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View Poll Results: Are they cheating again?
Yes 132 67.01%
No 53 26.90%
I don't have a clue by four. 12 6.09%
Voters: 197. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-15-03, 07:58 AM   #109
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Quote:
Originally posted by vampireuk
24 people have voted no, it hardly represents the entire online community does it.
No but it represents the nVidia friednly people.

And he was referring to nVidiots and fanATIcs ya know.
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Old 05-15-03, 08:01 AM   #110
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Originally posted by nVidi0t No, because I have tested it, and major differences to system spec, but not changing the display card does not affect performance in the benchmark, yet in games, the average FPS is 50% faster.
That's because it's a VID-CARD-test, not CPU-test! With previous 3DMArk, they were criticized that the benchmark is being held back by the CPU. That's why the new 3DMark is alot more vid-card dependant.

Quote:
It shows all the specs, and allows you to compare your results to other users with the same CPU, obviously it's a system comparison.
Since it does have tests that are not vid-card dependant (like the sound-test), it's a good thing to show all relevant specs. Besides, showing the specs does no harm, so why not do it?

Quote:
The sound tests do impact score.
WRONG! Here's what Futuremark says about this (page 20 of the whitepaper):

"Each of the four game tests generates a frame-rate that is used to calculate the overall score"

It even show the formula that they usaed to calculate the score!

Quote:
And the CPU tests should aswell, yet trying an exact system spec with another CPU almost 50% faster, the 3dmark scores remain the same.
As it should be since it's a VID-CARD BENCHMARK!

Quote:
It's a bad benchmark. Game engine benchmarks are the only real way of determining performance WHICH MATTERS to the customer, they are going to be playing games, not benchmarks. (unless they are like a few peeps here.. lol)
NV didn't have any problems with previous 3DMarks when they were perfectly suited for their feature-set. Now that that is not the case, they whine that "only game-benchmarks matter". hypocrisy, plain and simple.
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Old 05-15-03, 08:02 AM   #111
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Quote:
Originally posted by AnteP
You my dear sir is a liar.

No score except the ones from game Test 1 through 4 has an impact on the final score.

3Dmark03 was DESIGNED to put the load on the videocard. You know why?
Because that's the future of shading intense games.

Here's what Futuremark had to say about even before it was available for download:
http://www.nordichardware.se/artikla...sh/Futuremark/

[NH]: There has been some complaints that the CPU, RAM and MOBO influenced the scores too much, is this any different in the 03 version?
[FM]: As we have focused even more heavily on the Shaders in 3DMark®03, the graphics card is more of a bottleneck than it was in 2000 and 2001. 3DMark®03 comes with a separate CPU test for more in-depth CPU benchmarking.

Iraqi Information Minister indeed.
No lies, just facts.

As a benchmark for gaming performance, 3dmark03 is poor.

And no sir, I am not half as dellusional as Sahaf
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Old 05-15-03, 08:08 AM   #112
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Quote:
Originally posted by vampireuk
How about I make a picture of some NVIDIA engineers eating a baby, you could do with something new to cry about
They'd probably cheat and not eat the whole baby anyway...
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Old 05-15-03, 08:08 AM   #113
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Quote:
Originally posted by Nemesis77
That's because it's a VID-CARD-test, not CPU-test! With previous 3DMArk, they were criticized that the benchmark is being held back by the CPU. That's why the new 3DMark is alot more vid-card dependant.



Since it does have tests that are not vid-card dependant (like the sound-test), it's a good thing to show all relevant specs. Besides, showing the specs does no harm, so why not do it?



WRONG! Here's what Futuremark says about this (page 20 of the whitepaper):

"Each of the four game tests generates a frame-rate that is used to calculate the overall score"

It even show the formula that they usaed to calculate the score!



As it should be since it's a VID-CARD BENCHMARK!



NV didn't have any problems with previous 3DMarks when they were perfectly suited for their feature-set. Now that that is not the case, they whine that "only game-benchmarks matter". hypocrisy, plain and simple.
I dont care if nVidia didn't have problems with older 3dmark benchmarks. I really wont defend nVidia against any sort of foul play or cheating, because sure, they might do it, but that doesn't effect the excellent track record of nVidia graphics cards I have owned.

About the sound tests, It affects the score because it records framerates based on the hit caused by 3d sound being processed by your Audio processor. So audio tests CLEARLY affect your overall score
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Old 05-15-03, 08:10 AM   #114
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Quote:
Originally posted by nVidi0t
About the sound tests, It affects the score because it records framerates based on the hit caused by 3d sound being processed by your Audio processor. So audio tests CLEARLY affect your overall score
No, I'm pretty sure only the four game tests are used to calculate the score.
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Old 05-15-03, 08:11 AM   #115
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Quote:
Originally posted by nVidi0t
No lies, just facts.

As a benchmark for gaming performance, 3dmark03 is poor.

And no sir, I am not half as dellusional as Sahaf
Your facts are wrong, but your conclusion is right, at least at the present.

Anyhow, I have the 3rd fastest GF4 card in the entire world at the moment in 3dmark03 ..now that's important

Regards

Andy
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Old 05-15-03, 08:12 AM   #116
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hanners
No, I'm pretty sure only the four game tests are used to calculate the score.
I'm sure the audio tests do, because it records FPS, and my score increased when I patched my Audigy to run the 64 channel test.
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Old 05-15-03, 08:12 AM   #117
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Quote:
Originally posted by nVidi0t
About the sound tests, It affects the score because it records framerates based on the hit caused by 3d sound being processed by your Audio processor. So audio tests CLEARLY affect your overall score
Get a clue will ya.

Only the FOUR GAME TESTS will impact the score.
It was the same in 3DMark2001. You can turn off all other tests and your score remains exactly the same.

Do you honestly belive that all reviews run the whole ******* thing each and every time they benchmark. Man that would take ages.

Just get the Pro-version and turn off the sound tests and you'll see that your 3Dmark score does not differ.

From the 3Dmark readme:

"The results from the four game tests are then collated to produce the total 3DMark score."

"The 3DMark total score is calculated using the following formula:

3DMark score = (GT1fps * 7.3) + (GT2fps * 37) + (GT3fps * 47.1) + (GT4fps * 38.7)" <- I don't see no sound test in there, do you?

"All supported game tests must be selected and run, in order to get a 3DMark overall score."



You installing a new driver might very well have influenced the score. Even if the soundcard doesn't do anything it will still have some impact on the score. This is easily verifyable using Quake3.
Run a timedemo and get the score. Then shut off your soundcard in the device manager and run again: presto you gained a few fps'.

Last edited by AnteP; 05-15-03 at 08:16 AM.
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Old 05-15-03, 08:14 AM   #118
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Quote:
Originally posted by nVidi0t


About the sound tests, It affects the score because it records framerates based on the hit caused by 3d sound being processed by your Audio processor. So audio tests CLEARLY affect your overall score
If you put your cpu up by 100Mhz you get an extra 10 points, so the audio is going to do bugger all in effect !

Also, I don't think, from memory, it doesn't play audio during the game tests, only the sound tests ......

Regards

Andy

Last edited by zakelwe; 05-15-03 at 08:20 AM.
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Old 05-15-03, 08:21 AM   #119
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Quote:
Originally posted by AnteP
Get a clue will ya.

Only the FOUR GAME TESTS will impact the score.
It was the same in 3DMark2001. You can turn off all other tests and your score remains exactly the same.

Do you honestly belive that all reviews run the whole ******* thing each and every time they benchmark. Man that would take ages.

Just get the Pro-version and turn off the sound tests and you'll see that your 3Dmark score does not differ.

From the 3Dmark readme:

"The results from the four game tests are then collated to produce the total 3DMark score."

"The 3DMark total score is calculated using the following formula:

3DMark score = (GT1fps * 7.3) + (GT2fps * 37) + (GT3fps * 47.1) + (GT4fps * 38.7)" <- I don't see no sound test in there, do you?

"All supported game tests must be selected and run, in order to get a 3DMark overall score."



You installing a new driver might very well have influenced the score. Even if the soundcard doesn't do anything it will still have some impact on the score. This is easily verifyable using Quake3.
Run a timedemo and get the score. Then shut off your soundcard in the device manager and run again: presto you gained a few fps'.
Actually, If I disable my sound card, I gain close to 100fps

I'm sorry guys if I got my facts wrong with 3dmark. My conclusion still stands that it's a poor benchmark from my own testing seeing that system performance barely effects the 3dmark score, but I was unaware that 3dmark only scored systems by the four tests only. I dont have the pro version so I was under the impession that all tests had to run for scoring criteria.
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Old 05-15-03, 08:21 AM   #120
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Quote:
Originally posted by nVidi0t
[b]No lies, just facts.

As a benchmark for gaming performance, 3dmark03 is poor.
Let me repeat: 3DMark03 is designed to be limited by the VID-CARD, not by the CPU! That's why the speed of the CPU has only marginal effect of the final score. As it should be, since the purpose of the benchmark is to measure the speed of the VID-CARD!
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