Microsoft presents the Xbox2 and live at GDC, hear the show. - Page 2

einstein_314 · 03-09-05, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldsk00l

lol, Clay

Umm, what do you mean Clay? Clay hasn't posted in this thread yet. Although PeterJensen does have a similar avatar to the one clay was using a while back. I think you got them confused. lol

brady · 03-09-05, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shrek2

"significant leap to high-definition graphics, in which character movements and expressions are intensely vibrant and nearly indiscernible from real life"

i really wish they would not hype things like that. i mean the indescernible from real life bit. weve been hearing that stuff since playstation 1 and its getting very tired. anyone who believes that a console or a pc for that matter will be able to render in real time anything that is "nearly indescernible from real life" needs to have there head checked. ok, i assume they are just talking about animation here, but im using it as an excuse to rant a little about graphics. i admit alot of games now and screenies from future games (ue3) look very good. very very good. but indiscernible from real life? i dont think so. ho hum.

i remember articles in popular science and some pc game mags in 99 which basically said that in the next 4-5 years we would see game engines running with real time aa, radiosity, caustics, high poly models/environments, ect, ect...

let me tell you, its 2005 and with all those effects turned on with my rig it still takes several MINUTES to render scenes with very very low poly counts in lightwave. the water drop i posted in the software section is probably less than 500 polys. radiosity and caustics are enable with only 2 lights and when i did a render at 1600x1200 with 5 pass AA it took almost 30 minutes to pop out the final image.

we have a very long way to go. i just get so irritated at all the hype that gets crammed down our throats at console release time. but business is business and i know they are just trying to sell the product. ho hum again.

msxyz · 03-10-05, 01:36 AM

Let's hope this time the Xbox will do some real rendering at HDTV resolutions, instead of some lame upsampling. Anyway the fact that they didn't announce any spec is not good, unless they want to hide them for a reason.

oldsk00l · 03-10-05, 09:29 AM

ahh sh1t
sorry
I saw Peter's avatar and since Clay had used it
ok
DUHHHHH

*slaps self*

Editing that msg.....

oldsk00l · 03-10-05, 09:30 AM

lol, PeterJensen

superklye · 03-10-05, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oldsk00l

lol, PeterJensen

haha, nice recovery.

Edge · 03-10-05, 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by msxyz

Let's hope this time the Xbox will do some real rendering at HDTV resolutions, instead of some lame upsampling.

Only 1 Xbox game that supports high resolution HDTV upscales a smaller resolution image. The other 2 dozen or so run at true HDTV resolution.

nVestor · 03-10-05, 03:41 PM

Wow, just saw the video and I am about as pumped up about the future of consoles as I was about the NV40 launch!

video:
http://www.xbox.com/en-us/xboxtv/def...t=5226&v=92509

I've read the many threads here about pc's vs. consoles and I am begining to wonder if PC Gaming will turn into an even smaller market. You look at the tech specs of the latest consoles and it makes me more uncertain. Especially when you take the advantages of coding for consoles vs. PC Hardware.

Dual Cores in PC's vs. 3 CPU's in a console

Online gaming subscriptions for many games vs. XBoX Live!

Multiple driver updates for different pc components vs. a single update through a game or download for a console.

Gaming in HDTV on a 60"+ Screen vs. 1600x1200 on a PC Monitor

Very exciting stuff going on, can't wait to find out more. Seems to be more exciting than last year for sure!

LiquidX · 03-10-05, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nVestor

Wow, just saw the video and I am about as pumped up about the future of consoles as I was about the NV40 launch!

video:
http://www.xbox.com/en-us/xboxtv/def...t=5226&v=92509

I've read the many threads here about pc's vs. consoles and I am begining to wonder if PC Gaming will turn into an even smaller market. You look at the tech specs of the latest consoles and it makes me more uncertain. Especially when you take the advantages of coding for consoles vs. PC Hardware.

Dual Cores in PC's vs. 3 CPU's in a console

Online gaming subscriptions for many games vs. XBoX Live!

Multiple driver updates for different pc components vs. a single update through a game or download for a console.

Gaming in HDTV on a 60"+ Screen vs. 1600x1200 on a PC Monitor

Very exciting stuff going on, can't wait to find out more. Seems to be more exciting than last year for sure!

Thanks watching it now. But yeah I agree that gap is closing between consoles and PC.

Quote:

Gaming in HDTV on a 60"+ Screen vs. 1600x1200 on a PC Monitor

60"+ or even a 32" Anyday!

**Mr_LoL** · 03-10-05, 05:30 PM

Just read this off gamespy

We Got Next - Part One (Xbox)
GameSpy reveals details on the next Xbox console.
By Raymond M. Padilla | March 8, 2005

For several GameSpy editors, Game Developers Conference (GDC) is one of the best and most enjoyable events held each year. One of the primary reasons for GameSpy's GDC love is that the editors get to interact with some of the best talents in the business. Recently, some of GameSpy's friends in the development community shared a ton of details on Microsoft's next console system. Keep in mind that all of this information is based off of alpha development kits and current projections for the final hardware. Everything is subject to change. In the first part of our Xbox expose, I'll cover the console's hardware components and software goals. Since the final name of the next Xbox hasn't been revealed yet, I'll refer to the system by its codename, Xenon.

The Guts of the Next Box

CPU - Xenon's CPU has three 3.0 GHz PowerPC cores. Each core is capable of two instructions per cycle and has an L1 cache with 32 KB for data and 32 KB for instructions. The three cores share 1 MB of L2 cache. Alpha 2 developer kits currently have two cores instead of three.

GPU - Xenon's GPU is a generation beyond the ATI X800. Its clock speed is 500 MHz and it supports Shader 3.0. Developers are currently working with an alpha 2 GPU. Beta GPU units are expected by May and the final GPU is slated for a summer release. The final GPU will be more powerful than anything on the market today; in game terms, it would handle a game like Half-Life 2 with ease.

System Memory - Xenon will have 256 MB of system RAM. Keep in mind that this number should not be equated to typical PC RAM. The Xbox has 64 MB of system RAM and is a very capable machine.

Optical Drive - As many have speculated, Xenon will not use Blu-Ray or HD-DVD. Games will come on dual-layer DVD-9 discs. While the media is the same as that of the current Xbox, the usable space on each disc is up to 7 GB. The drive is slated to run at 12X.

Memory Units - Xenon will use 64 MB to 1,024 MB memory cards. 8 MB is reserved for system use, leaving a 56 MB to 1,016 MB for user data.

Hard Drive - As many have speculated, Xenon's hard drive is optional. 2 GB of the drive will be used as game cache. The final drive size is still being determined.

Camera - Xenon will have a USB 2.0 camera. It's capable of 1.2 megapixel still shots and VGA video. Photos can be used in-game and for gamer profiles. The camera can also be used for video chat. It's unknown if the Xenon camera will allow for EyeToy-like gameplay. Developers are currently using a simulated camera driver.

Sound Chip - Xenon does not have an audio chip in the traditional sense. Decompression is handled by hardware, while the rest of the chores are handled by software. DirectSound3D has been dropped in favor of X3DAudio. The former was deemed too inflexible.

Raymond's Reaction - The Xenon is an extremely impressive piece of hardware. It will allow gamers to see things like complex lighting in gameplay, amazing details through high-level shading (impeccable clouds, fur, grass, cloth, water, marble, ground, etc.), incredible textures, and new post effects (increased motion blur, heat distortion, depth of field, light blooms, etc.).

While people have already been correctly speculating about the removable hard drive and the standard DVD media, I was surprised at the inclusion of the camera. I haven't heard a single rumbling about a Xenon camera prior to GDC. The optional hard drive is a bit understandable; the only gamers that care about it will buy it anyway, while casual gamers won't care about the performance and convenience gains a drive offers. The standard DVD isn't too surprising considering that HD-DVD drives will be too expensive for inclusion in a console system in 2005.

We Got Next - Part One (Xbox)

The Software

Microsoft is requiring developers to make all Xenon titles Live enabled. One of the key reasons for this will be revealed in the second part of this story.

Developers are being instructed to plan their games for high-definition. The baseline is 720p at 1280x720 for gameplay and video clips, 16:9 aspect ratio, 5.1 Surround Sound, and anti-aliasing. These features are the current minimum requirement.

All Xenon games can be played using custom soundtracks. Owners can also play their own music directly. Supported formats are MP3 and WMA. Files can be encoded up to 320Kbps CBR or VBR stereo. The system is branded a Music Player Service.

For gameplay movies, Xenon uses Xenon Motion Video (XMV). XMV is based on Windows Media 9 and uses the mandatory codec for HD-DVD. The goal for video is 720p running at 30 frames per second with 5.1 Surround Sound.

Raymond's Reaction - Mandatory Live "awareness" isn't a big surprise. Online is one area where Microsoft is trouncing the competition. Microsoft's progression with online console gaming has progressed wonderfully (see Halo 2) and the future plans are even more interesting. (Again, see part two of this feature tomorrow for more information.)

It's nice to see that Microsoft is being aggressive with HD performance. Having all games run at 720p (potentially) makes for an incredibly engrossing experience -- particularly owners of HDTV sets. Users with standard televisions needn't worry; 16:9 content will be letterboxed to fit within a 4:3 aspect ratio by default. Developers are being instructed to make sure that any critical text will fit into and look good in 4:3.

Stay Tuned!

That's a wrap for part one of our Xenon feature. Be sure to come back tomorrow to learn more about Microsoft's exciting plans for Xbox Live. While the hardware specs and HD plans for Xenon are definitely cool, the new Xbox Live features might impact your gaming experience even more!

http://xbox.gamespy.com/xbox/microso.../594331p1.html

brady · 03-10-05, 07:02 PM

i think m$ is acctually helping the pc market out. i'll get to that in a minute.

i guess i'll rant about this too. everytime a new generation of consoles is about to come out there are people who seem to hide under their beds, fearing that the age of pc gaming is over.

i promise everyone that (1) the next generation of consoles will be amazing. the graphics will be beautiful, probably better that what we see with our pc's now (infact, im almost sure of it). (2) im willing to bet that no more than 6-9 months will pass before we start hearing about or actually seeing the next generation of graphics cards. yes, they will be expensive, but they will give pc's a one up on graphics. from there pc's will have the graphics corner untill the next generation of consoles. and so it goes.

back to the m$ thing. this article makes it pretty clear that m$ is trying to make programming games an easily cross platform development experience. this is especially exciting for pc gamers because a game can be simultaniously produced for console and pc with virtually the same code and enhanced special effects can be simply coded in for newer graphics cards.

03-10-05, 01:36 AM	#15
msxyz Hybrid Microprocessor Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Milan (Italy) Posts: 2,050	Re: Microsoft presents the Xbox2 and live at GDC, hear the show. Let's hope this time the Xbox will do some real rendering at HDTV resolutions, instead of some lame upsampling. Anyway the fact that they didn't announce any spec is not good, unless they want to hide them for a reason. __________________ Powered by: Pentium Dual E2180 (2GHz, 200MHz FSB) Abit L95C (The one and only mATX with dual PCIe slots!) + 2x1 Geil Black Dragon PC6400 XFX 9600GSO 384MB Little freak wonder

03-10-05, 09:29 AM	#16
oldsk00l Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 1,663	Re: Microsoft presents the Xbox2 and live at GDC, hear the show. ahh sh1t sorry I saw Peter's avatar and since Clay had used it ok DUHHHHH slaps self Editing that msg..... __________________ The Adama maneuver was incredible, go watch Exodus pt 2.

03-10-05, 09:30 AM	#17
oldsk00l Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 1,663	Re: Microsoft presents the Xbox2 and live at GDC, hear the show. lol, PeterJensen __________________ The Adama maneuver was incredible, go watch Exodus pt 2.

03-10-05, 03:41 PM	#20
nVestor www.tntblowout.com Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 269	Re: Microsoft presents the Xbox2 and live at GDC, hear the show. Wow, just saw the video and I am about as pumped up about the future of consoles as I was about the NV40 launch! video: http://www.xbox.com/en-us/xboxtv/def...t=5226&v=92509 I've read the many threads here about pc's vs. consoles and I am begining to wonder if PC Gaming will turn into an even smaller market. You look at the tech specs of the latest consoles and it makes me more uncertain. Especially when you take the advantages of coding for consoles vs. PC Hardware. Dual Cores in PC's vs. 3 CPU's in a console Online gaming subscriptions for many games vs. XBoX Live! Multiple driver updates for different pc components vs. a single update through a game or download for a console. Gaming in HDTV on a 60"+ Screen vs. 1600x1200 on a PC Monitor Very exciting stuff going on, can't wait to find out more. Seems to be more exciting than last year for sure!

03-10-05, 05:30 PM	#22
Mr_LoL Bush's Doppleganger Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Bangor North Wales UK Posts: 5,204	Re: Microsoft presents the Xbox2 and live at GDC, hear the show. Just read this off gamespy We Got Next - Part One (Xbox) GameSpy reveals details on the next Xbox console. By Raymond M. Padilla \| March 8, 2005 For several GameSpy editors, Game Developers Conference (GDC) is one of the best and most enjoyable events held each year. One of the primary reasons for GameSpy's GDC love is that the editors get to interact with some of the best talents in the business. Recently, some of GameSpy's friends in the development community shared a ton of details on Microsoft's next console system. Keep in mind that all of this information is based off of alpha development kits and current projections for the final hardware. Everything is subject to change. In the first part of our Xbox expose, I'll cover the console's hardware components and software goals. Since the final name of the next Xbox hasn't been revealed yet, I'll refer to the system by its codename, Xenon. The Guts of the Next Box CPU - Xenon's CPU has three 3.0 GHz PowerPC cores. Each core is capable of two instructions per cycle and has an L1 cache with 32 KB for data and 32 KB for instructions. The three cores share 1 MB of L2 cache. Alpha 2 developer kits currently have two cores instead of three. GPU - Xenon's GPU is a generation beyond the ATI X800. Its clock speed is 500 MHz and it supports Shader 3.0. Developers are currently working with an alpha 2 GPU. Beta GPU units are expected by May and the final GPU is slated for a summer release. The final GPU will be more powerful than anything on the market today; in game terms, it would handle a game like Half-Life 2 with ease. System Memory - Xenon will have 256 MB of system RAM. Keep in mind that this number should not be equated to typical PC RAM. The Xbox has 64 MB of system RAM and is a very capable machine. Optical Drive - As many have speculated, Xenon will not use Blu-Ray or HD-DVD. Games will come on dual-layer DVD-9 discs. While the media is the same as that of the current Xbox, the usable space on each disc is up to 7 GB. The drive is slated to run at 12X. Memory Units - Xenon will use 64 MB to 1,024 MB memory cards. 8 MB is reserved for system use, leaving a 56 MB to 1,016 MB for user data. Hard Drive - As many have speculated, Xenon's hard drive is optional. 2 GB of the drive will be used as game cache. The final drive size is still being determined. Camera - Xenon will have a USB 2.0 camera. It's capable of 1.2 megapixel still shots and VGA video. Photos can be used in-game and for gamer profiles. The camera can also be used for video chat. It's unknown if the Xenon camera will allow for EyeToy-like gameplay. Developers are currently using a simulated camera driver. Sound Chip - Xenon does not have an audio chip in the traditional sense. Decompression is handled by hardware, while the rest of the chores are handled by software. DirectSound3D has been dropped in favor of X3DAudio. The former was deemed too inflexible. Raymond's Reaction - The Xenon is an extremely impressive piece of hardware. It will allow gamers to see things like complex lighting in gameplay, amazing details through high-level shading (impeccable clouds, fur, grass, cloth, water, marble, ground, etc.), incredible textures, and new post effects (increased motion blur, heat distortion, depth of field, light blooms, etc.). While people have already been correctly speculating about the removable hard drive and the standard DVD media, I was surprised at the inclusion of the camera. I haven't heard a single rumbling about a Xenon camera prior to GDC. The optional hard drive is a bit understandable; the only gamers that care about it will buy it anyway, while casual gamers won't care about the performance and convenience gains a drive offers. The standard DVD isn't too surprising considering that HD-DVD drives will be too expensive for inclusion in a console system in 2005. We Got Next - Part One (Xbox) The Software Microsoft is requiring developers to make all Xenon titles Live enabled. One of the key reasons for this will be revealed in the second part of this story. Developers are being instructed to plan their games for high-definition. The baseline is 720p at 1280x720 for gameplay and video clips, 16:9 aspect ratio, 5.1 Surround Sound, and anti-aliasing. These features are the current minimum requirement. All Xenon games can be played using custom soundtracks. Owners can also play their own music directly. Supported formats are MP3 and WMA. Files can be encoded up to 320Kbps CBR or VBR stereo. The system is branded a Music Player Service. For gameplay movies, Xenon uses Xenon Motion Video (XMV). XMV is based on Windows Media 9 and uses the mandatory codec for HD-DVD. The goal for video is 720p running at 30 frames per second with 5.1 Surround Sound. Raymond's Reaction - Mandatory Live "awareness" isn't a big surprise. Online is one area where Microsoft is trouncing the competition. Microsoft's progression with online console gaming has progressed wonderfully (see Halo 2) and the future plans are even more interesting. (Again, see part two of this feature tomorrow for more information.) It's nice to see that Microsoft is being aggressive with HD performance. Having all games run at 720p (potentially) makes for an incredibly engrossing experience -- particularly owners of HDTV sets. Users with standard televisions needn't worry; 16:9 content will be letterboxed to fit within a 4:3 aspect ratio by default. Developers are being instructed to make sure that any critical text will fit into and look good in 4:3. Stay Tuned! That's a wrap for part one of our Xenon feature. Be sure to come back tomorrow to learn more about Microsoft's exciting plans for Xbox Live. While the hardware specs and HD plans for Xenon are definitely cool, the new Xbox Live features might impact your gaming experience even more! http://xbox.gamespy.com/xbox/microso.../594331p1.html __________________ Core i5 2500K@ 4.5, KFA2 GTX 570, Gigabyte Z68, 8GB Corsair XMS 1600MHZ, Antec Truepower New 650w, Coolermaster Storm Sniper, 1TB Samsung F1, Yamakasi Catleap 27", Samsung 245B, Asus Xonar DG...blah blah blah

03-10-05, 07:02 PM	#23
brady I'm like everyone else. Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 2,376	Re: Microsoft presents the Xbox2 and live at GDC, hear the show. i think m$ is acctually helping the pc market out. i'll get to that in a minute. i guess i'll rant about this too. everytime a new generation of consoles is about to come out there are people who seem to hide under their beds, fearing that the age of pc gaming is over. i promise everyone that (1) the next generation of consoles will be amazing. the graphics will be beautiful, probably better that what we see with our pc's now (infact, im almost sure of it). (2) im willing to bet that no more than 6-9 months will pass before we start hearing about or actually seeing the next generation of graphics cards. yes, they will be expensive, but they will give pc's a one up on graphics. from there pc's will have the graphics corner untill the next generation of consoles. and so it goes. back to the m$ thing. this article makes it pretty clear that m$ is trying to make programming games an easily cross platform development experience. this is especially exciting for pc gamers because a game can be simultaniously produced for console and pc with virtually the same code and enhanced special effects can be simply coded in for newer graphics cards. __________________ C2Q @ 3.6GHz \| GA-P35-DS3L \| 8GB DDR2 \| EVGA GTX 580 SC 1.5GB \| Windows 7 Ultimate x64 C2D @ 3.0GHz \| GA-P35-DS3L \| 4GB DDR2 \| HIS AMD 6990 4GB \| OS X Lion 10.7 \| Windows 7 Ultimate x64