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Old 02-04-12, 10:38 PM   #277
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Default Re: next gen kepler to support dx 11.1, also take a year to rollout all cards

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Originally Posted by Xion X2 View Post
So this "50% faster than 7970" claim is related to the supposed PhysX hardware that's on the card?

How many games even came out with PhysX last year? 6-7? Meh.
only two I think, Batman AC and Alice. I really like the physx enabled effects and really wish more games would use it
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Old 02-05-12, 01:52 AM   #278
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Default Re: next gen kepler to support dx 11.1, also take a year to rollout all cards

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It's fluid based physics according to that article, wich is a step beyond what regular PhysX does unless you enjoy seeing fluid based physics in games running in realtime displayed at 2 Fps...
Still doesn't make sense to actually add a dedicated HW part, that would just sit there, when it's not being used.

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In how many years?....I rest my case.
It's actually 9 games, if you only take into account games made with PhysX and not Ageia in mind and it was over the course of 3 years.

Alice, Batman AA/AC, Cryostasis, Dark Void, Mafia 2, Metro 2033, Mirror's Edge and Sacred 2.

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....It was a messy situation to say the least.
So closed standard was the better choice in the end, just like I said.

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Features supported by a single card brand will never fly as developers are interested in selling their games to as many people as possible, many of whom might not be running Nvidia hardware at all, so unifying standards is the only way to go to see them used in more games ansd sooner, but from a marketing standpoint it doesn't make your hardware seem special, and Nvidia hates that with a passion it seems.
You will be surprised, that from all those companies, that used GPU PhysX, none of them were concerned about the fact, that only NV HW can run it.

Also, if NV managed to get into the PS4, then we'll definitely hear some complaints from other gamers, that they want GPU PhysX/physics too.

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Like in Crysis 2 where they have an excessive level of tessellation for no apparent reason.
I can actually tell you why, because unlike most sites, one local site here asked a 3D graphic, who amongst other things worked on Mafia 2.

It was because of displace mapping/height mapping. For example, if you have a 128x128 texture, tesselation needs to smooth the polygon to 128x128 or more polygons.

If you go even further to 256x256, it allows for smoother transitions and the object appears much more plastic, thanks to tessellation and displace/height mapping.

The other reason, for almost over-using tessellation is a problem with very thin and long polygons. The GPU has a really hard time with dealing with polygons, that are for example only 1mm wide, but 5m long. It's a problem, that every engine he worked on had. Dynamic tessellation on singlemesh objects should help with that, but Crysis 2 apparently doesn't support it. And because it's missing, the level of tessellation doesn't change with the distance of camera.

Some of it might not be correct, because it wasn't easy to translate something you don't really understand.
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Old 02-05-12, 07:13 AM   #279
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Default Re: next gen kepler to support dx 11.1, also take a year to rollout all cards

^
And most of those hw physx games are crap with a capital xD


btw if it were without any crippling code in it and openCL based im sure it would be 10x better, until then RIP.
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Old 02-05-12, 10:57 AM   #280
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Default Re: next gen kepler to support dx 11.1, also take a year to rollout all cards

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I would take anything that Semiaccurate says to seriously. He has a beef with anything Nvidia. The same goes for Fud and anything they say about ATI. Both sites are really a joke.
Was charlie right about Fermi?

I agree he hates nV but his sources are good. Article says that new cards will be fast...really fast but alot of it will be in cherry picked situations.

The only way we're gonna know is on ~april 12th when we see new cards in reviewers hands.

I'm not in a panic to buy, but if the new 680 is priced right and performs 50% better I'll buy it, if not I'll be picking up a 7970. There is also the possibility that the 8970 is staged for launch immediately after kepler hits the market.

AMD have tons of room with vcore and thermals on the 28nm cards, enough to release a refresh with only better cooling.

Link for tesselation in Crysis 2 http://techreport.com/articles.x/21404/1

Techreport not semiaccurate.
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Old 02-05-12, 06:00 PM   #281
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Default Re: next gen kepler to support dx 11.1, also take a year to rollout all cards

Not this debate again. Charlie changes what he says so many time he has to end up getting something right. As posted before, take anything he or Fud say with a grain of salt. They are both bad.
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Old 02-06-12, 09:57 PM   #282
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Default Re: next gen kepler to support dx 11.1, also take a year to rollout all cards

this is prolly a rehash of what was posted above

http://www.engadget.com/2012/02/06/n...-roadmap-leak/
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Old 02-07-12, 01:55 AM   #283
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Default Re: next gen kepler to support dx 11.1, also take a year to rollout all cards

Same as the lensfire article. I don't believe it myself.
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Old 02-07-12, 02:53 AM   #284
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Default Re: next gen kepler to support dx 11.1, also take a year to rollout all cards

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Same as the lensfire article. I don't believe it myself.
I don't believe any of it that has been posted so far. Nvidia have been very hush hush on this release.
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Old 02-07-12, 07:06 AM   #285
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Default Re: next gen kepler to support dx 11.1, also take a year to rollout all cards

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I don't believe any of it that has been posted so far. Nvidia have been very hush hush on this release.
Can you blame them after the Fermi(GTX480) launch fiasco?Let the hardware do the talking when it's ready.
Here's to hoping for a 8800gtx like launch except for the prising though!
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Old 02-07-12, 02:16 PM   #286
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Default Re: next gen kepler to support dx 11.1, also take a year to rollout all cards

Looks like a GTX480 all over again...

http://semiaccurate.com/2012/02/07/g...s-out-at-last/

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Other documents have the part burning close to 300W, and you can read two things in to this number. First is that this part is very likely to be an HPC oriented chip with the CU count, and attendant power-hungry interconnect, being notably higher than GK104. Second is that the rumours of GK100 being cancelled early in the game are likely true, they said problems revolved around interconnects and power issues.
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Old 02-07-12, 03:12 PM   #287
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Default Re: next gen kepler to support dx 11.1, also take a year to rollout all cards

We don't have enough conclusive data yet, but I could see a scenario where Nvidia might be kind of painting themselves into a corner before long. Reason is because ATI has really been making a lot of progress in the efficiency of their architecture in regards to power usage. I haven't really seen the same out of Nvidia. Eventually, Nvidia is going to hit a wall with that if they don't follow suit. Their cards are really inefficient by comparison. It'll cost them in performance, public opinion and in manufacturing costs.

You can't just keep stacking endless transistors on the card; it will catch up with them. If this next launch is delayed, my guess is that has a good amount to do with it.
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Old 02-07-12, 05:49 PM   #288
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Default Re: next gen kepler to support dx 11.1, also take a year to rollout all cards

We don't know the performance or actual power draw yet so it's a bit soon to say that they are inefficient. Fermi was inefficient on perf/trans and perf/watt compared to Cypress/NI for gaming yes, but much of the design was designed for GPGPU. Now that both are strong in this area a real comparison can be made. There's also the common occurrence of that last 10-5% performance costing much more in transistors and power use - if the top end Kepler does use up to 300w, but performs 20-40% faster than Tahiti, I don't think that's really THAT unreasonable. If it's just 5-15% again, that's not worth it for me.
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