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Old 03-24-10, 07:11 AM   #73
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Default Re: I have seen the future....

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Originally Posted by CaptNKILL View Post

The list of actual GPU-Physx accelerated games is incredibly short:
http://www.nzone.com/object/nzone_physxgames_home.html

But Cryostasis, Batman and Mirrors Edge alone make it worth it to me. I really like what I've seen of the effects in these games, and the games are good enough for it to matter.
It's incredibly long compared to the list of GPU physics accelerated games people can play with ATi cards:
1.<pending?>

It's about to become very difficult to seriously consider an ATi card. For a person to lock themselves out of PhysX and 3D Vision just doesn't make sense. More games are on the way with PhysX, the Unreal guys announced UE3 be optomized for 3d Vision, and TWIMTBP is so widespread it's pretty obvious which direction physics and 3d are going.

And what does AMD have? Oh yeah, they hope their main competitor Intel will help them out with their Havok company, as they have been hoping for years. For 3d they hope some 3rd party vendors who have no presence in the gaming market will develop hardware and drivers for them. Basically they don't want to spend the money to bring a better gaming experience to their customers and they hope someone else will do it for them.

ATi fans will post "Lower power! Cheaper to make!" but in the end people buying will be faced with "Do I want a card that locks me out of CUDA apps, PhysX, 3D Vision, 3D Vision Surround, UE3 AA, ambient occlusion so I can get EyeFinity on one card?"

My guess is they won't and we're about to see big price cuts on ATi products.
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Old 03-24-10, 07:27 AM   #74
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Default Re: I have seen the future....

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Originally Posted by Rollo View Post
My guess is they won't and we're about to see big price cuts on ATi products.
I'm an vN fan, but 130 minimum difference per card is a lot. If you want two cards plus an additional PhysX card (9800GT) you're talking 350 more, just for PhysX. Is it that good?? Throw in a very hot running card (?) and the 5870 looks pretty appealing, at least to me.

Edit: Metro 2033 scaling is gonna be the decider for me.
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Old 03-24-10, 07:41 AM   #75
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Default Re: I have seen the future....

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Originally Posted by Rollo View Post
It's incredibly long compared to the list of GPU physics accelerated games people can play with ATi cards:
1.<pending?>

It's about to become very difficult to seriously consider an ATi card. For a person to lock themselves out of PhysX and 3D Vision just doesn't make sense. More games are on the way with PhysX, the Unreal guys announced UE3 be optomized for 3d Vision, and TWIMTBP is so widespread it's pretty obvious which direction physics and 3d are going.

And what does AMD have? Oh yeah, they hope their main competitor Intel will help them out with their Havok company, as they have been hoping for years. For 3d they hope some 3rd party vendors who have no presence in the gaming market will develop hardware and drivers for them. Basically they don't want to spend the money to bring a better gaming experience to their customers and they hope someone else will do it for them.

ATi fans will post "Lower power! Cheaper to make!" but in the end people buying will be faced with "Do I want a card that locks me out of CUDA apps, PhysX, 3D Vision, 3D Vision Surround, UE3 AA, ambient occlusion so I can get EyeFinity on one card?"

My guess is they won't and we're about to see big price cuts on ATi products.
Read the thread on PhysX and see how important it really is. 3DVision requires a new monitor, surround three new monitors and a second card. Cuda is worthless unless you fold. All I see are marketing gimmicks. No one cares for eyefinity either. Where are the real performance numbers? You know that thing we actually buy these things for in the first place?
Why do we even let nvidia focus members post on these forums? Corporate shills are what they are. Stick to the nvidia official forums where you belong!
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Old 03-24-10, 07:43 AM   #76
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Default Re: I have seen the future....

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Originally Posted by Revs View Post
I'm an vN fan, but 130 minimum difference per card is a lot. If you want two cards plus an additional PhysX card (9800GT) you're talking 350 more, just for PhysX. Is it that good?? Throw in a very hot running card (?) and the 5870 looks pretty appealing, at least to me.

Edit: Metro 2033 scaling is gonna be the decider for me.
Remember that you can always hack PhysX to work with an ati card.

http://physxinfo.com/news/568/ati-hd...sx-benchmarks/
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Old 03-24-10, 07:48 AM   #77
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Default Re: I have seen the future....

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Originally Posted by Toss3 View Post
Remember that you can always hack PhysX to work with an ati card.

http://physxinfo.com/news/568/ati-hd...sx-benchmarks/
If I end up going ATi, I'll need that. Cheers
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Old 03-24-10, 08:58 AM   #78
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Default Re: I have seen the future....

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When you shoot at bricks with a grenade launcher, they blow apart violently. They don't topple over like a deck of cards like in the PhysX video.
So how many grenade launchers do you own?
I think they're both pretty far off when it comes to realism, but that's by intention since realism is boring. Realistic explosions would be boring too.
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Old 03-24-10, 10:55 AM   #79
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Default Re: I have seen the future....

realism in unreal game, yap, sure
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Old 03-24-10, 12:29 PM   #80
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Default Re: I have seen the future....

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Read the thread on PhysX and see how important it really is. 3DVision requires a new monitor, surround three new monitors and a second card. Cuda is worthless unless you fold. All I see are marketing gimmicks. No one cares for eyefinity either. Where are the real performance numbers? You know that thing we actually buy these things for in the first place?
Why do we even let nvidia focus members post on these forums? Corporate shills are what they are. Stick to the nvidia official forums where you belong!
CUDA's foundation isn't gaming, its made for programmablity of different applications to GPU's, there is a lot more things in the world outside of gaming that need performance that a CPU, even multiple CPU's can't provide with out a huge cost to return ratio. As a side note CUDA does come in handy to port PC applications to GPU's because of its similarity in programming calls and language, and this is why physX was ported to CUDA, it gave immediate benefits, to owners of nV products. That was a better way to showcase their technology then porting over to OpenCL or direct compute since it would have been a year or so later we would have had to wait. On ATi's front its going to more then 2 years most likely.
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Old 03-24-10, 12:37 PM   #81
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Default Re: I have seen the future....

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CUDA's foundation isn't gaming, its made for programmablity of different applications to GPU's, there is a lot more things in the world outside of gaming that need performance that a CPU, even multiple CPU's can't provide with out a huge cost to return ratio. As a side note CUDA does come in handy to port PC applications to GPU's because of its similarity in programming calls and language, and this is why physX was ported to CUDA, it gave immediate benefits, to owners of nV products. That was a better way to showcase their technology then porting over to OpenCL or direct compute since it would have been a year or so later we would have had to wait. On ATi's front its going to more then 2 years most likely.
But how exactly does CUDA benefit the average customer?
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Old 03-24-10, 12:44 PM   #82
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But how exactly does CUDA benefit the average customer?
do you every use photoshop? Anti virus programs will benefit in the future, any application that needs heavy parallel computational needs will benefit, there isn't many out there yet, that is true, but to propagate new techniques and features into the consumer world with computer programs always takes time. Its not something that happens overnight, CUDA provides leverage of current programming knowledge, OpenCL and Direct Compute shaders don't because now an application programmer, who most likely hasn't used any graphics API extensively, probably touched it in college or something like that, will have to understand the API.
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Old 03-24-10, 01:05 PM   #83
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Default Re: I have seen the future....

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Read the thread on PhysX and see how important it really is.
Why do we even let nvidia focus members post on these forums? Corporate shills are what they are. Stick to the nvidia official forums where you belong!
1. Read thre 100s of angry posts from ATi owners that can't use PhysX and see how important it really is.

2. "we even let"? I was unaware you had any authority to speak for this forum Toss3? I thought you were just another forum member like me, what's your association with the forum that speak for it? Or are you just playing make believe mod to sound tough?
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Old 03-24-10, 01:27 PM   #84
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Default Re: I have seen the future....

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Originally Posted by Rollo View Post
1. Read thre 100s of angry posts from ATi owners that can't use PhysX and see how important it really is.

2. "we even let"? I was unaware you had any authority to speak for this forum Toss3? I thought you were just another forum member like me, what's your association with the forum that speak for it? Or are you just playing make believe mod to sound tough?


Angry that i don't have GPU PhysX support?.....On the maybe 10 games that use it?,and Nvidia bought Ageia now a little over 2 years ago,so we can't say it' been hugely popular.....Hardly.


I've seen the videos of games that actually use it and compared that to the same game(mirrors edge,batman darkham asylum),that i actually own and ran in my system,and the differences are fairly subtle to say the least,and doesn't change the overall gameplay basically.


Developers would need to get way more agressive with GPU physics in terms of actually enhancing the gameplay/interactivity of the game itself,beyond what's possible with CPU physics,and pull that off with acceptable performance using a single GPU for both physics and graphics work,then they'd have something to really boast over the competition.


The current situation is no where near that right now.
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