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Old 09-26-07, 11:38 PM   #121
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I'm not going to dispute that there are a lot of applications for which Java is nto appropriate. However, I will dispute that Java applications have to be slow. I've spent quite a bit of time at my current job proving otherwise.

A lot of people are concerned with what they've heard about Java and think the performance of the VM and garbage collection is a risk... but what I've found is that actual execution performance of Java is rarely the bottleneck. One reason for Java's perceived slowness is again, Swing... and it's lack of desktop hardware acceleration support. It's more likely to be I/O, poor memory management (again, a lot of Java developers think you can ignore this, which often results in bloated, leaky, nasty code), or poor selection of algorithms... though I suppose any of these can vary based on your app's profile. Garbage collection is much less of an issue than it used to be, too, though there's still room for improvement.

All things considered, I'd prefer C++ for most projects (mostly b/c it gives the programmer more control, and I hate Java's attempts to hide pointers from you), but that doesn't mean Java doesn't have uses.
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Old 09-27-07, 12:58 AM   #122
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@ rhink: .net does not tie you to just the Windows platform - check out the Mono project.

Also, I agree with you about Java *programmers* being the problem, and not the language. For some reason, Java progrogrammers do not seem to be nearly as concerned about performance as C progeammers (I think it is generally because of the types of applications made in Java versus C).

Finally, I personally do not see a problem with Java lacking pointers (at the programmer view), but if you need them, check out C#.
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Old 09-27-07, 10:13 PM   #123
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@ rhink: .net does not tie you to just the Windows platform - check out the Mono project.
There is no way I would trust anything cross-platform to a language Microsoft controls. They have way too much incentive to tie you to their platform, and even if they're tolerating Mono now that doesn't mean they won't sue them into oblivion at some point (or even more likely find some technical method of making things difficult for other platforms).
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Old 09-28-07, 12:57 AM   #124
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Didn't know about mono, looks pretty cool, but I'd have some serious reservations about trusting it for anything very important. It seems like more of a way to give pre-existing .NET apps more platform flexibility than a reason to use .NET to develop for non-MS platforms.
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Old 10-17-07, 06:10 PM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhink
Didn't know about mono, looks pretty cool, but I'd have some serious reservations about trusting it for anything very important. It seems like more of a way to give pre-existing .NET apps more platform flexibility than a reason to use .NET to develop for non-MS platforms.
Well all the new Gnome stuff will be done in c# using mono and gtk#.
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Old 10-17-07, 06:19 PM   #126
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Originally Posted by Banko
Well all the new Gnome stuff will be done in c# using mono and gtk#.
And green unicorns will fill the sky. No, seriously, where did you get this? I know there are plans/initial work C# API for GNOME- and GTK+-libraries, but "all the new Gnome stuff will be done in c# using mono"?
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Old 10-18-07, 09:30 AM   #127
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And green unicorns will fill the sky. No, seriously, where did you get this? I know there are plans/initial work C# API for GNOME- and GTK+-libraries, but "all the new Gnome stuff will be done in c# using mono"?
Well the new apps are for example right now F-Spot, Beagle and TomBoy are written in c# and use gtk# for the GUI.
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Old 10-18-07, 12:50 PM   #128
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Well the new apps are for example right now F-Spot, Beagle and TomBoy are written in c# and use gtk# for the GUI.
Yes, there are new GNOME applications that are written in C#, and I believe there will be more. What I don't believe is that "all the new Gnome stuff will be done in c# using mono and gtk#". If GNOME project decided that "from now on, all new GNOME applications shall be written in C#", I'm sure they would lose a lot of developers.

Personally I don't know C#, so I don't have any real opinnions about it. Generally speaking I like the fact that we have several languages as this allows using correct tool for a given task. C# API for GTK? Sure, sounds great.
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Old 10-19-07, 08:52 AM   #129
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Have you used VS 2003 in your professional projects and had to migrate them to VS 2005? If so, have you encountered any problems along the way?
Yes, and to tell you the truth i don't like the whole migration process. Sometimes it will work, and sometimes it doesn't. It creates additional garbage along the way. I rewrite any app writen in VS 2003 to .NET2.0 platform. Also if you use sql connection to oracle or sql i follow a new tri-tier model presentation-data-business layer.
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Old 10-20-07, 02:23 AM   #130
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Yes, there are new GNOME applications that are written in C#, and I believe there will be more. What I don't believe is that "all the new Gnome stuff will be done in c# using mono and gtk#". If GNOME project decided that "from now on, all new GNOME applications shall be written in C#", I'm sure they would lose a lot of developers.

Personally I don't know C#, so I don't have any real opinnions about it. Generally speaking I like the fact that we have several languages as this allows using correct tool for a given task. C# API for GTK? Sure, sounds great.
Have you ever used the crap that is GObject?
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Old 10-20-07, 05:50 AM   #131
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Originally Posted by Banko
Have you ever used the crap that is GObject?
And being paid for it? For years.
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