MMORPGs are getting to easy and taking too much time

[DansFace]

Originally Posted by CaptnStubing

LMAO! the more difficult MMOs are a time sink. They invented the time sink.

right

[DansFace]

I like the idea they are doing Wrath of the Lich King. Instances that are short, but have difficult encounters

[jeffmd]

#1 eq didn't have that much of a danger. Between invis potions, invis spells, leading up to corpse summoning, grave yards, and eventualy decomposed corpses being transported to a whole different zone, losing your item wasn't a danger.

#2 If wow was so easy then everyone would be killing illidan. Since that number is actually well below 1/10th of those in guilds, I will infact say he is not. I am in a sunwell guild (priest) and for a game that people keep saying is easy, we sure seem to boot enough applicants who show otherwise. Are there easy parts of it? sure.. you dont make much money keeping people around if only the smart ones stay. But if you don't find things that are difficult to do in it, you arn't trying hard enough.

And like the captin said, wow is better then eq in every way possible. Everyone gets hearth (while melee are screwed in eq). Alot more environmental interaction allows for more strategic boss events (Imagin trying to do the split second timing of the cubes on mags using the eq engine). Bosses are ALLWAYS up, quest mobs are ALLWAYS up, theres no such thing as a place holder (go go 48 hour jboots camp). Spawns arnt 27 minutes.

I could go on..

[Dvahlish]

Originally Posted by jeffmd

#1 eq didn't have that much of a danger. Between invis potions, invis spells, leading up to corpse summoning, grave yards, and eventualy decomposed corpses being transported to a whole different zone, losing your item wasn't a danger.

#2 If wow was so easy then everyone would be killing illidan. Since that number is actually well below 1/10th of those in guilds, I will infact say he is not. I am in a sunwell guild (priest) and for a game that people keep saying is easy, we sure seem to boot enough applicants who show otherwise. Are there easy parts of it? sure.. you dont make much money keeping people around if only the smart ones stay. But if you don't find things that are difficult to do in it, you arn't trying hard enough.

And like the captin said, wow is better then eq in every way possible. Everyone gets hearth (while melee are screwed in eq). Alot more environmental interaction allows for more strategic boss events (Imagin trying to do the split second timing of the cubes on mags using the eq engine). Bosses are ALLWAYS up, quest mobs are ALLWAYS up, theres no such thing as a place holder (go go 48 hour jboots camp). Spawns arnt 27 minutes.

I could go on..

hehehe...true true..but I think I would put it the other way around to be honest.
Wow is easy but SOME parts are hard

[Mr.Schme]

Originally Posted by DansFace

I like the idea they are doing Wrath of the Lich King. Instances that are short, but have difficult encounters

That was the point of BWL. Im not saying that it failed, but things went back to the way they were.

[CaptnStubing]

Originally Posted by Dvahlish

hehehe...true true..but I think I would put it the other way around to be honest.
Wow is easy but SOME parts are hard

This is more accurate but to hit it spot in this is WoW in a nutshell. WoW is easy but stupid people make it hard.

My group that hangs out on vent and plays WoW with me were commenting on what we like about WoW. We were PVPing and crushing people. Just smashing the hell out of them. When we died we rezed and started crushing again. One guy said "this is fun. When I die I can get right back into the action". Then we were talking about the idiots standing around in a raid wating for people to get back to their keyboard so they can pull the next boss or listening to the raid leader bark out instructions to the stupid because the sat for 3 hours watching videos on how to kill that dumb ass boss. Then your gear may or may not drop or you don't have enough DKP. F THAT! Give me PVP. You get in on instant action and can laugh your ass off. And get this, while you are having FUN you can get gear along the way

Screw raider and grinding wh0res. Get in a battleground and I'll crush your pretty tier 5 gear you spent 5 months waiting in line to get.

[CaptnStubing]

Originally Posted by Mr.Schme

That was the point of BWL. Im not saying that it failed, but things went back to the way they were.

No it wasn't. BWL was the same as MC. The only difference were the bosses were far more technical. There was tons of trash mob in BWL. Ever been to the brood room?

My issues with MMOs now is that there all so similar and solo focused. Im not a solo player, I liked MMOs in the past for the grouping aspect and would continue to play them if they were still focused on it now. Problem is that developers want to make sure all content is accessible to everyone... not just the people who put the effort, they just hand the player content rather then the player working on accessing the content and earning it.

[Ninjaman09]

Originally Posted by CaptnStubing

No it wasn't. BWL was the same as MC. The only difference were the bosses were far more technical. There was tons of trash mob in BWL. Ever been to the brood room?

You can't honestly compare the trash in BWL to the trash in MC. MC was full of standard pulls then bosses. BWL had far less trash pulls and the broodlord room trash was part of the encounter and certainly wasn't handled like normal trash pulls at all.

BWL was focused solely on the boss encounters. The trash post-broodlord was to pace the raid. A good raiding guild could clear BWL in under 3 hours and spend the majority of the time handling the bosses. In MC the time was due to the large size of the instance and the ridiculous amount of trash.

Originally Posted by |MaguS|

Problem is that developers want to make sure all content is accessible to everyone... not just the people who put the effort, they just hand the player content rather then the player working on accessing the content and earning it.

That's BS. You hear the same crap on the WoW forums. If the content is so easily accessible, why aren't more people running Black Temple and Sunwell in WoW? Just because there is a large amount of content available to casual/solo players doesn't mean there isn't also challenging content available for people who are interested in that. And the fact that you characterize the large amount of content available to all types of players as a "problem" is indicitive of an elitist attitude which is disconnected from what most players want.

[CaptnStubing]

Originally Posted by Ninjaman09

You can't honestly compare the trash in BWL to the trash in MC. MC was full of standard pulls then bosses. BWL had far less trash pulls and the broodlord room trash was part of the encounter and certainly wasn't handled like normal trash pulls at all.

Yes I can. I spend months and months in both of them as you did and there wasn't much difference between the two in time spent. Yeah they cut down on the trash mob but there was not a huge difference.

The brood room is two parts and it was ALL trash mobs. LOL Just because warlocks got to shine there doesn't mean they are not trash mobs. LOL!

BWL was focused solely on the boss encounters. The trash post-broodlord was to pace the raid. A good raiding guild could clear BWL in under 3 hours and spend the majority of the time handling the bosses. In MC the time was due to the large size of the instance and the ridiculous amount of trash.

It still averaged out to about the same time as MC. They both were time sinks and sucked. Actually I liked MC better.

That's BS. You hear the same crap on the WoW forums. If the content is so easily accessible, why aren't more people running Black Temple and Sunwell in WoW? Just because there is a large amount of content available to casual/solo players doesn't mean there isn't also challenging content available for people who are interested in that. And the fact that you characterize the large amount of content available to all types of players as a "problem" is indicitive of an elitist attitude which is disconnected from what most players want.

If you like games that punish you for playing then play all the "fantastic" games by the people who made EQ *cough*Vanguard*cough*. If you don't then play games like WoW. It really friking doesn't matter. Just stop complaining about games you don't like being to easy. NO ONE FRIKING CARES! This is what I hate about gamers. They constantly complain about **** they don't like. Then don't play the damn game.

[Ninjaman09]

Originally Posted by CaptnStubing

Yes I can. I spend months and months in both of them as you did and there wasn't much difference between the two in time spent. Yeah they cut down on the trash mob but there was not a huge difference.

The brood room is two parts and it was ALL trash mobs. LOL Just because warlocks got to shine there doesn't mean they are not trash mobs. LOL!

Uh...if you really spent that much time in BWL then you know that the brood room consisted mainly of a non-stop grind to the boss, which involved less tanking than healing and mana conservation. You approached it completely differently from any other trash area. It was the first "gauntlet" type area in the game. Did you actually ever finish BWL?

Originally Posted by CaptnStubing

It still averaged out to about the same time as MC. They both were time sinks and sucked. Actually I liked MC better.

Again I'd have to ask if you ever actually finished BWL...I cannot honestly conceive of how anyone could prefer MC. Not only was it shorter, but the time spent in the instance was almost 70% boss fights compared to MC's 20-25%. Nefarian alone took almost 20 minutes. Trash pulls are always boring but in MC they constituted the vast majority of the time spent in the instance. I can count on my hands how many pulls there were in BWL, in MC I can't even remember how many there were. The bosses were all tank-and-spank encounters in MC as well while in BWL each fight offered a unique mechanic which improved the quality of all the players in the raid and most importantly was fun to learn. Honestly you'd have to know literally nothing about the game or care absolutely nothing about the strategic element of raiding to prefer MC.

Originally Posted by CaptnStubing

If you like games that punish you for playing then play all the "fantastic" games by the people who made EQ *cough*Vanguard*cough*. If you don't then play games like WoW. It really friking doesn't matter. Just stop complaining about games you don't like being to easy. NO ONE FRIKING CARES! This is what I hate about gamers. They constantly complain about **** they don't like. Then don't play the damn game.

QFT...very tiresome to hear these unwarranted complaints over and over again.

I don't play games I complain about... Stopped playing WoW because all I did was solo... I loved EQ but I stopped playing it since I didn't have the time that it required.

I love raiding and grouping. I am a bser, I can group with the same people over and over as long as they are capable players and entertaining to hang around with. You can be the best player but if I can't stand being around you, I wont group with you anymore.

MMOs for me are all about the community and player base. If Im soloing 90% of the time then that game isn't for me.