has everything just working for me without me doing anything at all (and believe me, I have tweaked vista a fair bit by now).

Ubuntu is fast and seems stable enough. Also isn't bad for features just after I install the bugger but there are some things I just dont' want to have to deal with.

I am planning on spending some dedicated time every weekend to get more understanding of the o/s and enjoy it, but it really depends on how much patience I have.

[911medic]

I have a dual boot ubuntu/vista ultimate box.

I've spent about 2 days with ubuntu so far. I just don't have time to keep fiddling round with stuff to make it work when Vista has everything just working for me without me doing anything at all (and believe me, I have tweaked vista a fair bit by now).

Ubuntu is fast and seems stable enough. Also isn't bad for features just after I install the bugger but there are some things I just dont' want to have to deal with.

I am planning on spending some dedicated time every weekend to get more understanding of the o/s and enjoy it, but it really depends on how much patience I have.That's what I'm afraid of. I'll spend copious amounts of time tweaking it, only to go, "Windows was working just as well for me, why did I just go through all this?"

But I really would like a good alternative. And the fact that it's free is, of course, very alluring. The latest builds of Ubuntu seem more user-friendly for someone coming from Windows, if only the gaming were there as robustly as it is in Windows.

I'm also a little leery of dual-booting. I've F'd up my MBR on my own before, and I've heard a few horror stories regarding users who've had dual-boot systems and decided to just go back to Windows, and trying to un-do the dual-boot borked their PCs. That would suck.

[grey_1]

That's what I'm afraid of. I'll spend copious amounts of time tweaking it, only to go, "Windows was working just as well for me, why did I just go through all this?"

But I really would like a good alternative. And the fact that it's free is, of course, very alluring. The latest builds of Ubuntu seem more user-friendly for someone coming from Windows, if only the gaming were there as robustly as it is in Windows.

I'm also a little leery of dual-booting. I've F'd up my MBR on my own before, and I've heard a few horror stories regarding users who've had dual-boot systems and decided to just go back to Windows, and trying to un-do the dual-boot borked their PCs. That would suck.
I always unplug my windows hdd while installing linux and visa versa. Then change from within the bios. It only takes a second or to longer and saves me from having to go through that repairing the mbr if I bork something.

[911medic]

I always unplug my windows hdd while installing linux and visa versa. Then change from within the bios. It only takes a second or to longer and saves me from having to go through that repairing the mbr if I bork something.
So, you mean you unplug the Windows HDD just for the install, then change the boot order in the BIOS? Or do you use the "list of operating systems" menu on boot up to select which OS to boot? I'm a bit confused (and have never dual-booted before, so a total noob).

[grey_1]

So, you mean you unplug the Windows HDD just for the install, then change the boot order in the BIOS? Or do you use the "list of operating systems" menu on boot up to select which OS to boot? I'm a bit confused (and have never dual-booted before, so a total noob).
Yes. If you install with both hdds hooked up GRUB (linux boot loader) will alter wins mbr. This is fine if your pretty sure you'll leave it that way. You'll have a nice boot screen come up, you can edit it to have whichever OS you want boot by default.

My reason is only that I love to try new distros, and can't buy a bunch of extra hdd space atm. So I unplug wins hdd, install linux, then plug wins back in. It only takes a sec to boot the one I want from the bios and saves me the trouble of repairing wins mbr if I ruin my linux install.

If your only using one hdd, you won't have a choice obviously. You could only use the boot menu, or make a bootable floppy to boot linux from. Heh, I don't even have a floppy in my rig anymore. :p

[evilghost]

Well, the ones I'm currently playing are HL2, STALKER, FarCry, and FEAR/Extraction Point. Occasionally some Quake4 or UT2004. I rarely play Doom3 & Call of Duty 2, and I have a variety of older games that I don't play anymore (or at least very rarely).

I can speak from personal experience on a few of the games.

UT2004 - Native Linux port, installer on UT2004 CD, no issues.
Quake4 - Native Linux port, http://zerowing.idsoftware.com/linux/quake4/, no issues.
Doom 3 - Native Linux port, http://zerowing.idsoftware.com/linux/doom/, no issues.
FarCry - D3D only, emulation required, 30% performance hit when run through Cedega but does run. It's playable but at the time the intro animation had to be turned off or it would lag.
COD2 - No experience, appears supported by Cedega, http://cedega.com/gamesdb/games/view.mhtml?game_id=4011
HL2 - No experience, suppored by Cedga, http://cedega.com/gamesdb/games/view.mhtml?game_id=3189
STALKER - No experience but I remember at one point hearing something about a native port over at Phoronix but I could be wrong.
FEAR - No experience, supported by Cedega, http://cedega.com/gamesdb/games/view.mhtml?game_id=3984

[evilghost]

If you're going with Ubuntu (which I run) be sure to check out these sites:

http://www.ubuntuguide.org
http://www.ubuntuforums.org

[911medic]

Yes. If you install with both hdds hooked up GRUB (linux boot loader) will alter wins mbr. This is fine if your pretty sure you'll leave it that way. You'll have a nice boot screen come up, you can edit it to have whichever OS you want boot by default.

My reason is only that I love to try new distros, and can't buy a bunch of extra hdd space atm. So I unplug wins hdd, install linux, then plug wins back in. It only takes a sec to boot the one I want from the bios and saves me the trouble of repairing wins mbr if I ruin my linux install.

If your only using one hdd, you won't have a choice obviously. You could only use the boot menu, or make a bootable floppy to boot linux from. Heh, I don't even have a floppy in my rig anymore. :p
Thanks for clarifying. I have 2 HDDs, so I could do that. But I share this computer with my wife (and occasionally kids), and having go into the BIOS at each boot up to choose the OS will not fly (and I don't want them in there anyway--I do enough damage in there myself). EDIT: Or do you mean I could just leave the Windows HDD as the default and only when I want to boot into Linux would I have to enter the BIOS? As I said, I've no experience w/dual booting, so sorry for the perhaps stupid question.

I do have a floppy drive...but jumping through these hoops to try this alternative is sounding less & less appealing.

Maybe I'm not ready yet.

[grey_1]

Thanks for clarifying. I have 2 HDDs, so I could do that. But I share this computer with my wife (and occasionally kids), and having go into the BIOS at each boot up to choose the OS will not fly (and I don't want them in there anyway--I do enough damage in there myself). I do have a floppy drive...but jumping through these hoops to try this alternative is sounding less & less appealing.

Maybe I'm not ready yet.
I know what you mean. That's not a worry for me as I'm the only one on my rig, the girls have their own.

If you do decide to give it a shot, repairing the mbr if you don't like it is very easy.

In XP, boot from cd, select repair option and type "fixmbr" and "fixboot".

I'm not sure the "fixboot" is even needed.

In vista, boot from dvd and select "repair", I think that's what the option says.

Either way..good luck what ever your decision.

[911medic]

I can speak from personal experience on a few of the games.

UT2004 - Native Linux port, installer on UT2004 CD, no issues.
Quake4 - Native Linux port, http://zerowing.idsoftware.com/linux/quake4/, no issues.
Doom 3 - Native Linux port, http://zerowing.idsoftware.com/linux/doom/, no issues.
FarCry - D3D only, emulation required, 30% performance hit when run through Cedega but does run. It's playable but at the time the intro animation had to be turned off or it would lag.
COD2 - No experience, appears supported by Cedega, http://cedega.com/gamesdb/games/view.mhtml?game_id=4011
HL2 - No experience, suppored by Cedga, http://cedega.com/gamesdb/games/view.mhtml?game_id=3189
STALKER - No experience but I remember at one point hearing something about a native port over at Phoronix but I could be wrong.
FEAR - No experience, supported by Cedega, http://cedega.com/gamesdb/games/view.mhtml?game_id=3984Well, that alleviates SOME of my concerns regarding my games library becoming useless, as it appears the Linux versions are free and you use your Windows CDs/DVDs for installation. I was thinking I'd have to re-buy (via download) Linux versions of the games, but this appears to not be the case.

Running the games through Cedega is something I'll have to look into, though. The fact that they're just now touting SM2.0 support is a bit disheartening, however.

Thanks for the Ubuntu links, too.

[911medic]

I know what you mean. That's not a worry for me as I'm the only one on my rig, the girls have their own.

If you do decide to give it a shot, repairing the mbr if you don't like it is very easy.

In XP, boot from cd, select repair option and type "fixmbr" and "fixboot".

I'm not sure the "fixboot" is even needed.

In vista, boot from dvd and select "repair", I think that's what the option says.

Either way..good luck what ever your decision.
I appreciate the advice. I've been through borked-MBR-hell once, so I'm a little gunshy there.

I think I snuck an edit in that post while you were replying:EDIT: Or do you mean I could just leave the Windows HDD as the default and only when I want to boot into Linux would I have to enter the BIOS? As I said, I've no experience w/dual booting, so sorry for the perhaps stupid question.

[grey_1]

WRT your edit - Yes. The only time you would need to access your bios is when you want to boot linux, or switch back to windows. If you were to leave your win hdd as the 1st boot device and not change it for a month you'd never notice a difference.

Fwiw, dual booting this way is extremely painless. Each OS will 'see' the other hdd and OS (although win won't recognize lin) but that's it.

if you were to use the GRUB boot loader, it sets everything up for you, and changing the default hdd is easier than editing a resolution for a game in it's config file.

But here I go getting long-winded. :D

You can install linux the "bios" way, and never have to change a thing til the time you decide to go in. If you don't like it, it's as easy as opening disk management in wiindows and deleting the linux partition.

[911medic]

WRT your edit - Yes. The only time you would need to access your bios is when you want to boot linux, or switch back to windows. If you were to leave your win hdd as the 1st boot device and not change it for a month you'd never notice a difference.

Fwiw, dual booting this way is extremely painless. Each OS will 'see' the other hdd and OS (although win won't recognize lin) but that's it.

if you were to use the GRUB boot loader, it sets everything up for you, and changing the default hdd is easier than editing a resolution for a game in it's config file.

But here I go getting long-winded. :D

You can install linux the "bios" way, and never have to change a thing til the time you decide to go in. If you don't like it, it's as easy as opening disk management in wiindows and deleting the linux partition.I see. Are you able to access files on each HDD? For example, if there are pictures or mp3's on the Windows HDD, will Linux be able to see them (and vice-versa)?

Sorry for all the questions. I appreciate your patience.

[evilghost]

I see. Are you able to access files on each HDD? For example, if there are pictures or mp3's on the Windows HDD, will Linux be able to see them (and vice-versa)?

Sorry for all the questions. I appreciate your patience.

Yes, Linux can see an NTFS drive however, write access to the drive isn't permitted unless you use the NTFS 3g module which enables write support for NTFS.

My Linux system supports these partition types:

Hex code (type L to list codes): l

0 Empty 1e Hidden W95 FAT1 80 Old Minix be Solaris boot
1 FAT12 24 NEC DOS 81 Minix / old Lin bf Solaris
2 XENIX root 39 Plan 9 82 Linux swap / So c1 DRDOS/sec (FAT-
3 XENIX usr 3c PartitionMagic 83 Linux c4 DRDOS/sec (FAT-
4 FAT16 <32M 40 Venix 80286 84 OS/2 hidden C: c6 DRDOS/sec (FAT-
5 Extended 41 PPC PReP Boot 85 Linux extended c7 Syrinx
6 FAT16 42 SFS 86 NTFS volume set da Non-FS data
7 HPFS/NTFS 4d QNX4.x 87 NTFS volume set db CP/M / CTOS / .
8 AIX 4e QNX4.x 2nd part 88 Linux plaintext de Dell Utility
9 AIX bootable 4f QNX4.x 3rd part 8e Linux LVM df BootIt
a OS/2 Boot Manag 50 OnTrack DM 93 Amoeba e1 DOS access
b W95 FAT32 51 OnTrack DM6 Aux 94 Amoeba BBT e3 DOS R/O
c W95 FAT32 (LBA) 52 CP/M 9f BSD/OS e4 SpeedStor
e W95 FAT16 (LBA) 53 OnTrack DM6 Aux a0 IBM Thinkpad hi eb BeOS fs
f W95 Ext'd (LBA) 54 OnTrackDM6 a5 FreeBSD ee EFI GPT
10 OPUS 55 EZ-Drive a6 OpenBSD ef EFI (FAT-12/16/
11 Hidden FAT12 56 Golden Bow a7 NeXTSTEP f0 Linux/PA-RISC b
12 Compaq diagnost 5c Priam Edisk a8 Darwin UFS f1 SpeedStor
14 Hidden FAT16 <3 61 SpeedStor a9 NetBSD f4 SpeedStor
16 Hidden FAT16 63 GNU HURD or Sys ab Darwin boot f2 DOS secondary
17 Hidden HPFS/NTF 64 Novell Netware b7 BSDI fs fd Linux raid auto
18 AST SmartSleep 65 Novell Netware b8 BSDI swap fe LANstep
1b Hidden W95 FAT3 70 DiskSecure Mult bb Boot Wizard hid ff BBT
1c Hidden W95 FAT3 75 PC/IX
Hex code (type L to list codes):

[911medic]

I can speak from personal experience on a few of the games.

UT2004 - Native Linux port, installer on UT2004 CD, no issues.
Quake4 - Native Linux port, http://zerowing.idsoftware.com/linux/quake4/, no issues.
Doom 3 - Native Linux port, http://zerowing.idsoftware.com/linux/doom/, no issues.
FarCry - D3D only, emulation required, 30% performance hit when run through Cedega but does run. It's playable but at the time the intro animation had to be turned off or it would lag.
COD2 - No experience, appears supported by Cedega, http://cedega.com/gamesdb/games/view.mhtml?game_id=4011
HL2 - No experience, suppored by Cedga, http://cedega.com/gamesdb/games/view.mhtml?game_id=3189
STALKER - No experience but I remember at one point hearing something about a native port over at Phoronix but I could be wrong.
FEAR - No experience, supported by Cedega, http://cedega.com/gamesdb/games/view.mhtml?game_id=3984I was just looking at the Cedega site a little more thoroughly and realized you have to pay to subscribe to it. :(

Wife: Why are you paying for this?
911medic: Because you have to, to play these games on this OS.
Wife: Don't they work just fine on Windows?
911medic: Ummm...yeah, but...
Wife: :rolleyes: [walks away, not to be seen naked again by 911medic for at least 2 weeks]