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Old 08-22-02, 01:41 PM   #13
druga runda
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Doesn't have to be Christmas, but it could be Feb as NV30's will start to come out in big numbers so Ati could come out with the card that beats it???

Or at least beats it on price/performance if NV30 yields are so low.

With the previews in December of course
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Old 08-22-02, 01:49 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by saturnotaku


So if the NV30 is out on schedule for the Christmas season, assuming that people have received their 9700's now and the above statement is true, the 9700 will have been out only 4 months before they release a higher-powered refresh. That doesn't seem like a very smart thing to do because there's a very good chance a lot of current 9700 owners will be pissed that ATI released a more powerful card only 4 months after they shelled out $400 for what they have now.

Unless someone can clarify, this really doesn't sound right.
Sounds like the GF3 Ti's to me. Released in November, with the GF4's coming out roughly 5 months later.
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Old 08-22-02, 01:56 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by pelly
Back and forth until one card runs out of options...Because NV30 is using slightly newer technology, I would assume that the 9700 would run-out of options first.
Honestly, I think your logic is 180 degrees backwards. Unless Nvidia can significantly outperform the 9700 with their .13u part, they will run out of options sooner. TSMC and UMC won't have a 0.9u process ready next year and ATi can move to both .13u and DDR2. No, Nvidia has got to significantly outperform the 9700 or pray that ATi has serious problems redesigning the chip for the .13u process.
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Old 08-22-02, 02:00 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by John Reynolds
No, Nvidia has got to significantly outperform the 9700 or pray that ATi has serious problems redesigning the chip for the .13u process.
I agree. Because ATI could very easily learn from any mistakes/problems/issues NVIDIA had with the .13 process and make sure not to repeat the history. I think we know the NV30 is going to be darn good, but it's still going to be a while before we have any conclusive evidence. To quote Tom Petty:

The waiting is the hardest part...
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Old 08-22-02, 02:07 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by SnakeEyes

(Who here thinks it would be nice to have cards that will run all our games at max resolutions with high AA and high aniso enabled, while getting framerates that never dip below our monitor refresh rates? Seems like this might be possible, at least until DoomIII hits.)
Thats what a new card is all about.

I wanna crank everything to 1600X1200 with 4XAA and 16X AF on my 21" trintron and game away.

Screw playing at lower settings.
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Old 08-22-02, 02:09 PM   #18
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JohnReynolds
Quote:
TSMC and UMC won't have a 0.9u process ready next year
http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=5055



Quote:
A REPORT IN English-language newspaper the Taipei Times, said that while major chip foundry Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing (TSMC) will be ready to produce 90 nanometer technology in the fourth quarter of this year, demand for such products is well nigh non-existent.
As for the .13 process, it will surely take much less time for ATI to produce a part this size. In this case, NVIDIA was the pioneer. This is a good thing, although it always makes them the "lab rat". They have to deal with all the initial fab problems that will likely be solved by the time ATI looks to make a .13 part.
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Old 08-22-02, 02:38 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by pelly
JohnReynolds


http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=5055





As for the .13 process, it will surely take much less time for ATI to produce a part this size. In this case, NVIDIA was the pioneer. This is a good thing, although it always makes them the "lab rat". They have to deal with all the initial fab problems that will likely be solved by the time ATI looks to make a .13 part.
I highly, highly doubt that link is accurate. But let's try this: I predict that the first NV30 refresh will still be fabbed at .13u. You agree or not?
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Old 08-22-02, 02:42 PM   #20
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I certainly agree, although I suspect that the shelf-life of that update will be surprisingly short.

Here's a question for you:

Will ATI play the role of pioneer and try to .09 or will they stick to the next step of .13?

If they stick at .13, imagine what a leap NVIDIA has on them since they've been designing at that size for a fair amount of time whereas ATI will be noobies.

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Old 08-22-02, 03:21 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by saturnotaku


So if the NV30 is out on schedule for the Christmas season, assuming that people have received their 9700's now and the above statement is true, the 9700 will have been out only 4 months before they release a higher-powered refresh. That doesn't seem like a very smart thing to do because there's a very good chance a lot of current 9700 owners will be pissed that ATI released a more powerful card only 4 months after they shelled out $400 for what they have now.

Unless someone can clarify, this really doesn't sound right.
Yet people here think this is precisely what NVIDIA will do... release the NV30 around year's end and have a "refresh" (some people are crazy enough to even suppose the NV35) ready for a spring release.
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Old 08-22-02, 03:22 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by SnakeEyes
(Who here thinks it would be nice to have cards that will run all our games at max resolutions with high AA and high aniso enabled, while getting framerates that never dip below our monitor refresh rates? Seems like this might be possible, at least until DoomIII hits.)
*holds up hand*
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Old 08-22-02, 04:01 PM   #23
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Amen...

*the annoying brat who always raises two-hands*

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Old 08-22-02, 04:01 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by pelly
I certainly agree, although I suspect that the shelf-life of that update will be surprisingly short.

Here's a question for you:

Will ATI play the role of pioneer and try to .09 or will they stick to the next step of .13?

If they stick at .13, imagine what a leap NVIDIA has on them since they've been designing at that size for a fair amount of time whereas ATI will be noobies.

Again, I think your logic is wrong. Having a finished, completed architecture and moving it to a process that has had time to mature is far easier than creating a new architecture on a new process. The fab's tools will have matured, their yields will have improved, and the actual design and layout of the chip was worked out for its initial creation.

Oh, and to answer your question. Do you mean with their 9700 refresh (possibly the R350 we're hearing rumors of) or R400?
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