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-   -   Dear Juice, (http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1984)

ibGoodEnuf 09-18-02 12:29 PM

Dear Juice,
I can't believe that you closed that thread. I can understand comaraderie, but I do not understand blind loyalty to another mod for the simple reason that they are just that. If one were to look objectively at the responses of a certain moderator, they would find that the bounds and responsibilities of moderation have been severely overstepped. If you want to turn a blind eye and pretend this isnt the case, well I suppose that is fine. It saddens me to see this though as I have formed such a high opinion of you and your opinions to this point. Not the first time my pollyannaish attitude has led me astray. Go ahead and close this too if you wish, just know that this behavior is quickly alienating one of the oldest members of this community. I click through on your ads to help support the site and refer others, but if this heavyhanded behavior continues I will have to reconsider my position in refering to you as one of the best fan sites out there. This is still a belief that I currently hold, however if moderator actions are left unchecked, or worse yet, endorsed by all of the moderator staff, then I will likely no longer feel this way about nV News. I find this sad, much like losing a friend.

As far as your suggestion that I take the matter up directly with the mod in question; I see this as counter-productive. I wish for those that feel the same as I to read my views and offer feedback, whether pro or con. When you as a moderator close a thread, you censor the abilities of others to offer opinions. Hmmmm, something you really want to do?

volt 09-18-02 12:52 PM

We are angels compared to mods at other sites. :)

AshG 09-18-02 01:08 PM

I find this situation much like my lower grade level classes. The students love everything so long as they are allowed to do as they please, what they please, when they please. When a modicum or behavior modification or reinforcement is brought forth, then there's generally some type of outcry and backlash. Standard 2nd level emotional development characteristics according to Piaget.

That being said, I refer you to the EULA and ToS. When you registerted, you committed to an understanding that posts could be edited, moved, and/or closed for any reason. This is standard fare for any online community. Please be aware that the situation in which you are participating is operating fully withint he grounds set forth by the EULA and ToS.

(been a while, gotta say it...) Dig?

ibGoodEnuf 09-18-02 01:08 PM

I know you are Dirx, but you cant possibly be of the opinion that there isnt room for improvement.

ibGoodEnuf 09-18-02 01:36 PM


I appreciate your input, but your assessment of my motivation, while sounding interesting, couldn't be further from factual when applied to what I am trying to accomplish. I am also fine with all of these type of responses. If you dont want my patronage, just tell me. I will honor your collective wishes.

LoRD.MuAD'diB 09-18-02 02:14 PM

While I understand that in any police state like environment, there has to be an element of control over unruly actions, that's simply not what's going on here. I see someone expressing their frustrations over recent events, and being shut out for it. Angels compared to mods on other sites, perhaps. But your certainly not Gods. Why are opinions being cut down as immature? Do the opinions of only the moderators count here at nV News? Why is it ok that a moderator lashes out at someone for something as simple as inquiring about a 3dMark score, but when a user posts concerns about the actions of a moderator they're accused of having the cognitive capacity of a six year old? It seems to me that this is a double standard. And at that a fairly large and particularily disturbing one.

In one thread, somebody asked about their 3dmark score with relation to their hardware. Here is someone who respects the opinion of the patrons of your message board. This person is met with the general posts. Some say it's good, some say it's average, etc. Then a moderator comes along and basically tells the person to go play a game and stop wasting everyone's time by posting insignificant nonsense. When questioned about this outburst, this moderator replies by saying they're sorry, but are having a bad week at work.

I'm new to this board, but is this the kind of behavior I can expect to see out of moderators? Are the validity of my opinions and concerns dependant on how your week is going? This, to me, doesn't constitute fair and impartial treatment. And if it's typical of the administration of the nV News forums, I feel sorry for the new users whom you are making an effort to "protect" by shuffling posts around and closing threads.

Matthyahuw 09-18-02 03:45 PM

This board is moderated a little more strictly than other boards, so we have some better content here for everyone...
Wherelse can you get ask a question at another fansite where you get some good feedback?
Try asking a nice nVidia question at Rage3D...or try asking ANYTHING at [H]OCP, your answer gets lost in insults and spam and all the other crap.

Now as far as Saturn, we had a talk about this a while back, and if you read the whole thread (if it's the thread I'm thinking of), he did apologize for his actions...

That's the way the owner wants the forums to be run, even at the cost of popularity, if you don't like it, then I'm sorry, there is R3D [H]OCP, Anand, and all the rest of the spam zones waiting for you...

ibGoodEnuf 09-18-02 04:12 PM


I do not frequent hard ocp because of Mike's problems with Kyle. When Mike tells me he has read my complaints and found none valid and that my patronage is unimportant to him as you have inicated it is you, I will leave you and your site alone.

LoRD.MuAD'diB 09-18-02 04:19 PM

Thank you for being somewhat more diplomatic about it than AshG. Frankly his "RTFM OR DIE" mentality is an annoyance. As for the owner of the site, I can't speak for them. If they want their patrons insulted, and opinions stiffled, that's up to them. And certainly you can't be blamed for doing the job you've been given. But in the same spirit that the general forum should be renamed "Water Cooler", the word moderator should be changed to something a little more appropriate as well. The word I'm thinking of is too easily mistaken for other, historicaly infamous meanings (despite it's actual meaning), so I'll refrain from using the word.

Your efforts to defend your own are admirabe. But I ask you, should a moderator have to appologize for something like that? Is not a mod someone who is supposed to be professional enough to avoid such situations? A missunderstanding every once in a while is one thing, but as I understand Saturn has a long history (roughly two years) of bashing people who even mention 3dMark. Maybe your rules (or rather the ones you're given) are a bit more strict than other's. If this keeps the board cleaner, then ok. But to repeatedly bash people for something as simple as their choice in benchmarking software, is simply uncalled for. Is it so hard to simply not comment on those threads, rather than seek them out and flame?

AshG 09-18-02 09:12 PM

Yeah, sorry for coming across like I have stick shoved up my arse.

When in doubt about a situation, rules and regulations are the only clear discourse of action that can be taken. It sucks, I know, but they're there for a reason.

As for the benchmarking thread Saturn closed, looking back at it I can see why. Is there a reason to call someone "asshopper"? I really don't think so, at least not outside of Open Forum.

As for yourself, Mr. DuneGuy (since I don't feel like slaughtering the spelling of your name)...

Quote: You, my friend, have what we call an inferiority complex. You see someone with the ability to prove you wrong with a simple statement, and suddenly the whole world is against you. Do us all a favor and get off your soap box, put the pipe down, grab a beer, and just relax for a change. Just because you don't have the cognitive capacity to get the upmost performance out of your machine, doesn't mean that the rest of us are cheating for understanding and embracing such a daunting concept as overclocking. Get a grip man. If I can break 10k with a Radeon 8500, and your only getting 11.7 with a 9700, there's something seriously wrong with either you or your rig (or both).

That sounds so like me it's just scary. Granted, personal jabs aren't really that cool outside of OF, bu you were right to a point. But Saturn closed the thread to prevent any more of that type of discourse, and I have to say I agreed. It was becoming very unbecoming of the forums.

*sigh* Yeah, for some reason most of the mods are uptight right now. Well, uptight over here... But that's another story for another time. Will we cool off? I don't know. But for those people who DO know me, I've really calmed down over the past year. Since I was "Mod"ified, I've moved, deleted, and edited more posts than any other mod at this site most likely. I've given up on that and just let things run their course until they reach the boundaries now. No more heartburn that way =)

Again, sorry for the stock "read the rules" thingamabob. It's an automatic security thing when Idon't have time to completely analyze a situation. What would you expect from a middle school teacher with three generations of police leading up to him? =P

|JuiceZ| 09-18-02 09:34 PM

ibGoodEnuf I apologize for closing your thread and I understand and respect the point yer trying to make but the last time a thread like that was started, it ended up being a "Members vs Mods" and I didn't want that to happen again.

As for the particulars on the issue between you and sat, the other mods are a lot more knowledgable about it than I, so I'll just sit back and watch for now.

ibGoodEnuf 09-18-02 09:55 PM

I want to personally thank the mods that took the time to respond to my threads. I can only imagine how difficult your jobs are and sympathize. I just needed to make a few observations. I feel my position has been heard at this point and I am glad. I am not here to flame, but make no mistake; if I see something written that is incorrect or misleading, I will pull that poster's covers. Again, Juice, I have been visiting this site alongside ya for a long time now and have always had nothing but the uptmost respect for you. You have always been kind and funny. Most importantly you have always been there to assist people with questions. I hope no hard feelings exist between myself and any other member of this board.

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