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-   -   There is a God: Sega Model 3 Emulation (http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=24149)

NickSpolec 01-28-04 03:35 AM

There is a God: Sega Model 3 Emulation
 
Woot.

http://www.system16.com/model3/

Model 3 rocks.

Edge 01-28-04 04:31 AM

Whoa, dude, a Model 3 emulator? Interesting to say the least, I never thought it would happen. I'm suprised at how many games were based on the Model 3 hardware, should be very interesting when it's done (I'd love to be able to play L.A.Machineguns again). Though most Model 3 games were ported to the Dreamcast, but there's still a few that are arcade-exclusive.

Edit: OMG, I just realised...THE LOST WORLD! God I want to play that game again :drooling:
When's this emulator getting done, I need it now!!!

sytaylor 01-28-04 05:34 AM

AMEN :angel:

Ok so its gonna be years before even model 1 emulation is any good, or the stv-titan, and nobody emulated the saturn/stv-titan yet. That said MAME does seem to drive a lot of development in the arcade area.

Just noticed " The emulator will be released when it's done, so don't expect a release any time soon and don't ask about it."

Which is good news for them, meaning no n00bs asking why it isnt running at 100fpS'es on their p2 450.

NickSpolec 01-28-04 09:34 AM

Quote:

Though most Model 3 games were ported to the Dreamcast, but there's still a few that are arcade-exclusive.
Most Model 3 Step 1, Step 1.5, and Step 2.0 were ported (with the notably exceptions of Harley Davidson and Scud Race/Super GT). However, none of the Model 3 Step 2.1 games were ported (with the exception of Virtua Striker 2 '99). Like following...

Daytona USA 2
Daytona USA 2 Power Edition
Dirt Devils
Emergency Call Ambulance
L.A.Machineguns : Rage of the Machines
Magical Truck Adventure Ocean Hunter
Spike Out
Spike Out Final Edition
Star Wars Trilogy

Must... Have... Daytona 2...

fivefeet8 01-28-04 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by sytaylor
AMEN :angel:

Ok so its gonna be years before even model 1 emulation is any good, or the stv-titan, and nobody emulated the saturn/stv-titan yet. That said MAME does seem to drive a lot of development in the arcade area.

Actually, sega Titan/STV arcade games have already been emulated. Mame runs some STV/Titan games. NebulaM2(a released model 2 emulator), runs several Model 2 games in it's early state. Satourne, a sega saturn emulator, also emulates Titan/STV games. Model 1 games have been emulated with the Model 1 emulator, Modular. Albeit most of these emus still have bugs to work out with most games, the games are running. And most of the games are very playable.

NickSpolec 01-28-04 02:58 PM

Quote:

Actually, sega Titan/STV arcade games have already been emulated. Mame runs some STV/Titan games. NebulaM2(a released model 2 emulator), runs several Model 2 games in it's early state. Satourne, a sega saturn emulator, also emulates Titan/STV games. Model 1 games have been emulated with the Model 1 emulator, Modular. Albeit most of these emus still have bugs to work out with most games, the games are running. And most of the games are very playable.
Actually, it's called Modeler. And it only emulates the 2D graphics of the Model 1 hardware (like backgrounds and such), not the 3D graphics. This is due to the fact that the TGP chip that handles the 3D graphics on the Model 1 hardware has no public documentation available, and it is an extremely difficult chip to understand.

Edge 01-28-04 11:56 PM

Wait...I thought Daytona 2 was ported to the Dreamcast (complete with Online play)? Or was that a different game?

And I guess The Lost World is one of the notable exceptions for non-Step 2.1 games that were not ported to the Dreamcast, thought I can't imagine why as it would've made a GREAT light-gun game to compliment House of the Dead 2 (L.A. Machineguns would've been nice, as well).

BTW, anyone else think it's amazing that some of those Model 3 games STILL look very good even compaired to modern games? Pretty damn impressive for hardware from 1996, wasn't that around the time that the first 3d accelerated PC games started hitting the market? There's a pretty stark contrast between Virtua Fighter 3 and GLQuake! Of course, the hardware probably costed a wee bit more as well ;)

sytaylor 01-29-04 02:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by fivefeet8
Actually, sega Titan/STV arcade games have already been emulated. Mame runs some STV/Titan games. NebulaM2(a released model 2 emulator), runs several Model 2 games in it's early state. Satourne, a sega saturn emulator, also emulates Titan/STV games. Model 1 games have been emulated with the Model 1 emulator, Modular. Albeit most of these emus still have bugs to work out with most games, the games are running. And most of the games are very playable.
The point i was making was that in the 10 years since their release they haven't been emulated anywhere near the level of the n64.. sure they show a few frames but in that amount of ttime for development i'd have wanted more, but i guess there just isnt the enthusiasm in arcade emulation..

Edge 01-29-04 03:19 AM

Well, partially it's a lack of enthusiasm, and partially because it's simply more difficult to get technical data on the hardware to emulate it. At least with consoles you can take the hardware apart and see what's in it and maybe how it works, but with arcade stuff you basicly have to rely on tech documents and pray you can somehow guess the right way to emulate it. Not to mention getting Roms to test the emulator with is very difficult (who has access to an arcade cabinate that's willing to take it apart and upload the rom data?).

But in any case, I really hope this project puts out a fully functioning Model 3 emulator in the end. It'll probably take them a while, but it'll be worth the wait if I can try some old classics like L.A. Machineguns and Lost World without having to track down an arcade machine (they were replaced by other games at my "local" arcade).

Oh, and it's interesting to note that even Gamecube emulators are currently more advanced then 90% of arcade emulators out there. Certainly goes to show how much easier/popular console emulation is.

sytaylor 01-29-04 04:58 AM

I've been offering my soul for anyone who could make a scud race emulator.. the closest ive got is the mp3s of some of the level soundtracks. I LOVED that game, if i could get it working witht eh forced feedback steering wheel, i think i'd consider never leaving my room again.

D.K.Tronics 01-29-04 05:43 AM

Quote:

The point i was making was that in the 10 years since their release they haven't been emulated anywhere near the level of the n64.. sure they show a few frames but in that amount of ttime for development i'd have wanted more, but i guess there just isnt the enthusiasm in arcade emulation..
It's got nothing to do with enthusiasm, it's more to do with a lack of hardware documentation.

If those programmers had the exact information that they require, say 5 years ago, we'd have an almost arcade perfect Model 2/3 emulator, today.

Look at this quote from their site

Quote:

Someone sent us some documentation on the Real3D Pro-1000 programmer's API. Although it doesn't contain hardware-level information or descriptions of how the data structures are layed out, it will be useful nonetheless. The Pro-1K seems to be a bit more sophisticated than Model 3 but the 2 machines are definitely closely related
And there's far more documented detailed N64 hardware, out there, than any of these Model 2/3 boards.
Hence, we now have almost perfect N64 emulation with Pj64, and 1964.
AFAIK, Their cores are pretty much complete. And it's now down to the plugin developers to perfect their plugins.

Look at Playstation emulation, it's taken 8 years to get to this stage. Now we have ePSXe, with Pete's superb OpenGL 2 plugin, and all sorts of shaders to play with.

NickSpolec 01-29-04 08:18 AM

Quote:

Wait...I thought Daytona 2 was ported to the Dreamcast (complete with Online play)? Or was that a different game?
Na-uh. That was just an upgraded version of the original with 3 or 4 completely new stages. While it looked amazing (still one of the best looking games on Dreamcast), it wasn't Daytona 2 (though, they could have easily added the Daytona 2 stages).


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