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Old 11-22-09, 07:19 PM   #13
AaronP
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Default Re: Update to 190.42 breaks Xinerama AND TwinView!

Thank you for the comparison log file, desperadus. It appears that 185.18.14 was also unable to detect your monitor, but the signal you forced it to drive using ConnectedMonitor just happened to work for it. I'm not sure what would have changed with 190.42 that would have modified that behavior. The only thing I can think of is that the order of display devices changed and DFP-1 got assigned to a different display device, but that's pretty unlikely. I'll try to track down your GPU and force it to not detect my monitor and see if I can find out what changed between those two drivers.

Given that neither driver is able to read the required EDID information from your monitor, it seems likely that there is a hardware problem in the monitor or the cable connecting it to the GPU. If you have a different DVI cable, it might be worth giving that a try. it would also be interesting to see what the driver says it finds if you comment out the "ConnectedMonitor" line and start X with "startx -- -logverbose 6" from a console.
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Old 11-23-09, 09:57 PM   #14
desperadus
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Default Re: Update to 190.42 breaks Xinerama AND TwinView!

Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronP View Post
...
Given that neither driver is able to read the required EDID information from your monitor, it seems likely that there is a hardware problem in the monitor or the cable connecting it to the GPU. If you have a different DVI cable, it might be worth giving that a try. it would also be interesting to see what the driver says it finds if you comment out the "ConnectedMonitor" line and start X with "startx -- -logverbose 6" from a console.
May I advise you to check out what a Thinkpad W700ds is actually all about?
-> http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/Category:W700ds
There are *no* (external) cables between the two monitors.
There is no DVI connection to break down and there is no damaged chip set either - this baby was factory brand new when I bought it 4 month ago and the NVidia drivers work just fine on my Windoze partition.

The 2nd screen is built right into the unit, you just slide it out and you are in business - its that simple!
That 2nd screen even turns itself on & off, if its slid out/in.

And yes, I had my screen slid out when I tried those new drivers.
Not that the screen position bothered the old 185.14 much.

AS I said before, the NVidia driver 185.14 works flawlessly on this unit.
I have high resolution, high speed, Video Playback w/o problems and even when I ran an OpenGL benchmark, I stomped most (Windoze) PCs with fast GPUs into the ground.

It is beyond my appreciation why this fully functional setup was broken, why functionality was taken away - during a driver update.

If NVidia is that fickle about what features they keep supporting in new driver versions, then *please* disable the automated update in the install script
It took me all day to finally locate the "--no-network" switch amongst the Advanced options.

If that switch would have been the default, then I could have saved myself a lot of trouble here!
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Old 11-24-09, 03:35 PM   #15
conky
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Default Re: Update to 190.42 breaks Xinerama AND TwinView!

Are you sure you aren't using Lenovo's version of Nvidia's drivers on Windows? The nvidia website says this for the Windows drivers:
The following notebooks are not supported in this release:
3. Lenovo ThinkPad notebooks (please contact the notebook OEM for driver support for these notebooks)
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Old 11-25-09, 10:35 PM   #16
desperadus
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Default Re: Update to 190.42 breaks Xinerama AND TwinView!

Quote:
Originally Posted by conky View Post
Are you sure you aren't using Lenovo's version of Nvidia's drivers on Windows? The nvidia website says this for the Windows drivers:
The following notebooks are not supported in this release:
3. Lenovo ThinkPad notebooks (please contact the notebook OEM for driver support for these notebooks)
Yeah, you're right (you wish).
I am so dumb that I didn't realize I was running Windoze all these days!
These two operating systems look so damn' much alike that I can never keep them apart anyway.

And just by the way if, as you claim, NVidia doesn't support ThinkPads under Windoze, then how was I supposed to be testing their (supposedly non-existing) Windoze driver all last week and how the heck come I actually do have AN OFFICIAL NVIDIA driver on my Windoze partition (if they supposedly don't support it)?

You do know how to use Google, don't you?
Try this one for starters: "Thinkpad W700ds supported nvidia"
-> NVIDIA Display Driver for Win XP - ThinkPad W700, W700ds
-> NVIDIA Display Driver for Win Vista (64-bit) - ThinkPad W700, W700ds

Now lets try this one: Drivers and software - ThinkPad W700 and W700ds

Yep, I can see that NVidia most definitely does not provide Windows drivers for the W700ds...

By the way, in case you didn't notice drivers written for one Operating System don't run on another
Heck, in most cases they won't even run on a different version of the same OpSys.

Thanks a lot for the expert advise you (did not) give me today - another half hour of my life spend well that was :-(
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Old 11-25-09, 11:01 PM   #17
conky
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Default Re: Update to 190.42 breaks Xinerama AND TwinView!

Wow, you totally read that wrong and proved my point. I'm guessing English isn't your native tongue. Those links you pointed to are on IBM's website. They are drivers for a NVidia card provided by IBM, not NVidia. Notice the "ibm.com" in the URL. Also, I wasn't suggesting that you were mistakenly running Windows, or that you could even run Windows drivers on Linux. I was commenting on your statement from your previous post:
Quote:
the NVidia drivers work just fine on my Windoze partition.
The Windows driver with the statement I refer to is here: http://www.nvidia.com/object/noteboo...6.81_whql.html

Obviously, this doesn't help your Linux problem,, it only refutes your statement that NVidia's drivers support your laptop on Windows. If you also notice, there is no Linux driver provided on that IBM/Lenovo support site. Lenovo almost certainly works around design flaws in your second monitor on Windows. The missing EDID is not necessarily damaged hardware, likely a design flaw that was worked around in Lenovo's Windows drivers. Lenovo manufactured your laptop, not NVidia, and thus they are the one's responsible for supporting it if they advertised it as supporting Linux. Please respect other people's time is used to respond to you as well.
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Old 11-26-09, 03:06 AM   #18
desperadus
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Default Re: Update to 190.42 breaks Xinerama AND TwinView!

Quote:
Originally Posted by conky View Post
Wow, you totally read that wrong and proved my point. I'm guessing English isn't your native tongue. Those links you pointed to are on IBM's website. They are drivers for a NVidia card provided by IBM, not NVidia. Notice the "ibm.com" in the URL. Also, I wasn't suggesting that you were mistakenly running Windows, or that you could even run Windows drivers on Linux. I was commenting on your statement from your previous post:
The Windows driver with the statement I refer to is here: http://www.nvidia.com/object/noteboo...6.81_whql.html

Obviously, this doesn't help your Linux problem,, it only refutes your statement that NVidia's drivers support your laptop on Windows. If you also notice, there is no Linux driver provided on that IBM/Lenovo support site. Lenovo almost certainly works around design flaws in your second monitor on Windows. The missing EDID is not necessarily damaged hardware, likely a design flaw that was worked around in Lenovo's Windows drivers. Lenovo manufactured your laptop, not NVidia, and thus they are the one's responsible for supporting it if they advertised it as supporting Linux. Please respect other people's time is used to respond to you as well.
Accusing me of >English not being my native tongue< is most certainly a very technical argument and indeed as factually relevant as the rest of your posting.
Try to educate yourself on the subject you are talking about.
This is supposed to be a Tech Forum, where people are supposed to get practical help.
Not a n00b5 playground

First of all, IBM doesn't own Lenovo, doesn't produce Thinkpads and most certainly doesn't write any video drivers for those units
The only reason why that URL is still routed via IBM's servers is a hosting agreement IBM made with Lenovo when they sold them their entire PC business.
Its just to avoid confusion amongst 1000+1 customers still running around with those old URLs.
And no, Lenovo doesn't write video drivers either.
Those are all original NVidia drivers, signed & sealed by NVidia, with their Logo and their Trademark and Copyright notice.
And if you can't read those NVidia texts, then try to learn English yourself first and don't attempt such a cheap cop out with an IT engineer like myself!

Second it would have been a heck of a lot more productive for you to realize that going on about Windoze drivers does indeed not help with any Linux issues. But then again, you just felt compelled to post something, anything right...
What happened, girl friend hang up on you or was it just pure boredom?

Third that quote of mine you ripped out of context was to prove the point that there was no hardware failure and to prove that I pointed out that the NVidia(!) driver on Windoze can talk to the 2nd screen just fine.

Fourth that URL you provided says NOTHING about NVidia not supporting Thinkpad W700ds under Windoze.
Nothing, but nothing at all to that regard is posted there!
It talks about >(please contact the notebook OEM for driver support for these notebooks)<.
Now if you don't know the meaning of Original Equipment Manufacturer and that in this case that obviously refers to NVidia, then it proves once and for all whose English language skills are lacking here.
And to add to the flavor of things, your statement that >there is no Linux driver provided on that IBM/Lenovo support site<, perfectly collides with your other claim that >Lenovi is respnsible< for those drivers.
They might be responsible for the agreements they make with companies like NVidia to write those drivers for them, but just as you got no clue that NVidia has Windows driver for the Thinkpad W700, so you are utterly ignorant about the fact that there are links on IBM/Lenovo's web sites telling people where to download those Linux drivers from - directly from NVidia!

Fifth That is an NVidia GPU in my laptop. And no NVidia didn't "produce" my Laptop. Just like NVidia doesn't produce any PCs or Servers. Why that should matter in this context is beyond me, as for example Hitachi doesn't produce Thinkpads either.
But its still their Travelstar harddisks that are running in them.

An OEM driver customized for a merchant's specific hardware configuration is still a driver written by the Original Equipment Manufacturer - NVidia in this case. I know its difficult to fathom for a n00b5 that just because it says Toshiba, Hewlett Packard or IBM on the casing, it doesn't mean they "made all the parts" their systems are comprised of.
Its a virtual reality out there - just try not to bother the grown ups with your panic about it.

Sixth as long as you got no clue about whose writing what part of software for which part of the system, don't know an OEM from an RPM package or think that Red Hat is in the Pizza business, do us both a favor and stop replying to my postings

Pleaaase, being confronted with so much lack of knowledge gives me headaches.

And about the so called "value of your time", well mine costs $250 per hour.
How much do people pay you for your tech advise?

PS: Don't try to tell me what IBM does or doesn't do in the Computer business, as you got no clue who you are talking to here.
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Old 11-26-09, 02:51 PM   #19
conky
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Default Re: Update to 190.42 breaks Xinerama AND TwinView!

Notice how I said IBM/Lenovo, not just IBM. Yes, I realize the ibm.com link you sent is a frontend for Lenovo. OEM means Lenovo in this case, not NVidia. Notice how it said "notebook OEM". Lenovo made the laptop, not NVidia. You also have no clue who you are talking to or what you are talking about, so stop making assumptions about the other person. Click on the Supported Products tab of the driver link I sent. Then look at the note where it says Lenovo laptops are not supported and to contact the "notebook OEM." Lenovo does indeed customize the NVidia video drivers for their products. The Lenovo website points to a file on download.lenovo.com, not a NVidia website.
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Old 12-06-09, 06:52 AM   #20
desperadus
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Default Re: Update to 190.42 breaks Xinerama AND TwinView!

Quote:
Originally Posted by conky View Post
Notice how I said IBM/Lenovo, not just IBM. Yes, I realize the ibm.com link you sent is a frontend for Lenovo. OEM means Lenovo in this case, not NVidia. Notice how it said "notebook OEM". Lenovo made the laptop, not NVidia. You also have no clue who you are talking to or what you are talking about, so stop making assumptions about the other person. Click on the Supported Products tab of the driver link I sent. Then look at the note where it says Lenovo laptops are not supported and to contact the "notebook OEM." Lenovo does indeed customize the NVidia video drivers for their products. The Lenovo website points to a file on download.lenovo.com, not a NVidia website.
Mister, I had asked you politely to stop posting in my thread
You got no clue about nothing, you refuse to educate yourself about the meaning of OEM and your utterly uneducated comments do nothing but introduce static in this thread.
So go and Troll somewhere else, PLEASE!

PS: While am I not surprised that a Troll like you doesn't know that Lenovo could not possibly be a GPU OEM as they do not manufacture GPUs, your ignorance about the fact that All the W700 Windows Drivers have the NVidia's Logo & Trademark on them proves that you never even owned such a system.
So just STOP IT AND TROLL SOMEWHERE ELSE!!!
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Old 12-06-09, 02:17 PM   #21
AaronP
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Default Re: Update to 190.42 breaks Xinerama AND TwinView!

desperadus, "notebook OEM" here does mean Lenovo. It sounds like Lenovo simply didn't include an EDID in with the second monitor and instead customized the Windows drivers to force a particular resolution. Your best bet for getting that monitor to work reliably is to contact Lenovo and ask them for a copy of the monitor's EDID, or extract it from Windows using one of the free Windows EDID tools, and then load it into the NVIDIA Linux driver using the CustomEDID option.

Please keep the conversation in this thread civil.
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