Joining the Club

[hemmy]

I develop daily in C++ (Borland C++ Builder) why the hate

[DaveW]

If you want to jump into game programming with the 3 months of summer you have, I would start with C# (using Visual Studio 2008), then get into XNA.

I bashed out a simple game in XNA inside a day, I love it. With XNA you get results very quickly and it keeps you motivated to keep going. You really need the C# skillz first though. If you dive in to an XNA sample without understanding C# you'll get lost.

Don't listen to these guys telling you to start with C++. You'll spend hours and hours trying to get your code to compile - you'll pull your hair out, age several years, gain weight and develop strange sexual preferences, all because you left off an "&" in front of a variable name. I am sure i'll get flamed now by people saying "real programmers use C++".... bring it :P

[Sazar]

Originally Posted by hemmy

I develop daily in C++ (Borland C++ Builder) why the hate

Not really hate. It's just a little harder and when you have a relative newcomer to programming, without fundamentals, they will lose motivation if they don't grasp the concepts. I've seen it happen too often.

[thor1182]

I don't know, there is something to learning straight C first so you learn to appreciate what the more advanced languages and IED's give you for free.


1. Don't be afraid to fail at first, and then keep trying until you get it. Programming is very hard until your brain clicks, then its cake walk.

2. C is a more useful language to learn over VB. If you are familiar with C, learning Java, and C# is easy because you have already trained yourself to put that ; at the end of every line without thinking.

3. Don't be afraid to start small. Never underestimate the power of getting the hello world to work.

4. Google is your friend

5. Always keep in mind that there is always something new to learn and better ways. The worst thing is to think you know it all and end up making yourself a dinosaur.

6. Work smarter not harder

[Zhivago]

Originally Posted by DaveW

Don't listen to these guys telling you to start with C++. You'll spend hours and hours trying to get your code to compile - you'll pull your hair out, age several years, gain weight and develop strange sexual preferences, all because you left off an "&" in front of a variable name. I am sure i'll get flamed now by people saying "real programmers use C++".... bring it :P

"Real" programmers know different languages, from different paradigms, and then select the language that best fits with the problem, whether that be x86 asm or VB.Net.

Trivial syntax errors such as neglecting the address-of operator are easily fixed assuming you are using a sane (and modern) compiler.
Furthermore, they would exist much the same in C# - not a valid argument against C++ imho.

[Bman212121]

Originally Posted by Zhivago

You appear to be confused. Visual C++ can either refer to a C++ implementation (Microsoft's) or an IDE. Maybe what you meant to say is that you have used some C++ implementation such as GCC, and would like to try one of Microsoft's instead.

Yea I am confused. I've used C++ in Visual Studio, and it isn't fun at all because of the lack of libraries. I thought he meant another implementation of it that is easier to use.

Originally Posted by hemmy

I develop daily in C++ (Borland C++ Builder) why the hate

The thing with C++ is that it doesn't come with a lot of libraries. You probably have figured out all of the code you need to do things like check if a variable is a number, round it, convert variable types etc. When using VB .NET all of those functions are already there. You can use functions that are already in C to accomplish the task but that is kind of defeating the purpose (At least for a C++ class). To me it just felt like C++ was missing a lot of important functions. I spent more time in my C++ class just trying to figure out one way to accomplish a task, where using VB .Net I could focus on what I wanted to make the program do.

[Zhivago]

Originally Posted by Bman212121

Yea I am confused. I've used C++ in Visual Studio, and it isn't fun at all because of the lack of libraries. I thought he meant another implementation of it that is easier to use.

Umm.. well with Visual C++ you get the C++ standard library (this is required of any compliant C++ implementation) and access to numerous other libraries that are specific to the Windows API -- obviously you won't get those libraries in some Linux distro.

[Phyxion]

Originally Posted by Sazar

Learn C first I would say. Visual Studio is a must as a suite.

I really can't recommend to start with C at all, that's almost like telling someone to start with assembly. Don't get me wrong, C is nice, but not for starters. I'd recommend to start with C#, move to C++ after and if you are thinking C++ is nice you can try to look into C. I don't recommend to start with Java.

[thor1182]

Originally Posted by Phyxion

I really can't recommend to start with C at all, that's almost like telling someone to start with assembly. Don't get me wrong, C is nice, but not for starters. I'd recommend to start with C#, move to C++ after and if you are thinking C++ is nice you can try to look into C. I don't recommend to start with Java.

I can't speak for others, but to me when I say C, I generally mean C++. I mean some of the times you are using straight C is when you are working at the embedded level, and even then most embedded compilers will take C++. The only time you are working with low level C++/C is with EE programming. Most other times you are working with OS commands of some sort.

[walterman]

You must install Visual Studio 2008 Pro. That is sure.

Then, since you are a beginner, i would start with some "Hello World" programs in C#.

You will learn all the Object-oriented programming concepts with C# easily, and this will help you to move to the more 'serious' C++ world.

[Phyxion]

Originally Posted by walterman

You must install Visual Studio 2008 Pro. That is sure.

Then, since you are a beginner, i would start with some "Hello World" programs in C#.

You will learn all the Object-oriented programming concepts with C# easily, and this will help you to move to the more 'serious' C++ world.

I'd start with for-loops and if-statements, maybe combined with some prints to the console in C# (Console.WriteLine("Hello World"), and with some type checking, like "if (1 + 1 == 2) { //Do something here }". And some string operations. After that try to make a couple of functions and see what it does and how functions work. I wouldn't start making GUIs first, better do some code stuff first before adding GUI components. If you know the basic stuff it's easy to pick up on classes and other objects and making some other stuff. There are some pretty decent tutorials out there but don't forget to check for the date on them, better get some newer tutorials as some stuff has been changed over the years and improvements have been made. I'd also try to avoid some user posted content better go to some real tutorial websites with a decent reputation.

[Sazar]

Originally Posted by thor1182

I can't speak for others, but to me when I say C, I generally mean C++. I mean some of the times you are using straight C is when you are working at the embedded level, and even then most embedded compilers will take C++. The only time you are working with low level C++/C is with EE programming. Most other times you are working with OS commands of some sort.

That's basically what I meant