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Old 08-27-03, 08:28 AM   #251
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Sorry to disappoint you, but a power supply won't change a thing. I have tried an Antec True Control 550, Antec True Power 430, Enermax 430, and CompUSA (PowMax) 500 w with no changes in the flickering. These were used in combination with 3 different systems.

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Old 08-27-03, 08:56 AM   #252
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Quote:
Originally posted by skoprowski
Sorry to disappoint you, but a power supply won't change a thing. I have tried an Antec True Control 550, Antec True Power 430, Enermax 430, and CompUSA (PowMax) 500 w with no changes in the flickering. These were used in combination with 3 different systems.

Scott
Same here, I've tried the Antec 600W, Wintech 400W (really 370), A AOpen 350W. And shortly I will have the option to try 3 more but I doubt it will change a thing. I've also removed all components from my system on a table (not in a case) and this also didn't change a thing.

I'm starting to look like that guy from the BFG Box from pulling out my hair:
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Old 08-27-03, 09:51 AM   #253
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I just wish we would hear someting from Nvidia- even a "still working on the problem." The longer this goes on, the worse it is for themselves. They can't ignore this now.
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Old 08-27-03, 10:25 AM   #254
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Quote:
Originally posted by skoprowski
I just wish we would hear someting from Nvidia- even a "still working on the problem." The longer this goes on, the worse it is for themselves. They can't ignore this now.
I can assure you that nvidia IS still working on the problem. Actually there will be an update on the situation end of this week or the latest during the next week.

Nvidia does know what the problem is (the same 9800 users are experiencing) and they are still evaluating a solution to the problem!
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Old 08-27-03, 10:50 AM   #255
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Only problem with that line of reasoning is that my 9800 did not flicker in the same machine that my 5900 does. My 9500 had tons of interference issues, but the 9800 did not.
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Old 08-27-03, 11:20 AM   #256
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OK, my findings (after installing Antec truepower 550 PSU), NO MORE CLICKING SOUNDS!!!!!! I'm well chuffed so that must have been power instability, however there is still a flicker especially on Black Hawk Down and FS2004 (Vietcong has none, almost none.....)

I installed the new PSU and gave the MSI FX5900 Ultra it's own power feed.....

I really didn't believe the speil about power, but now I'm more than convinced it was partly down to that.....

Although I do still have a flicker..... 90 well spent!!!
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Old 08-27-03, 12:01 PM   #257
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Quote:
Originally posted by Flavius
Only problem with that line of reasoning is that my 9800 did not flicker in the same machine that my 5900 does. My 9500 had tons of interference issues, but the 9800 did not.
I agree- I also have a Radeon 9800 Pro that DOES NOT exhibit any flickering on the same systems that the 5900 Ultra's do. I wouldn't completely say that the issues with ATI cards are exactly the same.
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Old 08-27-03, 04:11 PM   #258
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I believe the flickering problems with the ATI cards were with the 9700 Pros not the 9800 Pros. Apparently ATI has found and fixed their flickering problems already. I knew if it wasn't all of the problem it was definately part of the problem concerning the stability of the power supply to the video cards. I glad you at least have a partial fix there Jeffus. Antec power supplies IMO are the best and will help overall system stability anyway even if not the fix for the flickering.
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Old 08-28-03, 02:11 AM   #259
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Yeah, ronnuke.. I'm well impressed with the PSU.... just need to get this flicker issue sorted now..

I ran 3DMark2003 lastnight again (after my initial installation), and I now get another 1200 points since I've sorted the Clicking noise issue... so there must have been some performance lag with the lack of power....

The other issue is with the new detonator drivers 45.23 with OpenGL especially in Quake engine games.. (i.e. FOG in MOH:AA + SH).. but that's just a driver issue (??) due to there not being any issues with the 44.03 earlier drivers.
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Old 08-28-03, 08:21 AM   #260
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Quote:
Originally posted by Morrow
I can assure you that nvidia IS still working on the problem. Actually there will be an update on the situation end of this week or the latest during the next week.

Nvidia does know what the problem is (the same 9800 users are experiencing) and they are still evaluating a solution to the problem!
How do you know that?

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Old 08-28-03, 11:14 AM   #261
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Default Flickering Image Example

Rytr and I have been exploring the flickering issue. Neither Rytr nor I have experienced any flickering in Windows or games until Rytr noticed some flickering with the bar chart displayed from Ben's Custom Cases UT2K3Bench program. Rtyr has a Creative Labs 3D Blaster FX 5900 Ultra and a PowerColor 9800Pro while I have a BFG FX 5900 Ultra and an ATI All-In-Wonder 9800Pro. On all four of these cards (both ATI and NVIDIA) both Rytr and I have noticed obvious flickering on this UT2K3Bench chart. The flickering varies from horizontal flashing bars flashing very quickly (on Rytr's system) to more of an isolated square again flashing very fast in what appears to be somewhat of a checkerboard pattern on my system.

Below is a photo (that I took with my digital camera) showing this effect. It's fairly obvious in the first bar chart group on left going across the top half of blue and yellow chart. NOTE: This photo was taken with my AIW installed in my machine. The same effect was present with 5900Ultra as well.

I've also included a negative area and zoomed 200% of this area in image below this post to further identify this flicker effect. NOTE: I took close to 100 photographs of my monitor and this was the ONLY photo that came out showcasing the flicker effect. This shows how fast the flicker occurs and how lucky I was to trap it in a photo!
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Old 08-28-03, 11:16 AM   #262
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Default Flickering Image Example ...cont

...here is the second image zoomed and negative.

Also note that the typical "scan line" that is present in any photo you take of a monitor is not involved here as it is higher up on the screen at the point this photo was taken.

DISCLAIMER: This flickering effect is isolated to just this graph control in UT2K3Bench. Rtyr and I have not noticed flickering anywhere else in Windows or in any games with these four cards. This leads me to believe that the problem may be tied to the graph control (possible refresh bug with graph control or something) itself and actually have nothing to do with the cards. To determine this for sure I have e-mailed the author of UT2K3Bench and requested his insight. I'll post here if/when he responds with his comments.
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Old 08-28-03, 11:27 AM   #263
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Guys, please see:

On another forum...

It seems the res/colour-depth is associated from my tests. As for the "not enough power", it has to be an erroneous message coz I've tried with all fans, both CD's and the floppy disconnected and I have a 450w Enermax PSU.

Quite frankly I think NVidia are bang out of order releasing 400 hardware in this state. That 400 entitles the purchaser to the very best quality, not some shonky cash-in piece of second-rate crap which is what these supposedly 'uber' cards actually are. I think it's time NVidia got a wake-up call by way of law-suits and bancruptcy. Very angry here.
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Old 08-28-03, 11:46 AM   #264
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Quote:
Originally posted by Siggi
Quite frankly I think NVidia are bang out of order releasing 400 hardware in this state. That 400 entitles the purchaser to the very best quality, not some shonky cash-in piece of second-rate crap which is what these supposedly 'uber' cards actually are. I think it's time NVidia got a wake-up call by way of law-suits and bancruptcy. Very angry here.
I'm not dismissing those that have had problems with NVIDIA and ATI cards flickering. However, making blanket statements is not going to help solve anything. There are people out there (like myself) who haven't had a single problem with their 5900 Ultra or 9800Pro. How can we explain that?

I'm just saying that some balance is in order IMO. I would be so mad I could spit too if I was stuck with a card costing that much money with the kinds of problems I read about. After spitting, though, I'd RMA the sucker and move on (hopefully).
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Old 08-28-03, 12:13 PM   #265
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Quote:
Originally posted by maxpower
After spitting, though, I'd RMA the sucker and move on (hopefully).
Yeah, nothing like beta testing a video card for the price of shipping (both ways) and a 15% restocking fee.... yeah.. can't beat that.
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Old 08-28-03, 12:31 PM   #266
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Quote:
Originally posted by LordSpawn
Yeah, nothing like beta testing a video card for the price of shipping (both ways) and a 15% restocking fee.... yeah.. can't beat that.
You're right. I never said it was perfect. And I don't consider the 5900 Ultra I have to be in a beta stage whatsoever. I also can't see that many vendors can get away with the shipping charges and 15% restocking fee...not saying it isn't true though. If that is the case then I would be extremely upset with the add-in vendor's return policy in this case.
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Old 08-28-03, 12:39 PM   #267
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"I'm not dismissing those that have had problems with NVIDIA and ATI cards flickering. However, making blanket statements is not going to help solve anything. There are people out there (like myself) who haven't had a single problem with their 5900 Ultra or 9800Pro. How can we explain that?"

We can explain it by saying a very lucky minority have received cards of an acceptable quality whilst the majority have forked out a hell of a lot of cash for sub-standard seconds produced by arrogant hacks with a blase disregard for the welfare of their customers.

When NVidia send me a brand-new card that works, with a pre-paid box for the return of the old one, I'll cut them some slack. Until then I have 400-worth of extreme legitimacy to be totally outraged.

That's 400 for a PCB with some silicon soldered on...at the very least I expect it to produce 400-worth of eye-candy, not flicker like a two-bob knock-off Chinese TV set.

Back to the topic at hand...where is the update from them regarding the fix? Or isn't there one?
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Old 08-28-03, 12:49 PM   #268
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Siggi we are not NVIDIA. We have no say so in what NVIDIA does, this thread isn't about taking your frustrations out on NVNEWS staff. So dont go smart mouthing my staff or your gone. Common courtesy is not optional here its a requirement.
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Old 08-28-03, 12:53 PM   #269
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Quote:
Originally posted by MikeC
Siggi we are not NVIDIA. We have no say so in what NVIDIA does, this thread isn't about taking your frustrations out on NVNEWS staff. So dont go smart mouthing my staff or your gone. Common courtesy is not optional here its a requirement.


Once I get my replacement card from Albatron (which will be soon hopefully) I'll test it to see if it exhibits this problem. Prior to it deciding it didn't want to work when connected to the power supply, this card showed none of the flickering symptoms at all. I'm positive I read another member (who has the same card) say he didn't have any problems as well. Is there anyone here with an Albatron FX5900PV who can say either way if you've had this trouble?
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Old 08-28-03, 12:53 PM   #270
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Quote:
We can explain it by saying a very lucky minority have received cards of an acceptable quality whilst the majority have forked out a hell of a lot of cash for sub-standard seconds
It's obvious that you're upset but please understand that I'm not NVIDIA or ATI. I'm not defending them either. What I am trying to do is to help.

Do you have statistics for your "minority" and "majority" claims? I just know that the "loudest bird gets the worm" cliche can easily apply in situations like this. I know more people that have no problem with their 5900 Ultra or Radeon than those that do. Those that do, obviously, will be exceedingly more vocal about it.

As for your question about the fix, I do not know of any to date.
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Old 08-28-03, 01:14 PM   #271
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Quote:
Originally posted by saturnotaku


Once I get my replacement card from Albatron (which will be soon hopefully) I'll test it to see if it exhibits this problem.
You will experience the same issues with the new card.

Again, the problem is not that flickering cards are faulty, the issue is of a completely different nature and depends partially on the system configuration
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Old 08-28-03, 01:16 PM   #272
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Quote:
Originally posted by Morrow
You will experience the same issues with the new card.

Again, the problem is not that flickering cards are faulty, the issue is of a completely different nature and depends partially on the system configuration
The next sentence I posted after what you cut off said that I didn't have a problem.
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Old 08-28-03, 01:21 PM   #273
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Default ...

EDIT: ranted @ a now banned member who showed no respect or decency.

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Old 08-28-03, 01:21 PM   #274
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Quote:
Originally posted by Siggi
No need for Rubbish to be repeated
I'm new at moderating so I'm not quite sure how to handle this ridiculous post. I'll let the more experienced mods step in.

Siggi...I don't know you and I make it a point not to get personal with people. I hope, though, that you rethink what you've said because it's all baseless and flat out rude. MikeC is a stand up guy and widely respected...you couldn't be more wrong about him. For you to flame like this it's clear that your goal is self-aggrandizement; too bad since that's not the goal here.

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Old 08-28-03, 01:23 PM   #275
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Quote:
Originally posted by Morrow
You will experience the same issues with the new card.

Again, the problem is not that flickering cards are faulty, the issue is of a completely different nature and depends partially on the system configuration
Please enlighten us. I have two cards that are completely free of the flickering problem except in the window as described by Maxpower. I have also tested the cards on four completely different systems and results remain the same. One system with NF2 chipset, one with AliMaGik1 chipset, one a Via KT133a chipset, and one Via KT266a chipset.
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