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six_storm
07-31-07, 04:41 PM
Well, I finally got a copy of Vista Ultimate x64, got it installed and tried a few apps for fun. Here are my thoughts. I guess the 64-bit version is supposed to be faster than the 32-bit version, but really, it's slower. And it also maxes out my PC 25% more than 32-bit did. WTF? So what about the apps? I didn't have any problems installing/using iTunes, Firefox, IE or Office . . . but the load and installation times were terrible. Why does it take me 10 minutes (literally) just to install iTunes? I know you would say that iTunes is a POS program but it works fine for me so back off.

Why is the 64-bit version slower than the 32-bit? Is my PC just not up to par? Do you have to have a WEI rating of 100 for it to get going?

I'm leaving it on my extra hard drive for testing purposes but I think I'll just stick with the 32-bit for when I have to use Windows.

Monolyth
07-31-07, 05:09 PM
1GB of ram is not enough for Vista, other then that the rest of your system should be alright. 2GB's is the recommended.

radekhulan
07-31-07, 05:10 PM
1GB is too little RAM for Vista x64. It has both x64 kernel and x86 (32bit) layer loaded in memory, thus takes more space in RAM. If you have old computer with only 1GB of RAM, you should stay with Windows XP SP2, with 2GB RAM I recommend Vista x86, and with 4GB and more Vista x64. RAM is so cheap anyway...

Apps that matter to me (Apache, MySQL, PHP) are significantly faster on x64.

Regarding iTunes installation - this is an example of how bad Apple apps are, do not blame Microsoft for Apple faults ;)

six_storm
07-31-07, 05:16 PM
1GB is too little RAM for Vista x64. It has both x64 kernel and x86 (32bit) layer loaded in memory, thus takes more space in RAM. If you have old computer with only 1GB of RAM, you should stay with Windows XP SP2, with 2GB RAM I recommend Vista x86, and with 4GB and more Vista x64. RAM is so cheap anyway...

Apps that matter to me (Apache, MySQL, PHP) are significantly faster on x64.

Regarding iTunes installation - this is an example of how bad Apple apps are, do not blame Microsoft for Apple faults ;)

I agree that my PC isn't up to par (don't have $2K to blow on a rig right now). iTunes installs pretty fast on Vista 32-bit though and works pretty darn good.

radekhulan
07-31-07, 05:20 PM
I agree that my PC isn't up to par (don't have $2K to blow on a rig right now). iTunes installs pretty fast on Vista 32-bit though and works pretty darn good.

iTunes is the slowest app I have ever used on my quadcore with 4GB of RAM. Had an iPod 60GB, and before installing RockBox on it, I wanted to through it into the wastebin. Anyway, Apple SW is not compatible with Vista x64 (at least iTunes for iPhone do not work), and this is Apple only error. The best way is to avoid anything from Apple (QuickTime, iTunes, Safari).

Use Windows Media Player 11, much more advanced app, and fully x64.

http://radekhulan.cz/img/wmp11/th_WMP11.jpg (http://radekhulan.cz/img/wmp11/WMP11.jpg)

six_storm
07-31-07, 05:28 PM
iTunes is the slowest app I have ever used on my quadcore with 4GB of RAM. Had an iPod 60GB, and before installing RockBox on it, I wanted to through it into the wastebin. Anyway, Apple SW is not compatible with Vista x64 (at least iTunes for iPhone do not work), and this is Apple only error. The best way is to avoid anything from Apple (QuickTime, iTunes, Safari).

Use Windows Media Player 11, much more advanced app, and fully x64.

http://radekhulan.cz/img/wmp11/th_WMP11.jpg (http://radekhulan.cz/img/wmp11/WMP11.jpg)

I guess. I have a lot of purchased music from iTunes and I have never come across any problems with using iTunes. iTunes does work on Vista 64-bit, just the installation was slow like everything else.

stncttr908
07-31-07, 05:53 PM
The only benefit I've encountered with 64-bit Windows operating systems (XP and Vista) is the ability to address a full 4GB of physical RAM. It's more of a hassle than anything.

grey_1
07-31-07, 06:42 PM
I've had very few problems with 64bit with 2 gigs. But these are good days to buy ram six, it's going cheap.

Rakeesh
07-31-07, 06:45 PM
Remember, 64-bit programs are 64-bit, not 32-bit. That means some things like memory addresses, opcodes, etc use twice as much data. That necessitates more memory, and higher memory bandwidth in many cases. In some places it will be faster, in others it will be slower.

Sazar
07-31-07, 06:59 PM
Well, I finally got a copy of Vista Ultimate x64, got it installed and tried a few apps for fun. Here are my thoughts. I guess the 64-bit version is supposed to be faster than the 32-bit version, but really, it's slower. And it also maxes out my PC 25% more than 32-bit did. WTF? So what about the apps? I didn't have any problems installing/using iTunes, Firefox, IE or Office . . . but the load and installation times were terrible. Why does it take me 10 minutes (literally) just to install iTunes? I know you would say that iTunes is a POS program but it works fine for me so back off.

iTunes works fine, but, honestly, it's SLOW.

There is a reason why I refuse to use this app on my system now and simply bought a new mp3 player where I don't have to use the program :) Yes, it was THAT irritatingly slow.

Anyways, the 64-bit aspect will typically only benefit you for large applications and the fact is, third party apps simply have not optimized appropriately.

The majority of Microsoft apps as well as a variety of others (cs3 for example) work fine (cs3, by the way, is hit and miss with Vista-64, Adobe is working on fixing this up).

Why is the 64-bit version slower than the 32-bit? Is my PC just not up to par? Do you have to have a WEI rating of 100 for it to get going?

I'm leaving it on my extra hard drive for testing purposes but I think I'll just stick with the 32-bit for when I have to use Windows.

There are plenty of articles on 32 v/s 64 bit performance but radek has hit the key points well enough.

1 GB, heck I haven't used 1 GB on an XP system in almost 3 years.

-edit-

Btw, is your copy legit?

Just curious because you seem to have acquired rather than purchased by your choice of words :cool:

six_storm
07-31-07, 08:36 PM
I've had very few problems with 64bit with 2 gigs. But these are good days to buy ram six, it's going cheap.

Ha, well, when you have more important things to buy/take care of than your rig, then you'll understand my situation. :D

1 GB, heck I haven't used 1 GB on an XP system in almost 3 years.

-edit-

Btw, is your copy legit?

Just curious because you seem to have acquired rather than purchased by your choice of words

My copy was received for educational purposes. :D I know, I know, I'm a thief or what have you, but seriously, I've never ran a 64-bit Windows OS and was curious.

I really haven't had to purchase/own more than 1GB of RAM. Games have ran fine as well as programs. I'm trying to do with what I can at the moment because after I get married and get some financial stability, a new rig will come.

(I do have a legit Vista Business copy, just so you know)

rflair
07-31-07, 08:44 PM
Vista x64 and 4 gigs or more, I would not run it on any less RAM, its like night and day from 2 gigs to 4 gigs.

It really is a good OS.

Rakeesh
07-31-07, 08:45 PM
My copy was received for educational purposes. :D I know, I know, I'm a thief or what have you, but seriously, I've never ran a 64-bit Windows OS and was curious.

I really haven't had to purchase/own more than 1GB of RAM. Games have ran fine as well as programs. I'm trying to do with what I can at the moment because after I get married and get some financial stability, a new rig will come.

(I do have a legit Vista Business copy, just so you know)

The key for your 32-bit version will work on your 64-bit version as well. There is no difference in keys between 32-bit and 64-bit versions as they are licensed as one product, and not separately. The keys only differ from the basic, premium, business, enterprise, and ultimate editions, and then from there the retail, oem, and upgrade versions of each edition. 64-bit vs 32-bit were only different licenses in XP.

grey_1
07-31-07, 08:53 PM
Ha, well, when you have more important things to buy/take care of than your rig, then you'll understand my situation. :D



My copy was received for educational purposes. :D I know, I know, I'm a thief or what have you, but seriously, I've never ran a 64-bit Windows OS and was curious.

I really haven't had to purchase/own more than 1GB of RAM. Games have ran fine as well as programs. I'm trying to do with what I can at the moment because after I get married and get some financial stability, a new rig will come.

(I do have a legit Vista Business copy, just so you know)
Wow, totally uncalled for. I will be the better man and not 'splain a few facts of life to you. ;)

Now grow a pair and go get your ram. :p

evilghost
07-31-07, 09:05 PM
Why would anyone want to run Apache/PHP on x64 Vista...

Redeemed
07-31-07, 09:09 PM
Wow, totally uncalled for. I will be the better man and not 'splain a few facts of life to you. ;)

Now grow a pair and go get your ram. :p

Why not grey? Afraid to remind us what your name stands for? :p

Seriously six, Grey is the last person you should be directing those comments to. I'd confidently bet he has more going on in his life right now than you, but he's also quite a bit older and has managed to land a good paying job- thus his ability to "afford" such pleasures as a wicked gaming rig.

You'll get there some day, as will I. The key is patience. As you stated you plan on doing, just make do with what you have. Right now you don't have a rig that will benefit from any 64bit OS really. So just stick with Vista 32 bit for now.

Me, I was running Vista Ultimate x64 for several months untill my RAM and HDD decided to crap out on me. :thumbdwn: Just got it re-installed today on my new Samsung 500GB hard drive... and am having zero problems. It is fast, extremely snappy, and responsive- and very stable. And this is with only 2Gigs of ram and a proc that isn't significantly faster than yours. ;)

Redeemed
07-31-07, 09:09 PM
Why would anyone want to run Apache/PHP on x64 Vista...

Just to get yer' undies in a bunch. :naughty:

radekhulan
07-31-07, 09:32 PM
Why would anyone want to run Apache/PHP on x64 Vista...

Why not? They run better on Vista then on Linux, with (obsolete) 2.6.22 kernel.. Vista x64 has most modern kernel of all OSes. Plus there are millions of great apps for it, unlike for *NIX or *BSD (OS X included).

PHP x64: http://www.fusionxlan.com/PHPx64/
Apache x64: http://www.blackdot.be/?inc=apache/binaries
MySQL x64: http://dev.mysql.com/get/Downloads/MySQL-5.1/mysql-5.1.20-beta-winx64.zip/from/pick

Linux has lost the battle. It was trying for 15+ years to conquer the market, but they still have 0.5-1.0% on the desktop only after all those years.

PS: I would run IIS, but my apps heavily depend on mod_rewrite and FilesMatch..

evilghost
07-31-07, 09:38 PM
What does market penetration have to do with performance, and, have you seen the Netcraft survey results? Even the Microsoft apologists will concede that Linux/Unix has the server market.

In one post you say how Vista doesn't run on 1GB of RAM and in another you tout performance benefits of Apache/PHP on an inferior OS.

Honestly, how much does Microsoft pay you?

evilghost
07-31-07, 09:40 PM
Doesn't Microsoft make IIS? Certainly it blows the socks off Apache and PHP. Why even use such inferior open source products that haven't been bought out/stolen invented by Microsoft?

radekhulan
07-31-07, 09:46 PM
What does market penetration have to do with performance, and, have you seen the Netcraft survey results?

Yes, I did. It is amazing how much IIS has gained within last year, and that must be on Windows. Apache lost A LOT, a ton, and do as well consider that Apache != Linux, as Apache can run on Windows very well..

IIS is growing, Apache is falling, that is the momentum..

In active sites, Apache is now at 49.98% share, less than 14.5% ahead of Microsoft. While that's still a considerable lead, Apache had a 33.4% advantage at this time last July, meaning Microsoft has cut its deficit in half in the past 12 months.

evilghost
07-31-07, 09:55 PM
FSCK, you've convinced me. Where do I need to send the check, I'm going to tear out my entire Linux infrastructure and run Windows Vista 64bit with IIS. I need to be like everyone else.

six_storm
07-31-07, 10:13 PM
Wow, totally uncalled for. I will be the better man and not 'splain a few facts of life to you. ;)

Now grow a pair and go get your ram. :p

Sorry, I don't read every post on the forums like I used to. Sorry grey! I am pretty darn broke though.

You'll get there some day, as will I. The key is patience. As you stated you plan on doing, just make do with what you have. Right now you don't have a rig that will benefit from any 64bit OS really. So just stick with Vista 32 bit for now.

Me, I was running Vista Ultimate x64 for several months untill my RAM and HDD decided to crap out on me. Just got it re-installed today on my new Samsung 500GB hard drive... and am having zero problems. It is fast, extremely snappy, and responsive- and very stable. And this is with only 2Gigs of ram and a proc that isn't significantly faster than yours.

Oh I know I'll get there someday. :D So Vista x64 is pretty snappy for you? Congrats! Vista hasn't been all that "snappy" for me like XP has but then again, it's my hardware. Hopefully I'll have a Vista worthy rig lol. In the mean time, Linux is working wonders :thumbsup:

six_storm
07-31-07, 10:14 PM
FSCK, you've convinced me. Where do I need to send the check, I'm going to tear out my entire Linux infrastructure and run Windows Vista 64bit with IIS. I need to be like everyone else.

OMG!!! evilghost is going 100% Microsoft!!!! Euro got to him!!!!

evilghost
07-31-07, 10:23 PM
Exactly. It's all crap. I need the comforting snuggling of pseudo-security and the whispers in my ear telling me dont' worry about the source code, it's secure, it's the most secure version of Windows ever. It never has bothered me that file copy takes 10 times longer or the entire system is intrinsically unstable and bloated.

I've been the horses ass for too long now, Microsoft is in! Can someone paypal me some cash so I can pony up for Vista Super-Duper Edition?