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-   -   Get out foul spirit !! -- Death to the Infinite Loop !! (http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1334)

Ripper 08-30-02 07:10 PM

Get out foul spirit -- Death to the Infinite Loop (and DET 40 comments)
 
I have been cursed with the infamous "Infinite Loop" blue screen ever since my upgrade to a GF3 ti200 (Gainward O/C'ed to 250/550 :D) !! Running on WinXP, I never had this problem with my GF2, but as soon as I installed the GF3 -- BAAM (never ocurred with Win2K either) !! Screen freezes and a few agonizing minutes later -- NV4DISP.DLL / Infinite Loop bluescreen. Tried every driver from 22.9X's to 30.82's -- some made matters worse, some made it somewhat beeter, but could never run 3DMark 2001 or DronzeMark loops for over 3 hours without a crash. Tried underclocking, de-tuning RAM settings, altering AGP drive strength, disabling Fastwrites, dropping to AGP 2X, clean re-installs of WinXP -- all with no luck.

But wait ...

Then there came WinXP sp1 v1105 and the new Det 4's. After applying sp1, things improved dramatically. I could go 8-10 hrs without a blue screen, but the system would lock up with a solid white line along the screen bottom. Cold boot time. No BSOD and longer periods befor the error. A definite move in the right direction, heh !!

Then came the Det 4's and ALLA KAZAAM, ALLA KAZOO -- the foul demon of the Infinite loop has been cast into the burning pit of hell! After applying these 2 things, the damn thing will run 24 hours without a hiccup. No lockup, no BSOD, just endless looping demo stability goodness !!! :confused: :) :D The only thing that causes an abort is me intentionally stopping the process via the ESC key.

If you've got the INFINITE LOOP problem, and have access to the WinXP SP1 Beta v1105, give them a try and POST up your findings.

:D

CyberDude 08-31-02 04:14 PM

Good to hear Ripper, I used to have the same problem when I just got my GF4 Ti4400, I put it on an Asus CUV4X mobo (VIA chipset) and I was on XP. The nfinite loops would occur so often (within 5-10 seconds of entering a game) that I saw no other reason then to return my card believing it was defective, as not much information was available at the time about the error. I received another brand new card, put it in and I continued to receive the errors. A month later I upgraded and purchased a SiS chipset motherboard, to this day games run incredibly stable and I have had 0 problems. I dont think I will ever go back to VIA because of these problems and also because of their problems with Creative soundcards.

The Baron 08-31-02 06:25 PM

Never had the problem.... guess I'm just lucky :confused:

Ripper 09-01-02 09:39 PM

40.41's bring a possible form of GPU Throttling ??
 
Got a little more info. relating to the "Infinite Loop" error. It seems the FIX was actually the new NVidia drivers. Seems they do some sort of AGP voltage monitoring and perform a kind of ERROR CORRECTION or ERROR TOLERANCE/IGNORE for slight data corruption due to AGP power issues. I seem to have uncovered a peculiarity, though -- at least on my system ...

The drivers appear to be doing some form of "throttling" when the vidcard is O/C'ed too high and to the point of errors. Maybe via a form of VIDEO FRAME DISCARDING or some other method of trapping errors and discarding them. I believe this is the case.

When O/C'ing my vidcard beyond the previously established "rock solid speed (Gainward GF3 Ti200 @ 250/550), the 3DMark 2001 SE benchmark scores progressively get lower and lower the higher I O/C the vidcard. Visually there was not a tip-off of anything going on, but finally after getting to 266/575, I get considerable frame skips and pauses, but no BSOD or errors. Could this be some sort of ERROR CONTROL or THROTTLING putting the brakes on the BSOD or Infinitel Loop due to additional demands on the GPU voltage rail? Either way, it appears to not impede my ability to O/C to my previous O/C level, but while I am able move the sliders on my PSTRIP higher than before without lockups or Blue Screens, the resulting score is lower and lower.

If only I had not benchmarked -- would have been a nice Placebo O/C, heh ?? :)

RAST 09-02-02 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CyberDude

[...]
A month later I upgraded and purchased a SiS chipset motherboard, to this day games run incredibly stable and I have had 0 problems. I dont think I will ever go back to VIA...

I'm sorry to hear you never really squished that loop problem with the VIA hardware. I too love SIS chipsets. Very nice. The ECS K7S5A is the best value MoBo on the planet. I've built 5 systems with that MoBo and not one problem ever.

Too bad SIS is "focusing" on the Intel market now instead of AMD. I really liked having an alternative to VIA. And I own both!

Ripper 09-02-02 02:02 PM

To the contrary -- it is fixed w/ the new Detonator drivers. The problem I described with "Throttling" or degrading performance at higher speeds, only manifests itself when I exceed the speeds which I had previously determined was the maximum stable (i.e. 250/550). In fact with the new DET's I picked up an extra 200-300 pts. in 3DMark 2001 at the same 250/550 seetings. I was just trying to see if the new drivers gave me a little more O/C headroom, but it is apparent that the 250/550 limit was hardware, not drivers.

I posted up my "theory" only to warn others that while you may be able to O/C numerically by pushing the sliders higher, you'd better benchmark as well. Higher and the appearence of stability is not always faster. :D

Loving these 40.41's. All I'm waiting on is the 0x Anisotropic fix!!

BTW -- The never-ending series of bugs and issues with every new Via chipset release is really getting quite tiring and disconcerting. I agree the SiS chipset has become a very strong competitor in both the AMD and Intel space. SiS' Intel P4 chipsets look VERY strong !!! As for AMD -- I'm keeping an eye on the NForce2. Perhaps it will deliver on the promise of performance and stability. ;)

batterbrain101 09-02-02 11:25 PM

I have never had this infinite loop problem. As you can see below I have a VIA chipset, my previous board was an ASUS A7V and I never had the problem with that one neither. Lucky I guess.

AngelGraves13 09-03-02 05:47 AM

I would get this problem after installing Nero. strange huh? And after I installed Nero, my NVDVD no longer runs. Stupid Nero.

hupjack 10-19-02 07:08 PM

I've got the infinte loop blues. TV card + Vid Card = Inf. Loop
 
Hello All,
I'm a newbie to this forum. I just did a quick search looking for other info regarding the infinite loop problem I am having, and I came accross Ripper’s post, "Get out foul spirit -- Death to the Infinite Loop (and DET 40 comments)".

I'm not 100% sure if I am experiencing the same problem, so here is a quick description. My crash is precipitated by running my wintv2k application, which is the application for displaying TV on my computer from my Hauppauge Wintv PCI card.

While just running wintv2k has caused a crash, the sure-fire way to lock up the system is after launching wintv2k, to resize the TV window with any speed at all. The display would then freeze, though the audio would continue to play through. After approximately a 10 second delay, windows XP would come back and refresh into a "safe mode looking display scenario," and say it had recovered from as serious error (giving me an opportunity to save any open work and restart my computer.)

I didn't get any error reporting wizard after restarting which sort of surprised me, but when checking the event viewer system log I found the following, which I have copied and pasted:
Event Type: Error
Event Source: nv
Event Category: None
Event ID: 108
Date: 9/16/2002
Time: 2:29:01 PM
User: N/A
Computer: EL-MACHINO
Description:
The driver nv4_disp for the display device \Device\Video0 got stuck in an infinite loop. This usually indicates a problem with the device itself or with the device driver programming the hardware incorrectly. Please check with your hardware device vendor for any driver updates.

For more information, see Help and Support Center at http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/events.asp.
Data:
0000: 00 00 00 00 03 00 46 00 ......F.
0008: 00 00 00 00 6c 00 04 c0 ....l..À
0010: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
0018: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
0020: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........

I know the error occurred with version 30.82 straight from nvidia, as well as the 30.87 off microsoft-update. The same problem also plagued the latest release from my hardware manufacturer MSI. The 30.00 driver here http://www.msi.com.tw/program/suppor...st.php?part=2, which I assume are an nvidia reference driver with some additional display control panel tabs for overclocking etc. I'm not sure which other driver versions get me in trouble with this infinite loop, but remembering that 21.83 was a stable driver, I rolled back to that one, and the problems are solved. Looking at the forums here, I see 4x.xx driver versions, which I haven't tried and didn't know existed. Are these known to fix the inf. loop problems? I guess my REAL question is, does Nvidia already know about my problem, and have they addressed it, or am I dealing with hardware that is falling off the edge of what they support? Each new driver version I try has the same problem, is there a fix for this in a future release, or am I stuck using the older 21.83 because they introduced some “feature” that causes me grief, that they have no intentions of removing? Basically I’m dealing with an issue where using my TV card (Model 61201 Rev. B226 BT878) causes my video card (MS8807 TNT2 16meg) to crash the system with the newer general release WHQL drivers. Is there really no way to report driver bugs directly to nvidia? It looks like bug submission is only through the hardware manufacturer (MSI for this card)? I’ve reported the problem to them, but received no reply.

Here is my full hardware config:
OS & Version = Win XP Ver 2002 Service Pack 1
CPU Type = Pentium III 450
Motherboard = AOpen AX6BC
BIOS/Firmware = R2.57
Memory size = DIMM1 256MB PC133 stick
DIMM2 128MB PC100 stick
IDE 1 Channel = MASTER HDD Seagate ST380021A (Barracuda ATA IV)
SLAVE HDD Western Digital WDC WD205BA
IDE 2 Channel = CDROM, TOSHIBA XM-6202B

PCI:
Graphics card: MSI (Nvidia Based) - MS8807 TNT2 16meg 3d AG hantom ver 1a
Sound card: Creative Labs - PCI 512
TV/Vid capture card: Hauppauge Win TV Model 61201 Rev. B226 BT878
SCSI CARD: Adaptec AHA-2930CU
Network Card: Linksys LNE100TX (LC82C169)

ISA Modem: 3COM / USROBOTIC 56k Data/Fax Modem Product ID 66178781

PS/2 Mouse and Keyboard:
Logitech Wheel Mouse model (M-C48)
Memorex TS1000 keyboard (has win98 power, sleep, and wake up keys)

Monitor - Viewsonic e773

DaveW 10-20-02 01:42 PM

I can only say "good luck".. I have a Hauppauge Win TV board. It was never very stable on Win 9x or XP on either PC. Your problems seem very similar to mine. The annoying thing is rusting in my attic now.

Tarrant 10-22-02 12:35 PM

Hey Ripper, nice overclocking job on that card. I have the exact same one and can get it to 245/560. Anyway, I've been using the 30.82 drivers for a while and only recently started getting that crazy infinite loop blue screen while playing Battlefield 1942. I switched to the 40.72 drivers just last night but haven't had the chance to test 'em out and see how they work in that game. Your post give me high hopes!

PsychoSy 10-24-02 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by RAST
Too bad SIS is "focusing" on the Intel market now instead of AMD. I really liked having an alternative to VIA. And I own both!
Oh, on the contrary!

http://www.sis.com/products/chipsets/oa/socketa/746.htm

SiS 746 is their latest AMD offering and the specs look nice! :D

ECS is currently testing this chipset and gearing up to release some boards based on it in time for Christmas. One website (can't recall at the moment - might have been T-break or something like that) got their hands on a review sample and gave it a good score. It's about as good as ECS K7S5A - stable, rock solid, but not good at overclocking.

As for the infinite loop, I don't get it at all on my system unless I install Logitech MouseWare so if you got that bloated garbage in your system, excorcise it!! All you really need from a Logitech MouseWare package is the updated core drivers. The rest is dreck!


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