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Old 03-17-09, 08:23 AM   #25
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Default Re: And the fastest browser is ... IE8 :)

There's a lot of was and weres in your comments about Firefox. You are comparing a new browser to the way Firefox was. The latest FF beta builds smoke IE8 hands down.
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Old 03-17-09, 08:28 AM   #26
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Default Re: And the fastest browser is ... IE8 :)

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Originally Posted by Tr1cK View Post
There's a lot of was and weres in your comments about Firefox.
True. But XUL concept of Firefox has not changed, also rather primitive functionality that has to be enhanced by 10+ plugins remained (which make it crawl).

UI of even Firefox 3 is very primitive, still reminds me of IE6 UI from 2001. There is not even "new tab" button by default, they still mimic IE6 UI behaviour... IE8 and Safari 4 are true modern browsers. Perhaps also Opera.
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Old 03-17-09, 08:47 AM   #27
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Default Re: And the fastest browser is ... IE8 :)

There is a new tab button, right beside the current tabs, it's a green +. You can also ctrl+click like anything to just jerk open a new window. I ctrl+click the home button or search button all the time. The UI may not be shiny by default, but you can get different themes for it.
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Old 03-17-09, 09:38 AM   #28
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Default Re: And the fastest browser is ... IE8 :)

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Originally Posted by Sazar View Post
In real world testing, IE7 and IE8 have typically both been faster for me than Firefox. Chrome is pretty fast itself but Opera is still the speed-demon. That sucker just RIPS.
According to Peacekeeper tests, the fastest browser regarding script speed is in fact Safari 4, then Chrome and first in third place Opera. But of course this is just one test suite targeted on scripts.

Btw, you can test here;
http://service.futuremark.com/peacekeeper/index.action
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Old 03-17-09, 10:26 AM   #29
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Default Re: And the fastest browser is ... IE8 :)

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Originally Posted by LovingSticky View Post
True. But XUL concept of Firefox has not changed, also rather primitive functionality that has to be enhanced by 10+ plugins remained (which make it crawl).
Last time you complained it was about the fact that those 10+ plugins make FF's startup slow. Now you're saying it crawls for you all the time?

Also, how do you like the similar functionality of those 10+ plugins in your vanilla IE8? Oh I forgot, there's none. But I know you'd rather sacrifice -10secons of startup time as that seem(ed) to be your preference.
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Old 03-17-09, 11:18 AM   #30
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Default Re: And the fastest browser is ... IE8 :)

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Originally Posted by LovingSticky View Post
That is not true at all.

IE6 was introduced in 2001, and at that time, it was an excellent browser. Microsoft introduced XmlHttpRequest, and gave birth to modern AJAX technologies (yes, Microsoft basically invented AJAX).

Take any other browser from 2001 and no modern 2009 website will work in it. IE6? Not always 100%, but it can cope with most of them.

Let's face it: IE6 from 2001 was so good people are still using it in 2009. That is not true of any other browser.

IE7, launched in 2006, was innovative as well - great UI, especially. With IE7Pro and Roboform is it a solid browsing and user experience.

IE8 has excellent core, microformats, indepedent threads for tabs (Microsoft introduced it before Google Chrome).

So, why some people hate Microsoft browsers? First, there is ActiveX. Great technology which makes it possible to run basically any code on your machine, which had also serious security implications (non IT-educated users clicking on "Allow" all the time, letting code that can do anything in). Second, there was a big gap between IE6 and IE7 launches, which made room for other browsers (namely: Firefox).

Firefox was slow, did not have ActiveX, UI was written in extremely slow XUL, did not even have proper name (remember Phoenix and Firebird?), but behaved similarly like IE6, and it was not from Microsoft. So people installed it. If you remember Firefox 1.0, it basically copied IE6 looks, tabs were an afterthought (stolen from Opera anyway), and poorly implemented. Still, there were no ActiveX controls, so people could not click on "Allow" and they (falsely) believed Firefox to be safer.

Now, IE8 is the best choice without any doubt. But latest Safari 4 looks promissing as well though.
You know I wonder if you have ever lifted a finger at trying to make standards compliant HTML/CSS. The point of having standards is that browser developers have a common set of rules that everyone can follow so dev's can use the same code and get the same output. There is NO bigger offender of proprietary junk, or just not following the rules than IE.

Active X is a bad idea almost all around. Its a security nightmare, and you are locking your applications to only windows users.

To go back to standards compliance, IE8 beta fails the acid3 test HARD, a tad better than IE7, but still fail. Some of MS .NET stuff doesn't even work right in IE... so I think you need to go back and rethink your argument there.

The reason why a lot of people still use IE is because of bad web devs/managers who think its ok to use bad web coding practices. MS did a good thing with Silverlight as far as concept and mostly in implantation. I have not had a chance to really dig into it yet.
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Old 03-17-09, 11:30 AM   #31
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Default Re: And the fastest browser is ... IE8 :)

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Originally Posted by lduguay View Post
Why bother with 2.13% of market share for web browsing...
IE(n) is used by 58% of people, 31% for FF...

http://www.w3counter.com/globalstats.php
As people more and more use other OS's, IE will become obsolete(it's going that way now). Firefox, Chrome and Opera have room to grow, IE only can claim back Windows users, which is about 10% lost just being a Windows only browser.

Safari has room to grow as well in both OS X and Windows so as shown, 58% is the lowest share ever for them.
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Old 03-17-09, 11:31 AM   #32
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Default Re: And the fastest browser is ... IE8 :)

Just tried Chrome because Opera is crashing too often for my liking.I will test it for a few days to see about stability,hasnt crashed yet :P
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Old 03-17-09, 11:39 AM   #33
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Default Re: And the fastest browser is ... IE8 :)

according to w3c:

http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_stats.asp

2009 IE7 IE6 IE8 Fx Chrome S O
February 25.4% 17.4% 0.8% 46.4% 4.0% 3.0% 2.2%
January 25.7% 18.5% 0.6% 45.5% 3.9% 3.0% 2.3%



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_s...f_web_browsers
says something slightly different, but its not at the 80% that it used to be to defend the mentality of only making it for IE because that's whats out there. When you do that you also knock out mobile browsers which are becoming more common.
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Old 03-17-09, 12:22 PM   #34
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Default Re: And the fastest browser is ... IE8 :)

Quote:
Originally Posted by LovingSticky View Post
That is not true at all.

IE6 was introduced in 2001, and at that time, it was an excellent browser. Microsoft introduced XmlHttpRequest, and gave birth to modern AJAX technologies (yes, Microsoft basically invented AJAX).

Take any other browser from 2001 and no modern 2009 website will work in it. IE6? Not always 100%, but it can cope with most of them.

Let's face it: IE6 from 2001 was so good people are still using it in 2009. That is not true of any other browser.

IE7, launched in 2006, was innovative as well - great UI, especially. With IE7Pro and Roboform is it a solid browsing and user experience.

IE8 has excellent core, microformats, indepedent threads for tabs (Microsoft introduced it before Google Chrome).

So, why some people hate Microsoft browsers? First, there is ActiveX. Great technology which makes it possible to run basically any code on your machine, which had also serious security implications (non IT-educated users clicking on "Allow" all the time, letting code that can do anything in). Second, there was a big gap between IE6 and IE7 launches, which made room for other browsers (namely: Firefox).

Firefox was slow, did not have ActiveX, UI was written in extremely slow XUL, did not even have proper name (remember Phoenix and Firebird?), but behaved similarly like IE6, and it was not from Microsoft. So people installed it. If you remember Firefox 1.0, it basically copied IE6 looks, tabs were an afterthought (stolen from Opera anyway), and poorly implemented. Still, there were no ActiveX controls, so people could not click on "Allow" and they (falsely) believed Firefox to be safer.

Now, IE8 is the best choice without any doubt. But latest Safari 4 looks promissing as well though.
it's partially true imo.

many of the sites i have developed (all private internal sites for DB management and what not) have had very minor issues with IE.

is that IE's fault? no, it's mine lol.

but IE is not as lenient as FF when it comes to HTML tags and spacing.
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Old 03-17-09, 01:04 PM   #35
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Default Re: And the fastest browser is ... IE8 :)

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Originally Posted by thor1182 View Post
You know I wonder if you have ever lifted a finger at trying to make standards compliant HTML/CSS.
I do webdesign for living, use IE6 (for testing), IE7, IE8, FF3, Opera 9.6, Safari 3 and Google Chrome 2 daily. And yes, all my websites are XHTML 1.0 STRICT compliant, without resorting to any hacks (except sometimes conditional CSS for IE6 from 2001). In Javascript, libraries like jQuery do all the hard work anyway on compatibility

My current browser of choice is IE7 + IE7Pro extension (adds functionality of 10+ Firefox plugins) + Roboform (excellent tool for different passwords for each website and for forms filling) + IE Developer Toolbar (Microsoft) + IE DebugBar (Core Services).

IE7 has sufficiently capable core, and UI rocks. I would use IE8 (much faster), but IE7Pro is (yet) not compatible with it, Firefox is too slow (use it sometimes because of excellent Firebug extension though), Safari is great in speed, but misses AdBlocking, mouse gestures, advanced dev tools.

Microsoft does not make bad browsers.

They have, in fact, great internet technology. I would choose Live.com Custom Domains over Google Apps (for your domain) anytime, same Silverlight 2 vs. Flash 10.

The only real complain about Microsoft is we should not wait for IE7 till 2006. In 2004, I was using Mozilla, later Opera. IE7 should be here by 2004 (latest).

But maybe they had some "political" (EU ruling) reasons for this delay... With Firefox having 30% of the market, any possible "fine" should be much lower

IE8 shows Microsoft is perfectly capable writing the best browser, if they want (or dev team is "allowed to")
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Old 03-17-09, 01:09 PM   #36
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Default Re: And the fastest browser is ... IE8 :)

You sir an an oddity to be a web dev and have that much of a hard on for IE. That or I call BS on things always working in all browsers without some IE specific style sheets, as the box model of IE has its own set of rules from the others.
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