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Old 10-01-05, 04:48 AM   #13
jolle
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Default Re: Am I the only one starting to hate the UE3?

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Originally Posted by Mr. Hunt
No doubt... the engine is amazing... but I can't go a freaking day without seeing a new "____ is using UE3" and I will be honest... I am really starting to hate it. I am sure UT2007 will be awesome and blah blah blah... but I want people to at least TRY to make their own, better engine.

I am sure I am alone on this though... just had to get it off my chest :\.
This is the way we are heading now.
Multithreaded games is prolly something of a "nail in the coffin" about engines.
It already takes alot of time as it is, but with MT it takes alot more time, and as the time developing engines grows, the less developers can afford doing so.
the growing complexity is the cause, perhaps better APIs (WGF i guess), and better tools for working with MT might help tho..

So I think alot less engines are gonna be made, and alot more licensed.
perhaps we will se companies who only makes engines, like we have now with physics engines for example.
The content creation time is also increasing, which is adding to the costs.
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Old 10-01-05, 05:01 AM   #14
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Default Re: Am I the only one starting to hate the UE3?

Hmm i guess you are right at some degree .. i'd like to see devs inventing thier own graphics engines rather than using other's.
i know that Q3 & Unreal2 engines used in many games but not as lot as what we see now. it seems to me that the whole game companies are getting that UE3 & no one seem to take some effort to develop a new engine.
that brings the question , are they becoming lazy to develop a new solid engines like Doom & Cry's ?
personally i liked how Starbreeze built thier OWN engine although it was pretty similar to Doom3's . it did really pushed the competetion further ahead (for ex. with the usage of soft shadows & high res textures).
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Old 10-01-05, 07:51 AM   #15
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Default Re: Am I the only one starting to hate the UE3?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Hunt
No doubt... the engine is amazing... but I can't go a freaking day without seeing a new "____ is using UE3" and I will be honest... I am really starting to hate it. I am sure UT2007 will be awesome and blah blah blah... but I want people to at least TRY to make their own, better engine.

I am sure I am alone on this though... just had to get it off my chest :\.
I agree, its the quake 3 engine all over again, no amount of tweaks in the world can change it too drastically, which means just like in the Q3 era, were gonna get a butt load of games that all pretty much look the same, use the same effects, etc. By no means is the engine not impressive, it is. But come 2007, were gonna be sick of it, while developers continue to buy it and use it.

I guess it could be worse, all these guys could have gone with source
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Old 10-01-05, 07:51 AM   #16
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Default Re: Am I the only one starting to hate the UE3?

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Originally Posted by SH64
Hmm i guess you are right at some degree .. i'd like to see devs inventing thier own graphics engines rather than using other's.
Well I figure they might still replace the Renderer and stuff like that..
Deus Ex 2 for example, they used UE2.0 and tore out the renderer, while slapping on their own "Flesh" I think they called it, and swapped Karma for Havok 2..
But I guess stuff like that is alot more restricted then making your own full engine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SH64
i know that Q3 & Unreal2 engines used in many games but not as lot as what we see now. it seems to me that the whole game companies are getting that UE3 & no one seem to take some effort to develop a new engine.
that brings the question , are they becoming lazy to develop a new solid engines like Doom & Cry's ?
personally i liked how Starbreeze built thier OWN engine although it was pretty similar to Doom3's . it did really pushed the competetion further ahead (for ex. with the usage of soft shadows & high res textures).
I think the softshadow thing in Starbreeze didnt really make sense, nor does it in fear.. can anything acctually run with it and be playable?
Softening stencil shadows seems insanly heavy..
But yeah, its good to see inovations, and we might still, but from companies who invest in ONLY making good engines, which means smaller budget for the engine since they arent also making a full game with content and stuff like that, rather more some demo content to show it off..
And ofcource there will be the big boys, id, epic etc who still makes both, cause they have the resources to do both..
perhaps.. who knows..

I guess chances are that the real difference will be that some of the people making the engines, arent making games..
The principle of the thing, selling premade highquality "engine components" such as Havok2, has shown to be profitable, and save the devs from putting all that time and effort on a physengine/engine or whatever..
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Old 10-01-05, 08:35 AM   #17
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Default Re: Am I the only one starting to hate the UE3?

Quote:
Originally Posted by aAv7
I agree, its the quake 3 engine all over again, no amount of tweaks in the world can change it too drastically, which means just like in the Q3 era, were gonna get a butt load of games that all pretty much look the same, use the same effects, etc. By no means is the engine not impressive, it is. But come 2007, were gonna be sick of it, while developers continue to buy it and use it.
Huh? I never thought any two Quake 3 engine games looked very similar to eachother. Heavy Metal FAKK2 and Call of Duty are pretty different when it comes to looks. The engine has very little effect on how the games actually look. Especially games based off of Unreal engines: XIII, Splinter Cell, and UT2004 look nothing alike. I don't know about you, but I think that was some pretty damn big tweaking they did to that engine, and UE3 will probably be just as flexible.
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Old 10-01-05, 08:43 AM   #18
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Default Re: Am I the only one starting to hate the UE3?

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Huh? I never thought any two Quake 3 engine games looked similar to eachother. Heavy Metal FAKK2 and Call of Duty are about on the farthest ends of the spectrum as you can get. The engine has very little effect on how the games actually look. Especially games based off of Unreal engines: XII, Splinter Cell, and UT2004 look nothing alike. I don't know about you, but I think that was some pretty damn big tweaking they did to that engine, and UE3 will probably be just as flexible.
I agree.

As for using predeveloped engines over building your own. I like using predeveloped engines mainly because I can focus on other parts of the engine then having to work on every aspect from scratch. Makes developement alot smoother and quicker.

I do like working on inhouse engines also, since your creating it yourself. You know far more about the engine from the start and you don't have to read tons of documentation and tutorials to learn it. Also customizing it is alot easier aswell since your know the workings of it already and wont break anything as easily.

Reminds me when I was working with the Q3 Engine and well... killed alot of work by deleting something... thank god for backups (I backup all my work now before I compile).
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Old 10-01-05, 09:50 AM   #19
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Default Re: Am I the only one starting to hate the UE3?

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Originally Posted by aAv7
...

I guess it could be worse, all these guys could have gone with source
hehe.. that's what I was going to say.
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Old 10-01-05, 11:39 AM   #20
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Default Re: Am I the only one starting to hate the UE3?

Yeah go for source & prepare for the stuttering!

Quote:
Originally Posted by jolle
I think the softshadow thing in Starbreeze didnt really make sense, nor does it in fear.. can anything acctually run with it and be playable?
Just for the record with 2 GTXs i can run Riddick with softshadows @1280x1024,noAA,8xAF smoothly & the same for FEAR but with 2xAA.
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Old 10-01-05, 11:45 AM   #21
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Default Re: Am I the only one starting to hate the UE3?

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Originally Posted by SH64
Yeah go for source & prepare for the stuttering!



Just for the record with 2 GTXs i can run Riddick with softshadows @1280x1024,noAA,8xAF smoothly & the same for FEAR but with 2xAA.
fear is even smooth for me with soft shadows at 1280x1024
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Old 10-01-05, 04:57 PM   #22
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Default Re: Am I the only one starting to hate the UE3?

Quote:
Originally Posted by aAv7
I agree, its the quake 3 engine all over again, no amount of tweaks in the world can change it too drastically, which means just like in the Q3 era, were gonna get a butt load of games that all pretty much look the same, use the same effects, etc. By no means is the engine not impressive, it is. But come 2007, were gonna be sick of it, while developers continue to buy it and use it.

I guess it could be worse, all these guys could have gone with source
No, you guys have really gotten it all wrong. We're now in the era of programmability on the graphics cards, and since Unreal Engine 3 is fully capable of supporting hundreds of different fragment programs per-pixel, and since artwork really determines the game's look, the sky is really the limit in terms of rendering style. You could set up the shaders in UE3 to make a game based on it look like the original UT, if you'd like!

Everything based on the Quake 3 engine looked the same because it was using the fixed function pipeline (in fact, most games looked more or less the same), and you couldn't really do much with the cards and engine back then to drastically change the style. Oh, and again, artwork is a significant factor!
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Old 10-02-05, 11:07 PM   #23
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Default Re: Am I the only one starting to hate the UE3?

don't forget about the cry 2 engine.
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