Should Nvidia add Eyefinity to their Fermi boards?

[gstanford]

Redeemed, I have no Idea of what you are asking me to comment on. Outside of what nvidia presented at GTC 09 I really don't know what nvidia intends to bring to the table with Fermi.

I do expect that it will be technologically superior to anything ATi is currently offering however and that nvidia will support it, the industry and end-users much better than ATi/AMD does (thats the real nvidia advantage, always has been).

I expect that GTX380 (or whatever it might be called) will approximately double GTX280 performance. nvidia aims to double previous generation performance with new architectures generally.

nvidia SLI and 3dfx SLI are almost totally unrelated (they share an acronym since nvidia saw the value of the 3dfx acronym and possibly they share engineers who worked on SLI both at 3dfx & nvidia).

Lastly price/performance is not the be all and end all, as nvidia's market share illustrates. Rather it is customer service and industry cooperation that matter.

[MustangSVT]

Originally Posted by gstanford

What do you think performs the SLI Mosaic function if not the graphics cards inside the Quadroplex box? An Irish leprechaun?

Mind you I wouldn't expect any less than the replies MustangSVT (with a 4890 in his primary machine) has given. Da Nile isn't just a river in Egypt....

Not to mention the Quadroplex probably costs less than three price gouged ATi cards plus 6 display port monitors (notice the nvidia solution uses DVI). You can connect two extra monitors too.

Trust nvidia to do a job properly and ATi to half-arse it.

I'm not referring to using the entire functionality, I am simply referring to using 3 monitors. From what I read on another forum, you cannot simply purchase a Quadro card to use the Mosaic feature, you need the Quadro card along with some expensive special motherboard. The point is, let's say this SLI Mosaic feature does more than what ATI EyeFinity does. What me and most people at Widescreen gaming forum want is gaming on 3 monitors. It cost $300 to get a Matrox Th2go and the cost of 3 24" monitors. I can use it with ATI or nVIDIA. It is not perfect, but it gets the job done. The SLI Mosaic feature would run me probably $1000+ for the graphics cards alone, which I'd rather spend to get a good video card (be it ATI or nVIDIA). That's why this SLI Mosaic feature is clearly not really the same thing as Matrox Th2Go or ATI EyeFinity because it is cost prohibitive.

[Xion X2]

Originally Posted by DarthBeavis

Their 295 was top then ATI seems to have passed up according to some benchmarks.

That's like saying the U.S. edged out Iraq in the Gulf War.

I'm glad that Nvidia has a response to Eyefinity. I figured that they would. Unfortunately they're late to the game with it and with their new hardware. They're getting killed in benches by the 5970, and Eyefinity is catching on quick.

That may change in a few months, but by then ATI's gained a large share of the market back which, in the end, is good for us as consumers.

[Xion X2]

Originally Posted by DarthBeavis

no, they go back and forth being the leader. You guys cannot see beyond right now.

I'm not speaking in future tense. I'm speaking as of right now.

You're speaking future tense and two-three months out from now when Fermi will be released. 5970 was released in November. That's a 4-month head start in sales.

The situation is similar to when G80 came out and R600 was late to the party.

If you try to find a 5970 right now you can scarcely find one anywhere. Part of that is due to limited supply but part of it is due to demand. They're selling like hotcakes, and users aren't going to suddenly dump their 600$ graphics cards for a product with similar (or, likely less) performance that Fermi will offer.

It would take a miracle for Nvidia's GTX 380 to outperform HD5970 with its two GPUs. This kid says no chance in hell, but we'll see.

[Xion X2]

Originally Posted by DarthBeavis

I am talking past, present, and future. Nvidia ahead, ati ahead, Nvidia ahead, ATI ahead. I have been a hardware enthusiast for a long time (had 3dFX, upgraded to Geforce 256, then have had ATI and Nvidia cards back and forth ever since). It is not a race. People will buy now, people will buy in the future. It is not like everyone is ready to buy now and this is the only time they ever will.

My original reply had to do with you saying "it appears ATI may have won the performance crown back."

There's no "appears" about it, they have. Hands down, no questions asked, for the present and immediate future. Will that change eventually? Likely, as history tends to repeat itself. But it appears that it will happen nowhere on the foreseeable horizon unless Nvidia has a dual-GPU card that is ready to go when Fermi launches, because a single GPU will more than likely not do it.

Obviously, today is not the only time that "everyone is ready to buy," but again, if Fermi offers no performance increase over 5970, then what reason would anyone who has purchased a 5970 within those 4 months since it launched have to drop it and go Nvidia?

I think that it's time for a few to admit that ATI just has Nvidia's number this round just as Nvidia had ATI's number with G80. It happens, and the pendulum will probably swing again at some point in the future. But for right now, ATI is positioned the best. They had the jump on release, and they have a dual-GPU card which Nvidia probably will not match performance with at their product's release (I can't remember the last time that either camp launched with a dual-GPU offering.)

[Xion X2]

now, on to things that matter: I am McLovin your "r e f l e X i o n" project!!!!!! You still need a GPU block sponsor?

Thanks for the kind words.

Yeah, I'm still looking for some GPU blocks. I was in contact with Eddy and had an initial conversation that looked promising, but he's no longer returning my emails for the past week and giving me the impression that he's not interested. PPCs told me they were at their sponsor limit for the moment when I approached them about it. Also been in contact with sidewinder with no luck. Bill is the only one who's been responsive thus far.

If you know of anyone who could hook me up with some blocks, please let me know. As you know, this stuff can become quite expensive when it's mostly out of pocket.

Originally Posted by DarthBeavis

I do not have the top ATI card in MY hands to compare and test. Do you have a Geforce 295 AND ATI's top card in YOUR hands to test? No? Then the proper thing for either of us to say is it APPEARS as we are going off of third hand information.

Come on, Darth. You don't seriously believe that every single review site out there is being coerced by ATI's purse strings, do you?

Most reviews that I've seen put it out ahead of the 295 much further than that.

Anyhow, it's not really important. In due time we'll all find out what's up.

Mod on.

[gstanford]

MustangSVT, SLI Mosaic is currently cost prohibitive because nvidia is using it as an exclusive feature of QuadroPlex (they probably are not happy about eyefinity cutting into their margins there).

But, be that as it may, I very much doubt SLI Mosaic relies on the motherboard to work - it's a feature of the GPU's controlled by software in the drivers.

nvidia could choose to include that feature in geforce drivers at any time in response to eyefinity. My bet is that they won't with current gen cards (even though they are capable), they will have it as a "feature" of Fermi cards (just like geforce 7 & transparency AA -- geforce 6 was capable of it too, but drivers initially didn't allow it on the six series, only the 7 series).

It would take a miracle for Nvidia's GTX 380 to outperform HD5970 with its two GPUs. This kid says no chance in hell, but we'll see.

I think some people overestimate the impact of dual gpu cards on the market. I completely ignore them myself. Compare the single cards, not the duals (or single to dual -- that is just silly).

[jimmyjames123]

Originally Posted by Redeemed

I think you're over confident.

Did you even bother to read what DarthBeavis wrote? Here it is again, in response to someone who heard a "rumor" that NVIDIA was basically pulling out of the gaming market:

Originally Posted by DarthBeavis

Wrong. I know what features they are coming out with but cannot say due to NDA. Nvidia has NOT given up the ghost not at all. you will be surprised when you see their response to ATI . . .oh, it is going to rock.

This is a very simple comment--not dissing ATI at all, no comments about price/performance, no comments about performance crown, no comments about GPU market strategy--and yet you go on a rant to say that he is "overconfident"? Overconfident in what, the fact that NVIDIA is most certainly not abandoning the gaming market? Are you kidding me?

If anything, you are the one (along with AMD/ATI R7xx/R8xx owners MustangSVT, Xion X2, Viral, etc) who is spreading FUD about NVIDIA's future architecture vs current and future ATI/AMD architecture, even though you and almost no one else here knows anything concrete about the future architectures. Seems silly.

I suppose we should drink the Kool-Aid and believe that the game is over before it even begins?

There are some positives and negatives to both NVIDIA's [ongoing] strategy and ATI/AMD's [most recent] strategy. You can't write off NVIDIA's strategy purely based on one generation of cards (ie. GT200-based). NVIDIA has succeeded numerous times with their strategy (NV40, G80, etc), so what is preventing them from doing so in the future? Let's face it, when NVIDIA came out with GT200, they were caught off guard with ATI/AMD's strategy for R700. NVIDIA surely hasn't been caught off guard this time.

I don't see the big reason for all the fuss. NVIDIA is making a much bigger architectural leap from GT200 to G100 than ATI/AMD is making from R700 to R800. So what if they are a few months later in comparison? That is just one way to spin it. In one years time, whenever ATI/AMD comes out with a new architecture, one can argue that NVIDIA beat ATI/AMD to the punch to a radically new architecture, and then NVIDIA's refresh will be waiting in the wings soon after ATI/AMD releases a radically new architecture. This is the nature of the GPU design cycle.

[Viral]

Originally Posted by DarthBeavis

OK, my bad. Go read my posts, then yours, and tell me what you would think. I mentioned being under NDA and said the new FERMI will have some cool features. That is exactly what you posted. if you did not mean me then I apologize. Trust me, I have been dealing with stupid arse anti-Nvidia fan bois all over (I hate people in this GPU debate who take all one side or another - that is just disingenuous - both companies have been trading being in the lead for years and years).

I don't know if all that appears to be their marketing is really all THEIR marketing. You are probably right that bonehead fan boys are saying all kinds of shiat with absolutely nothing to back it up. I can tell you Nvidia is not dishing out pre-release hardware (do not know if AIBs are or not) so if you see numbers here and there take it with a grain of salt. I will get cards as soon as they are out of the gate so I can do some testing for you guys (including taking apart to install water-blocks).

Now if you think AMD does not do viral marketing . . .go look up Cherry X. They asked me to do that for them.

I did read my post, and yours, I wouldn't reply if I hadn't. I never said anything that was meant to target you, I just went off on a tangent on other people nvidia "support" that are FUD spreading fanboys. Sorry if that wasn't clear. My only "attack" on you was when you had a sook and said you would leave because people were'nt being nice, only to continue and go on about coming back to tell everyone "I told you so". I'm sorry but that's pretty childish.

Re: Cherry X, I'm not talking about computer builds, i wouldn't call your builds for NV or ATI viral marketing.

I already knew you weren't an NV fanboy, you just build for who contracts you, and you are happy, like anyone else here would be to view unrealsed products from either camp if given the opportunity.

I'm the same, started with 3DFX, went Nvidia for a couple of gens, then ATI, then NV for a couple more gens, now ATI again. NV have just had a few tactics recently and in the FX era that made me shy away from them. Still, if they clearly have the better product I'll still buy it regardless.

Originally Posted by nekrosoft13

really wrong person to pick that type of fight with, DB builds all kings of rings, works with all companies.

First, my intention wasn't to start a fight, I apologise to DB if it seemed that way to him.

Secondly, I never implied that he was a fanboy, so his unbiased nature is moot.

[MustangSVT]

Originally Posted by jimmyjames123

If anything, you are the one (along with AMD/ATI R7xx/R8xx owners MustangSVT, Xion X2, Viral, etc) who is spreading FUD about NVIDIA's future architecture vs current and future ATI/AMD architecture, even though you and almost no one else here knows anything concrete about the future architectures. Seems silly.

I'm not trying to spread anything. I was simply saying that the SLI Mosaic feature on Quadro cards is cost prohibitive compared to Th2Go and ATI EF. Why would I be spreading FUD about nVIDIA's future architecture? I hope their card is very fast because I plan on purchasing one. I've bought nVIDIA cards before like the 6800GT and the 8800GT, so I have nothing against nVIDIA.

[jimmyjames123]

NVIDIA "Scalable Visualization Solutions":

http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/img/.../nv29.jpg.html

Previously unveiled on the Quadro line:

http://www.nvidia.com/object/qplex_svs_overview.html

[Xion X2]

Originally Posted by jimmyjames123

NVIDIA "Scalable Visualization Solutions":

http://game.watch.impress.co.jp/img/.../nv29.jpg.html

Previously unveiled on the Quadro line:

http://www.nvidia.com/object/qplex_svs_overview.html

Yeah, but it's one thing to have this available for workstations and another to have it as a streamlined gaming solution, like ATI has done.

It's true that this is not revolutionary technology, but I don't believe that anyone has put it in a user-friendly form for the gaming population like ATI has done. That's why it's garnering such attention.