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Old 10-05-11, 11:03 AM   #13
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Default Re: John Carmack: Developing RAGE for consoles was a big mistake

hey Carmack... durrrrrrr.
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Old 10-05-11, 11:45 AM   #14
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Default Re: John Carmack: Developing RAGE for consoles was a big mistake

I think this is pretty important too...

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Originally Posted by John Carmack
It is a little bit of a shame that, despite the raw horsepower, we are hampered by kind of the arms-length API interface. Because it is... unhappily true that we have the consoles here running at sixty frames per second, and we could have these massively more powerful PC systems that struggle sometimes to hold the framerate because of unnecessary overheads. Where, if we were programming that hardware directly on the metal the same way we do the consoles, it would be significantly more powerful.
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Old 10-05-11, 11:55 AM   #15
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Default Re: John Carmack: Developing RAGE for consoles was a big mistake

A computer 6x faster than a console shouldnt be hampered that severely by "overheads". If you put the same effort on a pc by optimizing the api structures as you do optimizing it to run on the console hardware, im sure you could do much better. Hes effectively saying the api's we're using to run our console code on our pc emulator are causing poor performance...
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Old 10-05-11, 12:04 PM   #16
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Default Re: John Carmack: Developing RAGE for consoles was a big mistake

And we don't want PC's like that either. Consoles are dedicated gaming systems(yes they can do a few other things in regard to media) so they will always have an advantage over PC in fixed hardware.

The simple fact is as we said and DICE said it that games need to be done PC to consoles, not the other way around.
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Old 10-05-11, 12:33 PM   #17
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Default Re: John Carmack: Developing RAGE for consoles was a big mistake

Sorry Carmack, but you are an epic fail and there is waaaaay too much excrement coming out of your mouth.
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Old 10-05-11, 01:16 PM   #18
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Default Re: John Carmack: Developing RAGE for consoles was a big mistake

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Carmack
It is a little bit of a shame that, despite the raw horsepower, we are hampered by kind of the arms-length API interface. Because it is... unhappily true that we have the consoles here running at sixty frames per second, and we could have these massively more powerful PC systems that struggle sometimes to hold the framerate because of unnecessary overheads. Where, if we were programming that hardware directly on the metal the same way we do the consoles, it would be significantly more powerful.
I can't believe that he actually said that!?
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Old 10-05-11, 01:53 PM   #19
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Default Re: John Carmack: Developing RAGE for consoles was a big mistake

I'll buy his game just because of this statement, although I have neither time nor incentive to play it.
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Old 10-05-11, 03:23 PM   #20
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Default Re: John Carmack: Developing RAGE for consoles was a big mistake

I think this article that is getting posted has a terrible out of context headline. After watching his keynote and many interviews he isn't really talking about the PC as a lead platform for engines in terms of what we experience as users. He is talking about the tools to build them, the development cycle. He wants to develop the engine in such a way that a 24 thread 24 GB machine can let the artists and level designers iterate faster on making content. It's not about how good things will look for us in the end. Arguably this will end with more beautiful levels from an artistic standpoint but not necessarily a technical standpoint.

If you watch the whole thing he says multiple times that working on the development tools is more important than improving the engine because the artists can do more. He says "The balance has changed for me" towards the development tools being quicker and the game being responsive, vs being the most pretty visuals. He has also said trying to build a new engine fully to exploit the PC would torpedo a company because it would take so long to develop and take even longer to make art for..

What he says about the overhead of the APIs on the PC is totally true. Hopefully the 'renaissance' of gfx programming is just a generation or two around the bend where the Carmacks and Sweeny's can just treat GPU/CPUs as a ton of processors with direct memory access and then do whatever they'd like with em... but that won't happen without changes in driver architecture.
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Old 10-05-11, 04:02 PM   #21
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Default Re: John Carmack: Developing RAGE for consoles was a big mistake

Yeah ID now go sit on the retard bus with epic.

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Old 10-05-11, 04:13 PM   #22
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Default Re: John Carmack: Developing RAGE for consoles was a big mistake

http://hardforum.com/showpost.php?p=...&postcount=682
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Old 10-05-11, 06:20 PM   #23
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Default Re: John Carmack: Developing RAGE for consoles was a big mistake

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That's stupid, those Doom 3 pics are with a texture pack, and the Rage shot appears to be a crop of only a portion of the screen. Plus I don't think that texture pack shown was out in 2005 as it says, so its a totally false comparison.
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Old 10-05-11, 06:49 PM   #24
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Default Re: John Carmack: Developing RAGE for consoles was a big mistake

It's more comparable to ET:Quake Wars, which has better quality and detailed textures as you get near to them.
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