Whats better: AMD or P4?.....

[Matthius]

okay, im an idiot when it comes to comparing these 2 together. and can someone explain which is faster for games like bf1942 (i know it doesn't really matter on the game) is an AMD 2200XP faster? or a P42.2GHZ?

[sbp]

Either would be good.

[jAkUp]

im a pentium fanboy :) but they are both good... amds run hotter and are more delicate... but usually have more raw power... intel's are not as delicate... and run cooler... in some cases they are more stable

[woz_mann]

amd's are no longer hotter with the thoroughbred B or Barton chips. Many of these chips runs well under 40 degrees C. Just because AMD's many run a few C warmer, they are not less stable. AMD's are able to withastand more heat then P4's.

My advice is to find reviews on the 2 chips that compare them against each other and buy the faster/cheaper of the 2.

[LORD-eX-Bu]

that would be a lie;)

AMD is no longer costs less than Intel processors, in some cases(at least on pricewatch) you can see the P4 3.06 Ghz costing less than the AMD XP3000+. Both are good, I'd just say take into account costs for the proc and mobo, as well as other stuff like HSF.

I prefer P4 for the heatspreader(no crushing of the cores :D) and because the HSF is easier to install;)

[Nemesis]

I'm currently at a crossroads as far as AMD v P4. I've got the money for either an XP3000 Barton with nForce 2, or a P4 800MHz FSB 3GHz, with Canterwood. Decisions!
I'm currently leaning towards the P4, as I believe Hyperthreading could become quite widely supported over the lifetime of my purchase (2 Yrs). Only the reviews will tell...

[Matthius]

but whats with amd 3000+ xp's running at around 2. something ghz?? how come if you have an amd running at 1.7ghz and a p4 1.7 ghz, amd's kick the living crap out of it...i just dont get how the difference between mhz can be so...big and have roughly the same power! i know 3000xp's run at less than 2.4ghz. can anyone explain in a more technical sense why this is?

[Nemesis]

In short, AMD Athlons have always done more work per clock cycle than an equivalently clocked P4. This is due to differences in the architecture of the processors. I don't know the exact numbers off the top of my head, but the P4 has a longer pipeline than the Athlon, which is good for streaming multimedia apps, but not so good for games, etc. Because of this, the P4 was always designed to have a high clock speed, in order to get good performance.

I'm sure someone who's more knowledgeable than me can fill in the gaps...;)

[Matthius]

ah, i get it better now. thanks for that. but when u say pipeline and stuff like that, do you mean physically? like distance that stuff has to travel? or is it to do with something else? cause sometimes i get confused with physical stuff and....whats it called? umm...oh yeah...soft.......ware....

[Nemesis]

I'm getting out of my depth now! Pipeline... as far as I've made out, they are part of the CPU's architecture, and consist of a number of stages. The P4 has an architecture called "Netburst" which has a 20 stage pipeline, and the Athlon has a ten stage pipeline. If the CPU's branch prediction is wrong, then there is more to re-try in the P4's pipeline than the Athlon's.

That's all I know, there is an Internet full of great websites that will go into as much detail as you like, so if you want more info, get Googling!

Me, I need a cup of tea :D

[RobHague]

Originally posted by Matthius
okay, im an idiot when it comes to comparing these 2 together. and can someone explain which is faster for games like bf1942 (i know it doesn't really matter on the game) is an AMD 2200XP faster? or a P42.2GHZ?

Ive seen benchmarks that put the 2.2Ghz XP ahead of even the 2.4Ghz P4 in some tests (mainly games) so id go AMD.

Originally posted by Matthius
but whats with amd 3000+ xp's running at around 2. something ghz?? how come if you have an amd running at 1.7ghz and a p4 1.7 ghz, amd's kick the living crap out of it...i just dont get how the difference between mhz can be so...big and have roughly the same power! i know 3000xp's run at less than 2.4ghz. can anyone explain in a more technical sense why this is?

Because the AMD CPU's can do more in a single clock cycle than the P4. The P4 orignally was pretty weak, until the clock speeds started ramping up to what they are today. At the time of the P4's launch (the original ones) even the P3's could outperform the P4 at some tasks.

[Smokey]

Im Athlon all the way when it comes to gaming, although this is from THG and some of you wont really care much for it, I still think its a very good set of benchmarks.

http://www6.tomshardware.com/graphic/20021218/vgacharts-02.html#aquanox

[StealthHawk]

if a comparable Athlon system is cheaper than a Pentium4 system, then go Athlon. you won't be sorry.

performance should be pretty comparable between the two, with the Athlon taking the lead in games.

[CaptNKILL]

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?catalog=343&DEPA=1&submit=property&mfrcode=0&propertycode=&propertycodevalue=4159,3928

If you can buy from NewEgg, then go AMD. Hands down.

That XP 2400+ is only $130 OEM or $135 Retail (retail comes with heatsink and warranty). The closest priced P4 (besides the 1.7Ghz) probably isnt any faster and costs more.

GET THE ATHLON XP 2400+!!!!!!!!

Im sure there isnt anything wrong with P4s, but if you want a LOT for a LITTLE, get the XP 2400+. I bet if you had a 2400+ system next to a P4 3ghz or an XP3000+, you wouldnt notice the difference. Sure its a little faster, but for an extra 400-500 bucks, is it worth a few fps? You could get a good NForce2 mobo and a Radeon 9700 Pro for that price!

Get the 2400+, you wont regret it.

Of course, if you really want to be a bargain hunter, get a XP1700+ and overclock it. The TBred B core 1700s can get up to 2Ghz on air cooling (thats 2400+ speed) for a measly 50 bucks!

www.excaliberpc.com is where I got mine. They guarantee the exact chip you get so you can be sure it'l overclock. Make sure you get a good mobo tho, my mobo sucks for OCing so I havent even touched the potential of this thing.

My advice:
2400+ Retail for $135 from NewEgg
or
1700+ OEM for ~$60 from excaliberPC or $51 from NewEgg (although newegg doesnt guarantee which chip you get)


EDIT: If you are considering OCing and are still willing to spend some $$$, it looks like the 2500+ is a real champ. Its got 512Kb L2 cache like the 3000+ and it has a 333fsb. Lots of people are getting it to 2.3Ghz on air cooling and that would easily blow away the 3000+. At newegg, that CPU is $170 OEM. Id recomend that too if you dont mind spending the extra bucks and having to OC for more speed (its clocked 200mhz slower than the 2400).

[VeritechK7]

Both processors are good. But I think P4 in a landslide because of its ability to scale [talks of 200MHz bus although amd isn't too far behind in this]. On top of that SSE2 is getting more widespread thereby improving the pentium 4 a good amount. We've all seen w/o it, it was pretty subpar. But i think since moving to a 133Mhz bus that the pentium 4 was able to challenge amd. Although since the 166Mhz XP's came out it has become an interesting battle.. .

[VeritechK7]

yeah and the best platform for the p4 [850E w/ 1066 RDRAM] as far as gaming is concened is rather pricey

[ReDeeMeR]

Yup, XP is by far better bang for the buck ofr gaming and P4 is better for 3D Apps, although AMD is faster in Photoshop and such(From my personal experience).

I know that there are place where AMD's are dirt cheap(like where I live), so only fanboys would buy P4, but there are places where P4 are in the same price range or even cheaper.

[borntosoul]

well they both have their strengths but one thing is for sure,pentium 4s really only get competive (unless you overclock)with athlons when they are around 2400 mhz and above, anything below that and the athlons are too strong.keep in mind that the new p4s will have an 800mhz fsb and HP support and theyre comin out this april,plus at 2400mhz and above their isnt really a big price difference between amd and intel, i think amd has better value at low end though(below 2200).
as others have said before me its really what you are using it for that counts the most

[ReDeeMeR]

Dont forget 400mhz Barton :D
And Athlon64bit

[RobHague]

I saw some benchies for the new 800mhz FSB for the P4 - it gave a 4% increase max in games... make of that what you will.

[VeritechK7]

well when it comes to games clock rate matters more than high fsb which would be good for memory intensive applications and games [there aren't a great number of these but there are some of these nonetheless]

[saturnotaku]

Originally posted by CaptNKILL
GET THE ATHLON XP 2400+!!!!!!!!

That's what I did. The one I got from Newegg was downclocked from a 2700+ processor. That's the speed I'm running at right now, right down to the 333 MHz fsb. I just upped my voltages slightly and so far it's been quite solid and not running any hotter than my Palomino AthlonXP 1800+. My next step is to try for a 400 fsb since I'm using DDR400 memory.

I seriously would have bought a Pentium 4 if I could have found a board with the features I wanted (8x AGP, ATA-RAID, onboard NIC, etc) that wouldn't have cost me an arm and a leg. But as it stands right now, my nForce2/AthlonXP is a pretty tough combo to beat in the price/performance arena.

[fastguy94416]

Right now I have all the stuff like sound and lan in pci cards, its a buggar finding mobos that don't have all that onboard stuff

[VeritechK7]

hey saturnotaku, have you checked out what the divider is when trying to move to a 200MHz bus (400 DDR)? IF it's decent enough i might hold off of waiting for the v2.0 of the NF7-S and get the 1.2 instead

[saturnotaku]

Originally posted by VeritechK7
hey saturnotaku, have you checked out what the divider is when trying to move to a 200MHz bus (400 DDR)? IF it's decent enough i might hold off of waiting for the v2.0 of the NF7-S and get the 1.2 instead

I'll have to double check, but I think I can get it as low as 11.5. IIRC, version 1.2 of the NF7-S was supposed to be v. 2.0. I'm quite confident my processor can do a 200 MHz fsb, it's going to be a matter of how far I can push the multiplier without frying the CPU or whatnot.