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Old 07-04-08, 09:26 PM   #13
methimpikehoses
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Default Re: HD 4870 vs GTX 260

 
Old 07-04-08, 09:43 PM   #14
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Default Re: HD 4870 vs GTX 260

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Originally Posted by methimpikehoses View Post
LOL i dont intend to get to that point. both the 260 & the 4870 are great products!
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Old 07-04-08, 09:51 PM   #15
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Default Re: HD 4870 vs GTX 260

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Originally Posted by SH64 View Post
There is no point of that FS bench since it dosen't show the min.fps
Since when does a minimum framerate not factor into an average?

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its obvious & logical that the GTX260's min.fps would've been higher if it was in that benchmark i posted (due to its higher Video Memory).
No, it wouldn't, and here's why.

Frame-buffer and overall memory bandwidth have the same effect and are interrelated. In fact, you could think of memory bandwidth as composed of 3 key components:

1) Frame buffer
2) Bus width
3) VRAM speed

Each of these plays a role in boosting peak memory bandwidth to speed up texture loading/streaming.

Quote:
As of 2007, advanced personal computers and graphics cards use even more combined buses than dual-channel, and combine four (e.g. Mac Pro), five (e.g. nVidia 8800GTS), six (e.g. nVidia 8800GTX) [b]or more sets of 64-bit memory modules and buses to reach 256-bit, 320-bit, 384-bit or greater total memory bandwidth.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory_bandwidth

The point of the entire exercise of using a large frame buffer is to increase bandwidth, but if a card already has it due to faster VRAM (such as 4870 with GDDR5 instead of GDDR3) then it doesn't need as large a frame buffer. See how the 4870 has just a little higher bandwidth than the 260 does despite the smaller frame buffer:

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3341
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Old 07-04-08, 09:52 PM   #16
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Default Re: HD 4870 vs GTX 260

they both are pretty similar, slight nod to the 4870 on performance, but the more memory on the gtx 260 makes the 2 cards even in my eyes.
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Old 07-04-08, 10:11 PM   #17
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Default Re: HD 4870 vs GTX 260

well...you have to look at the price as well..

The price on the ati cards make it very attractive...and i wouldn't mind buying a 4870..and then maybe early 2009 upgrade to like the next nvidia gpu refresh...which would be more friendly on your pocket...than say buying a gtx280 and to find out there is like a gtx290...1gb gddr5, die shrink/higher clock/better cooler...
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Old 07-05-08, 03:32 AM   #18
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Default Re: HD 4870 vs GTX 260

I would if figures like that appeared, once you get past 60 it doesn't matter anymore.
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Old 07-05-08, 10:09 AM   #19
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Default Re: HD 4870 vs GTX 260

Yeah, a lot of people have taken the 260/280 bashing too far. The only reason the 4870 over the 260GTX in reviews was because of price. If nVidia has dropped the price to of the 260 to 299 (the same price as the 4870) I would say the 260GTX is the better purchase because of more memory and future games will have larger textures.

And the 280GTX is still the fastest single chip card out there, there is no disputing that.
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Old 07-05-08, 10:54 AM   #20
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Default Re: HD 4870 vs GTX 260

Coming from an 8800GTX which I enjoyed for more than 2 years, I had the Itch for a new card.

So when the 4850 came out I just happen to have changed out my mob for a Maximus Formula Asus board and it was crossfire ready after reading a ton of review I couldn’t help but be compelled by the price vs. performance the card provided.

Also given that it was putting up a great fight against a 280GTX I headed over to BestBuy and the Visiontek 4850 could be had for 149.99 ea. so for 300.00 I got similar result as an 280GTX.

I purchased 2 of them for a little Crossfire action and couldn’t be happier. My purchases are based on best bang for the buck 4850 is just that especially at 300.00 a pair.
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Old 07-05-08, 11:06 AM   #21
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Default Re: HD 4870 vs GTX 260

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Originally Posted by abtomat74 View Post
Of course it factors, but here is how failing to disclose it can skew the end result:

Duke Nukem Never scores(hypothetically)
card 1) min - 15, max - 75, AVG - 45fps
card 2) min - 25, max - 65, AVG - 45fps

Which card would you choose if every game played like the above results? Would you sacrifice 10 min fps for 10 more max?
You're correct to an extent. But how do any of us know that the minimum framerate posted on a benchmark for a certain card wasn't a single instance that lasted a fraction of a second instead of a repeated occurrence?

That's why I think it's better to place more emphasis on an average, because over the course of the benchmark it will factor in the entire range of frames where the minimums took place. This would exclude cases where a driver/card had a certain hiccup that may have caused an abnormal hitch/minimum for a very short time.
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Old 07-05-08, 11:17 AM   #22
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Default Re: HD 4870 vs GTX 260

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Originally Posted by Xion X2 View Post
Since when does a minimum framerate not factor into an average?



No, it wouldn't, and here's why.

Frame-buffer and overall memory bandwidth have the same effect and are interrelated. In fact, you could think of memory bandwidth as composed of 3 key components:

1) Frame buffer
2) Bus width
3) VRAM speed

Each of these plays a role in boosting peak memory bandwidth to speed up texture loading/streaming.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory_bandwidth

The point of the entire exercise of using a large frame buffer is to increase bandwidth, but if a card already has it due to faster VRAM (such as 4870 with GDDR5 instead of GDDR3) then it doesn't need as large a frame buffer. See how the 4870 has just a little higher bandwidth than the 260 does despite the smaller frame buffer:

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3341
Since when does framebuffer size effect bandwidth? If I have 512mb of ram on a 256bit bus or 256mb ram on a 256bit bus, the bandwidth would be the same. More ram is always better, when trhe gpu is actually powerful enough to make use of it. The gddr5 is not gonna make up for the 4870's short comings in the ram department. High levels of AA, AF and high resolutions require more ram.
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Old 07-05-08, 11:24 AM   #23
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Default Re: HD 4870 vs GTX 260

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Originally Posted by SH64 View Post
LOL i dont intend to get to that point. both the 260 & the 4870 are great products!
Exactly! I have only used a 4870, but I would bet the 260 is a nice product as well. I think everyone should be happy that both companies released good products this time around.
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Old 07-05-08, 11:32 AM   #24
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Default Re: HD 4870 vs GTX 260

Quote:
The gddr5 is not gonna make up for the 4870's short comings in the ram department. High levels of AA, AF and high resolutions require more ram.
Then why does the 4870 scale better going from 4 to 8xAA than any other card on the market? If frame buffer were the key component, then you wouldn't see this happening:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anand
G80 and GT200 all have sharp drops in performance when moving up from 4xAA to 8xAA, the RV770 really shines here. In fact, the few tests we did with 8xAA paints the 4870 in a much better light relative to the GTX 280.
http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3341&p=10
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