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Old 01-15-12, 12:54 PM   #25
Johnny C
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Default Re: Steam support SUCKS!!!!

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Originally Posted by bob saget View Post
What do you mean? If you buy a game, and then a week (or a year) later your account gets suspended for whatever reason, Visa will give you back your money? Do they always do this? Cause if they give you money back, and they don't rip it out of Gabe's hands, where does it come from?
For a period of 1 year you get purchase protection so if they suspend your account and limit your access to something you paid for, you contest the charges and they claw the money back from either valve if you bought from steam or the retailer if you bought from wally world.

I'm guessing you've never used the purchase protection on your credit card, or you don't have a fancy card that offers it.

It's not a solution for everyone..but it does provide some protection for consumers who have these type of cards.

I have used it a few times and Visa does not mess around when it comes to supporting the card holder. I contested a charge once and had the credit within 24hrs however most times it takes 3 business days.
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Old 01-15-12, 01:03 PM   #26
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Default Re: Steam support SUCKS!!!!

No I understand. Visa has been amazing to me when someone stole my card information and used it. I got money back virtually instantly. However, that was when someone stole my card. I didn't willingly use it and then lost access to games because I broke a rule.
In my view, it would be like parking in a no park zone, getting your car towed, and then complaining when your car is towed. If you break the rule, you lose access. I guess if Visa doesn't investigate the matter further, it's good for the customer, even if a little dishonest. I always pay with paypal though... no need to continuously throw my CC number out on to the internets...
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Old 01-17-12, 10:10 AM   #27
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Default Re: Steam support SUCKS!!!!

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Why should it matter how many games a person has purchased?
Because it shows that you are a good paying customer who has a lot of rapport with the business that you have purchased so many things from. At my work I am far more willing to go out of my way for a good customer opposed to some person who has never purchased anything. Or maybe a customer who has only purchased a cable or something small.
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Old 01-17-12, 05:27 PM   #28
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Default Re: Steam support SUCKS!!!!

Well to update, hopefully the situation will be resolved in the next 24-48 hours. After going back a few times to different CS reps at the Bank, I finally got one that found the problem. Apparently something happened between Steam's Payment processor and the bank when they exchanged info. That caused the charge to fail cause of a data mismatch, but steam seemed to let the charge go through (ie it was purchased but no money actually transferred to steam cause of the data mismatch) but steam saw it as a charge back which automatically I guess suspends your account. Now the bank has to fax them some info to tell them it wasn't a charge back for fraud and then I guess steam will charge it again and the account will be restored. Still I have to wait for the bank to fax them some confirmation (24-48hours) to them then steam support to confirm it (who knows how long).

It was a long round about process that really sucks. An error between steam and the bank, you are in the middle, and nothing to do but wait around for steam support to get around to telling you what happened and then hoping to get a decent customer service rep from the bank in order for anything to actually get done.
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Old 01-17-12, 05:42 PM   #29
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Default Re: Steam support SUCKS!!!!

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Originally Posted by musman View Post
Because it shows that you are a good paying customer who has a lot of rapport with the business that you have purchased so many things from. At my work I am far more willing to go out of my way for a good customer opposed to some person who has never purchased anything. Or maybe a customer who has only purchased a cable or something small.
i've noticed many businesses (banks and service providers) around my area, especially banks, have started moving away from this stereotype. they say things like "every customer will get the best rate" or "our prices are the same no matter if you are a new or returning customer". obviously the aim here is to build clientele...
but in this case, in steam's eyes, the OP broke a rule. if you saw a customer shoplifting (which is in essence what steam saw), would you treat them differently if they are a new or returning customer? or do you just call the police? steam just called the police

anyways, good to hear the issue will be sorted out.
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Old 01-17-12, 06:44 PM   #30
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Default Re: Steam support SUCKS!!!!

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but in this case, in steam's eyes, the OP broke a rule. if you saw a customer shoplifting (which is in essence what steam saw), would you treat them differently if they are a new or returning customer? or do you just call the police? steam just called the police

anyways, good to hear the issue will be sorted out.
Your analogy is wrong. Here the customer went to check out and bought the item, got to the door to find out the security tag was still active or not removed. So the store over reacts and calls the police, who quickly decide to strip the customer naked cause the clothes the customer is wearing was bought from the store at an earlier date. Then the store gets the police to go to the customers home, steal back everything the customer has ever bought from the store over the years. Then tells the customer you will get all the stuff you BOUGHT later after we investigate why the alarm went off, and proceeded to go on a 3 day vacation, while you wait in a jail cell naked telling the police look at the receipt I paid for all of it already.

What steam did was probably written as something they allowed themselves to do in the agreement you click through when you buy anything. It isn't something I know I would have objected to cause I know I am not the kind of person who would charge back anything as long as I know I bought it. Still I got hit by the clause for an error occurring between their end and the banks end. So yeah I am not a happy customer, not because they followed their procedures, but because they seemingly decided to go on vacation while I was trying to get them to tell me what happened and how I can fix it then at the same time removing every game I purchased from my home that I had already clearly paid for that had nothing to do with the incident.
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Old 01-17-12, 06:53 PM   #31
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Default Re: Steam support SUCKS!!!!

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Originally Posted by LurkerLito View Post
Your analogy is wrong. Here the customer went to check out and bought...
let me stop you right there. the bank payment did not go through and he had the game. in steam's eyes, he shoplifted. if you buy something at a store and walk out when the card machine says "declined", what do you call that? lets say the credit card machine said approved, and you walk out, and then it declines. would you say you still shoplifted? i think that's pretty much what happened. did you bother to check if the funds have been removed from your account right after you bought the game?
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Old 01-17-12, 09:23 PM   #32
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Default Re: Steam support SUCKS!!!!

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let me stop you right there. the bank payment did not go through and he had the game. in steam's eyes, he shoplifted. if you buy something at a store and walk out when the card machine says "declined", what do you call that? lets say the credit card machine said approved, and you walk out, and then it declines. would you say you still shoplifted? i think that's pretty much what happened. did you bother to check if the funds have been removed from your account right after you bought the game?
No that was not shoplifting, you paid for it using your card, you gave them your card #, you OK-ed the transaction authorizing payment, the bank OK-ed the charge said it was covered, the store gave you the merchandise and a receipt of purchase. It's not the customer's responsibility if an error occurred between the customer walking out of the store and the bank turning over the money for the purchase. From that point, it's time for the store and the bank to work together to find out what happened and how to fix it. Contacting the card owner should have be done, but the buyer (yes buyer is the right term) did not shoplift anything, nor should they be accused of it.

I bought the game, steam said it was paid for, steam let me download the game, steam sent me the receipt I paid and it cleared. There is no need for me to check if the funds were removed. It was like every other of the purchases made for steam. But somewhere after steam getting the it's paid for from the bank to them actually receiving the money, steam's payment processor ran into an error that caused the bank to deny payment. The card was never declined, when that happens transactions don't go through, you don't get the game, you receive a message and a email receipt that states the card was denied.

As far as the bank goes they had to look pretty hard to find the transaction that was in question, it took 3 CS calls just to get someone who could find it. The 2 other times, they basically said there was never even an attempt made. Steam on the other hand, instead of just getting in contact with me to sort it out, suspended the account and denied access to all games previously bought and not in question, so yes the analogy I gave was more accurate because in the analogy a procedural error occurred after payment was approved and in this actual steam purchase case, a payment processor made an error after the transaction was approved.
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Old 01-18-12, 07:32 AM   #33
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Default Re: Steam support SUCKS!!!!

I haven't had an issue with steam yet *knock on wood* but this thread makes me want to never buy another steam game

So many releases are going through steam these days though....
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Old 01-18-12, 07:40 AM   #34
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Default Re: Steam support SUCKS!!!!

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let me stop you right there. the bank payment did not go through and he had the game. in steam's eyes, he shoplifted. if you buy something at a store and walk out when the card machine says "declined", what do you call that? lets say the credit card machine said approved, and you walk out, and then it declines. would you say you still shoplifted? i think that's pretty much what happened. did you bother to check if the funds have been removed from your account right after you bought the game?
Fine he didn't pay for that particular item, but your analogy fails when you consider they suspended his entire account, which was full of items he DID pay for. What they should have done is just remove the game from his account, not lock his entire account complete with every game he has ever purchased.

This is why I don't like the monopoly that Steam is becoming. One stupid little incident like this and you are at their mercy. I don't care what people say about Steam, having a single company in control of your entire gaming catalog is a bad idea.

This is why I don't buy multi-player games on Steam. I'm not going to allow some company to take away games that I paid for, regardless of their reasons. With single-player games there are ways to play without Steam, with multi-player you're just screwed.
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Old 01-18-12, 01:09 PM   #35
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Default Re: Steam support SUCKS!!!!

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Originally Posted by LurkerLito View Post
No that was not shoplifting, you paid for it using your card, you gave them your card #, you OK-ed the transaction authorizing payment, the bank OK-ed the charge said it was covered, the store gave you the merchandise and a receipt of purchase. It's not the customer's responsibility if an error occurred between the customer walking out of the store and the bank turning over the money for the purchase. From that point, it's time for the store and the bank to work together to find out what happened and how to fix it. Contacting the card owner should have be done, but the buyer (yes buyer is the right term) did not shoplift anything, nor should they be accused of it.

I bought the game, steam said it was paid for, steam let me download the game, steam sent me the receipt I paid and it cleared. There is no need for me to check if the funds were removed. It was like every other of the purchases made for steam. But somewhere after steam getting the it's paid for from the bank to them actually receiving the money, steam's payment processor ran into an error that caused the bank to deny payment. The card was never declined, when that happens transactions don't go through, you don't get the game, you receive a message and a email receipt that states the card was denied.

As far as the bank goes they had to look pretty hard to find the transaction that was in question, it took 3 CS calls just to get someone who could find it. The 2 other times, they basically said there was never even an attempt made. Steam on the other hand, instead of just getting in contact with me to sort it out, suspended the account and denied access to all games previously bought and not in question, so yes the analogy I gave was more accurate because in the analogy a procedural error occurred after payment was approved and in this actual steam purchase case, a payment processor made an error after the transaction was approved.
No I understand there was no NEED to check your bank account, however it is always a good idea to do so after some transactions, just to make sure everything is ship shape. Maybe if you looked, you would notice the error and have contacted them earlier... Given that they can legally lock people out of hundreds of games, I assume the reason why they lock you out is to get your attention. Being the big bad dog in the neighborhood that they are, rather than contacting you, they force you to contact them. Maybe it is unethical but from their point of view, they probably get people running back, paying whatever was owed to get their games back. If they just send polite emails saying "you owe us some money, but there will not be any consequences if you don't pay", I am sure people will not be paying as fast
The other thing is, what if you had exploited the system flaw on purpose, bought the game as a gift, and gifted to another account? Do they suspend both accounts? Do they only suspend one but leave the game?
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Old 01-18-12, 04:22 PM   #36
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Default Re: Steam support SUCKS!!!!

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No I understand there was no NEED to check your bank account, however it is always a good idea to do so after some transactions, just to make sure everything is ship shape. Maybe if you looked, you would notice the error and have contacted them earlier... Given that they can legally lock people out of hundreds of games, I assume the reason why they lock you out is to get your attention. Being the big bad dog in the neighborhood that they are, rather than contacting you, they force you to contact them. Maybe it is unethical but from their point of view, they probably get people running back, paying whatever was owed to get their games back. If they just send polite emails saying "you owe us some money, but there will not be any consequences if you don't pay", I am sure people will not be paying as fast
The other thing is, what if you had exploited the system flaw on purpose, bought the game as a gift, and gifted to another account? Do they suspend both accounts? Do they only suspend one but leave the game?
Like I have said earlier, I can understand them suspending the account. I know it is the best way to get your attention, but they didn't tell you a) Why your account was suspended, and b) the most major fault, took 3.5 days from the time I did contact them till they replied to tell me what was wrong. Suspending an account is a BIG deal and if they choose to do it that way I can understand, but they better dam well have the support structure to resolve issues quickly. If they can't reply in a minimum of 24 hours each message, they don't have a big enough staff period.

And no they aren't doing suspensions to get your attention. They are using it as a tool to get what they want obviously anytime anything payment related has an issue. Even though we are communicating via this insanely slow web site support system with a over 3 day wait period, they did not offer to change the account status from suspended to locked after I contacted them as we worked on how to fix the problem, nor did they change the status to locked after I requested them to do it because they are taking 3.5 days to reply back. FYI in case you don't know, suspended means you can't login and all your games are unplayable, locked means you cannot buy or trade games, but you can play your already purchased games. From support's replies, they told me they couldn't just charge the card again for the missing funds, because they might be liable for fraud if they did so and the card was actually reported as stolen, so they wanted confirmation from the bank that wasn't the case. Sounds reasonable, so even though I am working with them to resolve the issue and requested they change the account to locked status, they still kept me from all my legally paid for games by keeping my status as suspended. Sorry for me that is pretty dam unethical and really should be illegal.

As far as your question regarding exploiting on purpose, since I have some time on my hands with most of the games I was playing at the moment being on steam, I have read way to many posts on steams forums. From what I have read, yes there was at least one post I have read about that exploited multiple accounts though I am not sure how they were exploiting, but that person's multiple accounts did get perma-suspended/banned. So yeah they can and do track anyone exploiting the system and have a means to deal with it.
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