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Old 06-24-09, 08:55 PM   #1
pakotlar
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Default Just a thought on the state of pc gaming

So I got this pretty bad shoulder injury, and I'm sitting here like a lazy bum posting on a nerdy website (which I've been frequenting like a fiend for 12 years), but the time I've been a bit immobilized has given me space to do some thinking, and I just started smoking pot (because of the injury) since I couldn't sleep at night because of the pain & worry about the thing. I'm 23, and I've had this shoulder problem for 2 years in and out of operations it just sucks. Probably because of the pot, I just had this thought:

Ok, so I am an admitted pirate. Little caveat here is that for most of my gaming life I haven't been pirating anything, but I def. have stolen a fair share of games from torrents. I had this obsession with stealing when I was younger. I even went to jail for it once, for like 2 hours. But I shouldn't have pirated anything, that's a truth.

But now that I'm maturing and entering a more moral phase of my life, Ive essentially stopped torrenting anything, stopped DC++'ng anything, anyone who used Kazaa is a total idiot that program sucks, stopped Napstering anything (that was once a great service in like 98 or something when I was like 11 - 12 it was sweet and new). Now I'm starting to buy things. But the real question is what do I want to buy. And I realized I want to buy things that work as intended. The ability to pirate software contrasted with my decision not to really made me consider what I would, and would not, pay for. I understand now many of the issues I would put up with as a pirate, I wouldn't as a consumer.

And when I see a PC game, with my foreknowledge of their historical stability and polish, I don't get that confidence. There are so many freaking bugs in games, so many HW compatibility issues, that if I wasn't raised to be a little nerdy pasty kid, or especially if I was a bit older and hadn't learned to understand computers like my own hands, I wouldn't buy any PC games. I've decided now that I'm really not going to buy any games until I can read about them in the forums (PC only). My xbox360 is great. I mean I don't like it as much as my beautiful, sexy PC, and it red ringed on me, but you know what, at least I know if it isn't f'd up, the games will run beautifully. At least I have that confidence. I was just playing GRID on PC, and it kept crashing in the "Grid World" mode, and it isn't because of my overclocked PC (it's like 10 trillion or so OCCT 2.0 torture mode stable and at least hour Furmark 1.6 torture test stable). If I just dropped $50 or $60 bucks on a game, and I'm a working man (I'm not really yet, still in school), but point is, I respect my time, and if I buy something it better work. PC games just do not give you that confidence, that "yeah, no matter what, I'm putting this game in, and I will be playing it, nicely and smoothly unless its a fhead production, in like 5 minutes after I'm done playing with my penis). You just don't.

Sound off! Is the PC too unstable a platform, or rather do PC games not have enough QC to guarantee us the state [of the product] we need as the general consumer to buy with ? Or am I total narcissicist who likes hearing my own voice? Or I'm stoned? Or all 3? (all 3's the correct answer Ihink)

as an aside: What is the reason dev's are spending less time proportionally QC'in the balls off the PC games? What I mean is the QC spent on 1 console config proportional to the # of possible PC configurations (after # of possible PC configurations is * diminishing QC needs factor (say you only need to QC 60% of possible configs before having 95% confidence that the game will be fully playable). I think they're multiplying this * a third factor: the diminishing economies of scale (a cost directly proportional, however most probably can find a modular QC technique where this linear effect can be changed to a obtain a downard sloping log function) (in this case the third factor is directly linear with # of configs). whew! i haven't done that much math since high school thats just crazay.
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Old 06-24-09, 09:05 PM   #2
Dreamweavernoob
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Default Re: Just a thought on the state of pc gaming

Jussayin, but kazaa hasnt been used for yyyyyyyyyyyyears .

I buy what I can afford. I NEVER purchase a game from the shops now til I have downloaded it.

I am sick and tired of the hostility towards pc gamers. You can return a console game but not a PC game. If something goes wrong the attitude is basically one of **** off.


This goes for films but with a different argument.I brought a film once which I found very offensive in its view on things that I hold sacrasant. I was pissed of that I had financed some little ****'s point of view.

Inded I download a film now, and if I like it, then I will buy it on its first reduction.


The worthy ones get my money.
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Old 06-24-09, 09:16 PM   #3
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Default Re: Just a thought on the state of pc gaming

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Originally Posted by Dreamweavernoob View Post
Jussayin, but kazaa hasnt been used for yyyyyyyyyyyyears .

I buy what I can afford. I NEVER purchase a game from the shops now til I have downloaded it.

I am sick and tired of the hostility towards pc gamers. You can return a console game but not a PC game. If something goes wrong the attitude is basically one of **** off.


This goes for films but with a different argument.I brought a film once which I found very offensive in its view on things that I hold sacrasant. I was pissed of that I had financed some little ****'s point of view.

Inded I download a film now, and if I like it, then I will buy it on its first reduction.


The worthy ones get my money.
Dude that's what I mean! And that's the perfect idea, I'm going to download then buy too man, ur a geniuso. And yeah, I forgot to mention, no can return a game, so yeah, ur F*KED

and listen, that's what I meant, kazaa SUCKED the entire time it lived on the drives of little girls yearning for their sweet tranny hanson earporn (which I liked cuz I'm queer eyed but a straight guy!)
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Old 06-24-09, 09:56 PM   #4
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Default Re: Just a thought on the state of pc gaming

I'm to the point where I will buy a game and use the crack to avoid having to screw with the DRM. limited installs and activations??! WTF I bought the damn thing and here I am cracking games I bought so I dont have to deal with incompetent customer service idiots explaining to them I reinstalled Windows 7 a few times (going from build to build) in the last month and now I can't play the game anymore cause you only gave me 3 activations....

Seriously the state of PC gaming is as it is because of the developers. Thank God for the pirates they let me play my games without having to jump through hoops for more activations!! Sad, very sad. DRM isnt stopping the pirates, it's hurting the people that actually bought their game.
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Old 06-24-09, 10:15 PM   #5
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Default Re: Just a thought on the state of pc gaming

I don't believe that, piracy has been around longer than DRM. The developers have made things worse with DRM and limited installs, but it's not the developers as a whole, they are trying to make a living.

I remember in the 80's, games were around the same price, $30-50 bucks, average price was 39.95. I know this because I worked in a store when I was younger.

Games these days, 25 years later, cost millions to develop and are around $40-60.

Machines are much more complex and it's hard to code for every single hardware configuration, that's why there are QC problems. Most of the time, it's the users fault, a outdated driver, overclocking, malware, virus, HW conflict, etc. The average joe who meets a games requirements usually doesn't have issues.

I hate DRM just as much as anyone but it's pirates and torrent freaks that are making developers scramble for new ways to protect their work.

My thing is, I download the demo. No demo, no chance of buying unless it's a no brainer, like Diablo III. The same goes for MMO's, PC's, consoles. If I like the game a lot, I will get it, if I feel I can hold off for when it's on sale, I'll wait. It's that simple.
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Old 06-24-09, 10:55 PM   #6
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Default Re: Just a thought on the state of pc gaming

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Originally Posted by Yaboze View Post
I don't believe that, piracy has been around longer than DRM. The developers have made things worse with DRM and limited installs, but it's not the developers as a whole, they are trying to make a living.

I remember in the 80's, games were around the same price, $30-50 bucks, average price was 39.95. I know this because I worked in a store when I was younger.

Games these days, 25 years later, cost millions to develop and are around $40-60.

Machines are much more complex and it's hard to code for every single hardware configuration, that's why there are QC problems. Most of the time, it's the users fault, a outdated driver, overclocking, malware, virus, HW conflict, etc. The average joe who meets a games requirements usually doesn't have issues.

I hate DRM just as much as anyone but it's pirates and torrent freaks that are making developers scramble for new ways to protect their work.

My thing is, I download the demo. No demo, no chance of buying unless it's a no brainer, like Diablo III. The same goes for MMO's, PC's, consoles. If I like the game a lot, I will get it, if I feel I can hold off for when it's on sale, I'll wait. It's that simple.
yeah but the fact that our systems are more complex isn't a reflection on us, the helpless consumer! we buy our systems, being told that they can play all the latest games. we buy the games which promise to run like butter, or at least WORK on our brand new spanking, EXPENSIVE ASS computers, and then we're met with hoop after hoop that we have to jump through to get a working product! in no other sector is that true, and it is definetely not a practice that we ascribe will EVER ascribe to products that we spend our hard earned on! why should we demand anything less than what is promised us on the label?
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Old 06-24-09, 11:24 PM   #7
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Default Re: Just a thought on the state of pc gaming

I am not a software developer but pirating software is something I do not condone, for any reason.

This thread hints that, well more than hints that, there can be a legitimate reason to steal software. Apply the same mindset to stealing anything else besides intellectual property, which happens to be easy to steal these days. You will probably wound up dead or behind bars if you do. You cannot just grab purses as the invisible man - you will get seen and caught, or shot, because you are not invisable.

So, why does software look like something you can just steal? Soft target?

Doesn't matter. If it's for sale and you get it without paying for it or it being gifted to you, you stole it. Not that this is the argument in this thread. The argument is, or maybe the declaration of the OP is, it is justifyable to steal.

Dunno. Not what I was taught.
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Old 06-24-09, 11:39 PM   #8
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Default Re: Just a thought on the state of pc gaming

I feel like the problem is the lack of AAA title makers. I've always been willing to spend 50$ on iD, valve, and Blizzard. But so many developers release unfinished games and the whole industry really does suffer from it.

Oblivion, I think, is the perfect example of this. People expected that game to be so much better than it was, and spending fifty dollars on it was just such a disappointment. The game was moderately boring and had stupid bugs. There were some enjoyable quests, but the main story blew. There wasn't any diversity in the environments. The game just didn't seem like a finished game, the AI wasn't what it was supposed to be, etc and this is coming from a big developer that has made tons of money on the Elder Scrolls series.

That being said, I think valve is really going to save the industry. Steam prevents piracy, and the weekend sales really give you chance to play games for a good percentage off their original price. I've bought several titles through this, just because when they're on sale and available at my fingertips its so easy to make the purchase. That and the quality of the titles valve creates have created an amazing gaming eco system that more developers should follow.
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Old 06-24-09, 11:42 PM   #9
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Hey this to the post 2 back. About the thread espousing the moral merit of piracy.


no no no. the point isn't at all that its legal or even ok. i think that its very disruptive to the notion that pc gaming will be anything more than a sidenote in coming generations. sorry if I gave that impression.

it was more that the contrast between what I could accept as a pirate and what I could accept as a paying customer made me realize that one of the reasons that PC gaming is at such a loss, is that even after the piracy issue is solved, you're still left with an inferior platform, once you get past control issues (some games, for instance I believe will be a big draw for PC's because it just makes sense, MMO's are a typical target for this consumption), you are beginning to have few convincing compulsions for the PC platform. I'm a huge PC gamer, and I'd like to see it pick up on high-end exclusives. I think that piracy is a deterrent, but even without that, I don't think customers would go for PC's in as great a way as with consoles, and that a large part of that issue is the QC control of PC releases. There are a surprising number of oddities on the PC version of console ports or cross-platform titles, which seem to be the majority and will stay that way (if the proportion doesn't increase to the side of console-also releases).


edit: Heck even PC exclusives or, PC-developed games have issues. Fallout 3 was def. targeted at PC consumers, but had and STILL to this day has MASSIVE game ending issues. like the never ending crashes; sound issues are also bad.

Gears of War PC is another great example. Even SAVING the game is a pain in the ass, without having to use a very poorly integrated version of Xbox Live.
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Old 06-24-09, 11:45 PM   #10
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Default Re: Just a thought on the state of pc gaming

I was going to close this because its yet another piracy thread, but if you guys can keep it civil and don't out right promote piracy it can stay.
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Old 06-24-09, 11:49 PM   #11
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I was going to close this because its yet another piracy thread, but if you guys can keep it civil and don't out right promote piracy it can stay.
My crystal ball says you will be back CaptN
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Old 06-24-09, 11:51 PM   #12
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Default Re: Just a thought on the state of pc gaming

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I was going to close this because its yet another piracy thread, but if you guys can keep it civil and don't out right promote piracy it can stay.
Hey you know, to everyone whose going to post here. Please dont focus on the piracy. I was just trying to walk you through my ruminations, and why they came about. Piracy is a dead subject, beaten to death. The issue is the quality of games released on the platform, and the discussion is about whether or not the quality control of games on the platform is driving sales away to such a degree that it is giving extra momentum to the consoles. Piracy aside. Sorry that wasn't made very clear in the post.
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