Top Messenging Clients

[Monolyth]

Pidgin is awesome, and I used gaim before that. :)

f*ck the EULA's, seriously if we all followed everything written down in a TOS or EULA we wouldn't be allowed to do anything but write something in notepad.

[wnd]

Every kid knows that MSFT = Microsoft Corporation (on NASDAQ)

And the funny thing is that it took me about two seconds to prove you wrong even before you made that claim. :-)


Btw, do you really think EULA / Service agreement at other IM providers is significantly better?

Yes, I do.


5. Use of the Services by you

5.3 You agree not to access (or attempt to access) any of the Services by any means other than through the interface that is provided by Google, unless you have been specifically allowed to do so in a separate agreement with Google.


And then...

Google Talk is built to support industry standards. You can access the Google Talk service and exchange instant messages using other clients that support the standard XMPP protocol.

(Emphasis mine.)

In other words "you can use Google Talk with XMPP-compliant client of your choice". Thanks to allowing to use other clients, Google does not enforce pushing new versions of unknown executables to your computer. This also means you have (virtually) full control over the data that is sent to Google's servers.

ICQ licence, after finding the English version, clearly forbids using other clients. It also looks equally evil to Microsoft's licence.

Yahoo's licence was slightly more complex. First it warns about differences between Yahoo! Messenger and authorised non-Yahoo! -clients, but doesn't mention others. Later it describes the protocol as "Service", and tells what you agree to by using the Service. Finally, in section 7, "RESTRICTIONS ON USE", they say reverse engineering the protocol is forbidden. I'm not sure if creating a client from scratch falls into "create derivative works (as defined by the U.S. Copyright Act)", though.

However in countries like Finland, a licence agreement must not "override" Finnish law. Since Finnish law allows reverse engineering things *1, it is fully legal to use any application to access MSN, ICQ, or Yahoo's IM. I'm quite sure that I am allowed to write a client to Yahoo!'s IM.

*1 Unfortunately it is illegal to create (e.g. by reverse engineering) a program to decrypt strong encryption. This is also where the law gets messy. It does not define "strong encryption", but thanks to certain activists, DVD encryption has now been ruled not to be strong encryption.

[zer0]

meebo

[Bearclaw]

Radekhulan, could you please post a picture of one of the checks MS sends you? I want to know if its normal size or novelty size like the checks that pro golfers get when they win a tournament.

LMFAO HAHAHAHAHAHAHA I almost fell off my chair.

[Mr Bigman]

This radekhulan guy must be pro M$. Hell he was shaking hands with the devil himself, Gates.

I found that sticking with Messenger works fine for me and Trillian doesn't skin that well and doesn't do the other things like video chat so.

[radekhulan]

..

In no way, I am in "love" with Microsoft ;-) I am just not blind and biased as many (three; although I am not sure what they type, have them all on my Ignore list) other people here. Some people hate Microsoft and avoid everything from them. Now that is stupid. Truth is, 5+ years ago, many Microsoft products were not superior, I was looking at Linux, Solaris and others. I used AmiPro, QuatroPro, WordPerfect, Borland Paradox, and ICQ.

But today, with Vista x64, Office 2007, Windows Mobile 6, Windows Live Messenger, Live.com (Custom Domains) and other apps and services, they are leaders in each of those market segments. And I prefer to use the very best SW, not the 2nd best.

My own company uses PHP, MySQL and Apache to do website management: http://hulan.cz/portfolio/
My own weblog with 10.000 UIPs / day uses Google AdSense to get revenue: http://radekhulan.cz/

But PC OS (Vista x64), office, email and PIM (Outlook), IM (WLM), phone OS, etc., are Microsoft SW and services for me (today). Open-source cannot compete here. I love it how WLM, Live.com, Outlook on PC, Outlook on phone and other components are kept in sync, all the time. Contacts are synced, so if I use GPS navigation, I am sure I drive to correct client address.

There is no competition for Microsoft at this moment. If you are not an advanced user, you might think using Thunderbird, Jabber and Samsung dumbphones is cool, but you are missing whole point here...

[evilghost]

There is no competition for Microsoft at this moment. If you are not an advanced user, you might think using Thunderbird, Jabber and Samsung dumbphones is cool, but you are missing whole point here...

http://i16.tinypic.com/4ztgbj7.jpg

[Monolyth]

Everyone has their own needs, I don't need all the stuff that Microsoft's products offer, so why would I want to pay them for things like Office? I don't need voice chat (I have Vent & TS servers), I don't need video because I'm not into video chat.

I don't need to sync my GPS because I don't have one, I don't need to sync my contacts because everyone I need to talk with is either a real person that I can call or they are all accessible via my multi-service chat client (Pidgin).

You choose the product you want based on what you need and sometimes what you might need in the future. If Rade requires that kind of extreme connectivity between his apps, so be it, Microsoft has done a good job of that there can't be an argument there, the progress they have made to make their various products talk to one another is amazing. But if you don't need it, don't buy it. There's no need to attack those that do buy it and need it.

[Mr Bigman]

radekhulan You support the monopoly and bck Gates? Nice being in the M$ camp.

Sure there stuff is much better than it was but there still a software beurocracy and do anything to get people to follow them.

Im not fond of DRM either and that IS what M$ is promoting these days.

Yea i own all those products but i still like Linux too.

[evilghost]

radekhulan caused the WGA servers to go down.

[radekhulan]

Im not fond of DRM either and that IS what M$ is promoting these days.

Wrong. MS does not promote DRM. Hollywood requires it. And DRM does not concern you under Vista until you play DRM content. I have none on my computer...

[Mr Bigman]

Than why can't i get my rom emulators to work any my friend has Adobe pro 8 that won't run on Vista?

M$ did do the right thing not allowing keygen'd apps to run on Vista. but it breaks something too in trial software and shareware.

And you do have some work relationship with MS cuz i seen your pics shaking gates hand and in the pic above.

[einstein_314]

Than why can't i get my rom emulators to work any my friend has Adobe pro 8 that won't run on Vista?

M$ did do the right thing not allowing keygen'd apps to run on Vista. but it breaks something too in trial software and shareware.

And you do have some work relationship with MS cuz i seen your pics shaking gates hand and in the pic above.
Adobe Acrobat 8 does have a problem with Vista. It extracts it's installer files to a protected folder in the Vista system files, so when it tries to use them, it crashes. The simple way to get around this is to start the installer, and when it finished extracting all the files, go to the location it extracted them too and copy them somewhere else. Then run the installer from the already extracted files. Boom. Works.

As for ROM emulators......meh. I have no interest in getting them to work....use a different OS. I have zero interest in playing games that require ROM emulators.

I'm sorry but I also think that microsoft products are definatly better than the competition. Office 2007 is way better than ANYTHING I've ever used. Openoffice sucks. Vista is the most stable OS I've used yet.

I'm NOT a m$ fanboy. Never have been, never will be. I'm currently working on getting a linux server set up, and I have no objections to using a mac. They all have their applications. And it so happens that windows is the best OS out there FOR ME to use on an everyday basis.

[grey_1]

Wrong. MS does not promote DRM. Hollywood requires it. And DRM does not concern you under Vista until you play DRM content. I have none on my computer...
LMAO! That's classic!

So just don't play it and Bingo! No DRM worries. :)

[Monolyth]

I think he's talking about Acrobat Pro 8, I know that the newest version of Reader has been patched to fix this. So I'm guessing Pro 8 probably has a patch to fix it as well.

[wnd]

I also think that microsoft products are definatly better than the competition. Office 2007 is way better than ANYTHING I've ever used. Openoffice sucks.

It's really a matter of taste, but there's one thing I do agree with. OpenOffice.org sucks. Since I have not had the misfortune to work with office suites, I can only say that Vim+LaTeX+ispell+gnuplot (and docbook) fullfill all my word processing and presentation needs.

What this has to do with "Top Messenging Clients" is a total mystery to me.

[einstein_314]

I think he's talking about Acrobat Pro 8, I know that the newest version of Reader has been patched to fix this. So I'm guessing Pro 8 probably has a patch to fix it as well.
I know that's what he's talking about. Hence why I said Adobe Acrobat......and not adobe reader........

[radekhulan]

So just don't play it and Bingo! No DRM worries. :)

Exactly. ;-) If you are not driving, you cannot have a car accident.. Same with DRM, it does NOTHING if you are playing non-DRM content. On Linux, you can play only non-DRM content. No choice there. You will not be able to play HD content (w/ DRM) on Linux, ever.

Nobody likes DRM, but on Windows, you can at least make a choice (you can play media which are available only in DRM format, on Linux you cannot)..

[grey_1]

Exactly. ;-) If you are not driving, you cannot have a car accident.. Same with DRM, it does NOTHING if you are playing non-DRM content. On Linux, you can play only non-DRM content. No choice there. You will not be able to play HD content (w/ DRM) on Linux, ever.

Nobody likes DRM, but on Windows, you can at least make a choice (you can play media which are available only in DRM format, on Linux you cannot)..
I would normally ask if you had a clue how ludicrous that "argument" is, but it's fairly obvious you don't.

[wnd]

On Linux, you can play only non-DRM content. No choice there. You will not be able to play HD content (w/ DRM) on Linux, ever.

You mean like you cannot use free players to play DVDs on Linux?

Nobody likes DRM, but on Windows, you can at least make a choice (you can play media which are available only in DRM format, on Linux you cannot)..

It's not like I wanted to. I want to access my media without silly restrictions such as Digital Restrictions Management. These things do nothing but hurt paying customers; if there's a need, hackers always find a way. Always. No matter if it's music, movies, or games.

[Mr Bigman]

Im thinking of doing a fund raiser for MS to help them make more money. I love MSN and everything about Live too. HS is the best thing that ever happen to the PC.

[six_storm]

When I use a messenging program, I want it to be lightweight, not a resource hog. Pidgin for Windows is very light and doesn't bother you with crapware like AIM. iChat is very nice too for Macs.

Everybody I know uses AIM. It used to be ICQ, but never MSN.

[Zelda_fan]

pidgin is the best IM client. It's free, has zero spyware, not resource intensive, and supports all the IM protocols (AIM, MSN, yahoo, google talk).

[Zelda_fan]

Honestly, if I were one of Radekhulan's contacts I'd be a little annoyed he posted my contact details.

notice how there are zero women on his contact list