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Old 10-31-10, 01:04 PM   #49
Lemmiwinks
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Default Re: Optimus support for Linux

In my opinion, having two graphic cards in one laptop is completely useless. I really doubt that you would save any relevant amount of power, as long as the main graphics chip has a good power management which underclocks/-volts properly when being idle (as most recent Nvidia chips do pretty well).
So why having another crappy intel chip, which just wastes valuable battery time?
I fully understand Nvidia's decision not to support Optimus on Linux as it is just another marketing gag to confuse (dumb) windows users.
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Old 10-31-10, 01:35 PM   #50
dk75
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Default Re: Optimus support for Linux

It seems that you don't understand it.

Intel crappy chip is here. It is inside i3/i5/i7 core whatever you want it or not. And you can't power it down.
Producents have 3 choises:
1) left users with crapy Intel chips;
2) add 2nd gfx card and run it in parallel to crap thus doubling power output even during web browsing;
3) add 2nd gfx card and enable it only when it's needed.

point 1) is used at low level machines
point 2) was used at the beginning
point 3) have 2 variations:
- manual
- automatic

nVidia did automatic in Optimus and we have no choice then. Either we buy Optimus laptops, use crap instead proper gfx card and have power consumption sky rockets or... buy laptops with Ati

That is decission which nVidia did for as, dumb Linux users with "no Optimus for Linux" policy.

Capito?
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Old 10-31-10, 01:42 PM   #51
Lemmiwinks
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Default Re: Optimus support for Linux

Ah I see the problem with the core i processors. But I thought that Optimus was already available with the core 2 duo processors, as a separate intel graphics chip on the mainboard.
I also thought that the intel chip could simply be disabled in Bios...
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Old 10-31-10, 01:45 PM   #52
dk75
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Default Re: Optimus support for Linux

No.
That was pre-Optimus solution - manual switching.
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Old 11-01-10, 03:27 PM   #53
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Default Re: Optimus support for Linux

Quote:
[...]. Either we buy Optimus laptops, use crap instead proper gfx card and have power consumption sky rockets or... buy laptops with Ati

That is decission which nVidia did for as, dumb Linux users with "no Optimus for Linux" policy.

Capito?
Unfortunately, it is really so bad:

I used Linux for more than 6 years on NVIDIA based PCs and Laptops without (mayor) problems. A week ago I ordered the new Dell XPS Laptop with the I5-560 CPU and the GT420m gfx card. For me personally it was a perfect combination. Three days ago I had to cancel the order after I realized that there is absolutely no way of using the GT420m with Linux. (You could use the Intel GMA HD but who wants this...)

However, I still needed a new Laptop and my requirements were (in this order):

1. Running Linux
2. Efficient (dualcore) CPU
3. NVIDIA-based middle class gfx-card, if possible with CUDA-support

After comparing endless combinations here are my results:

1. Forget about the I5 and buy a quadcore CPU, (i.e. I7-QM740m) and any NVIDIA-card you like

=> ca. 150 USD more expensive, higher power consummation (10Watts), more heat and less battery time, ... for really nothing if you have no use for more than 4 threads ....

2. Look for a nice, modern CPU and choose NVIDIA-card which surely does not support Optimus.

=> Hard to find, mostly older models with (older) CPUs and which are expensive in comparison with newer models.

3. Look for a nice CPU, a new NVIDIA-card but make sure the Laptop does not support Optimus .

=> I could not found one which *surely* does not support Optimus.

Have I missed a possible solution? If not, my next Laptop will run Linux and will have a I5 CPU.

All the best

Bernd
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Old 11-01-10, 05:35 PM   #54
gradinaruvasile
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Default Re: Optimus support for Linux

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemmiwinks View Post
In my opinion, having two graphic cards in one laptop is completely useless. I really doubt that you would save any relevant amount of power, as long as the main graphics chip has a good power management which underclocks/-volts properly when being idle (as most recent Nvidia chips do pretty well).
So why having another crappy intel chip, which just wastes valuable battery time?
+1

Personally i am a bit worried if all new nvidia-card laptops will ship with Optims & co.
I am a nvidia fan (i was even before i used Linux), but now i dont see other choice but to buy an AMD laptop (those have quite good prices btw and their drivers are improving)...
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Old 11-01-10, 06:22 PM   #55
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Default Re: Optimus support for Linux

Wait, if I buy a laptop with a Core i5 and a Nvidia card I can't use the Nvidia card on Linux? I will have to use the Intel card? Did I misunderstood?
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Old 11-01-10, 06:55 PM   #56
DBO72
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Default Re: Optimus support for Linux

Quote:
Originally Posted by walp View Post
Wait, if I buy a laptop with a Core i5 and a Nvidia card I can't use the Nvidia card on Linux? I will have to use the Intel card? Did I misunderstood?
If the Laptop comes with the Optimus Power Saving Feature you can NOT use the NVIDIA card with Linux. You are sticked with the GMA HD GPU with is inside the new I3/5/7 CPUs. You also can not switch the NVIDIA card off to save power. And of course there is no way of using CUDA.

If you have (or still find) a Laptop without Optimus everything should work normally.

Bernd
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Old 11-01-10, 07:11 PM   #57
walp
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Default Re: Optimus support for Linux

Quote:
Originally Posted by DBO72 View Post
If the Laptop comes with the Optimus Power Saving Feature you can NOT use the NVIDIA card with Linux. You are sticked with the GMA HD GPU with is inside the new I3/5/7 CPUs. You also can not switch the NVIDIA card off to save power. And of course there is no way of using CUDA.

If you have (or still find) a Laptop without Optimus everything should work normally.

Bernd
Oh crap, it wasn't enough to avoid ATi cards because of crappy drivers, now I have to avoid laptops with Optimus too? :\

But if the laptop doesn't come with Optimus, is it possible do switch manually between cards?
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Old 11-01-10, 08:21 PM   #58
DBO72
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Default Re: Optimus support for Linux

Quote:
Originally Posted by walp View Post
Oh crap, it wasn't enough to avoid ATi cards because of crappy drivers, now I have to avoid laptops with Optimus too? :\

But if the laptop doesn't come with Optimus, is it possible do switch manually between cards?
As far as I know, a Laptop with NVIDIA-GPU and without Optimus has either only one (NVIDIA-)GPU or it has a NVIDIA-GPU and a cheap (Intel-based) on-board card which can normally be deactivated in the BIOS. In both cases you are lucky.

But more and more Laptops are now shipped with Optimus and not all are declared "with Optimus".

Good luck!

Bernd
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Old 11-02-10, 08:37 AM   #59
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Default Re: Optimus support for Linux

At the very least, there should be a fairly simple way of powering down the nvidia chip in Linux so it doesn't draw power. Some on the hybrid-graphics-linux mailing list have had luck with this already it seems.

We'll probably get to the point where we can use the nvidia chip for acceleration, though it probably won't be as seamless as on Windows.
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Old 11-02-10, 04:51 PM   #60
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Default Re: Optimus support for Linux

But then what is the point having another card? You can buy a far cheaper laptop that has only the intel card in it (or ati for that matter).
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