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Old 07-29-09, 04:37 PM   #73
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Default Re: F U Carmack!

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Originally Posted by NarcissistZero View Post
You guys make nice points and all, and I am a console fan sometimes myself, but it's not PC fanboyism to say a mouse is better for an FPS, and this game is predominantly an FPS, last I knew, and thus maybe we have a right to be concerned when they say we will want to play it with a gamepad.
No lie, I've had PC fanboys bitch to me that they can't use a keyboard for DMC4. I remember that it was the original Tomb Raider that made me buy my first PC Gamepad. I agree that some genres just work better with the keyboard and mouse. However, some genres work better with a gamepad.
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Old 07-29-09, 04:42 PM   #74
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Default Re: F U Carmack!

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No lie, I've had PC fanboys bitch to me that they can't use a keyboard for DMC4. I remember that it was the original Tomb Raider that made me buy my first PC Gamepad. I agree that some genres just work better with the keyboard and mouse. However, some genres work better with a gamepad.
I do not disagree... I have an Xbox 360 wired controller in my PC desk, though I use it rarely. Games that people say NEED a controller I have actually liked and played with a mouse, like Assassin's Creed or Tomb Raider. I think that is mostly about my obsession with fast and responsive camera control.

My point with Rage though was that you have to understand the shock about the idea of using one for an FPS hybrid game from iD. That just sounds like insanity. Now, he could have been talking out his rear to appeal to the mostly console audience of Game Informer, or he could be refering to the fact that the game is more adventure/racer than shooter, I don't know, but the sticker shock of using a gamepad in an iD game is easy to understand.
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Old 07-29-09, 04:45 PM   #75
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Default Re: F U Carmack!

I haven't used a game controller since the original NES. Can you have a 360 controller hooked to the PC and use the keyboard mouse for FPS aspect and game controller for the driving part?
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Old 07-29-09, 05:00 PM   #76
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Default Re: F U Carmack!

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I haven't used a game controller since the original NES. Can you have a 360 controller hooked to the PC and use the keyboard mouse for FPS aspect and game controller for the driving part?
GTA4 has a special setup for that... if Rage does not, it's because iD was lazy.
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Old 07-29-09, 05:33 PM   #77
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Default Re: F U Carmack!

afaik he hasn't done a whole lot to contribute to pc gaming growth lately anyway.
If it isn't rocket's that take him away from pc's, it's going to be something else with carmack.
He doesn't semm that driven anymore anyway.
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Old 07-30-09, 02:17 AM   #78
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Default Re: F U Carmack!

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I haven't used a game controller since the original NES. Can you have a 360 controller hooked to the PC and use the keyboard mouse for FPS aspect and game controller for the driving part?
I'd buy a 360 controller just for that.

Been meaning to get one actually...

Can you get a real Microsoft-made wired 360 controller in any color other than white?
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Old 07-30-09, 02:35 AM   #79
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Default Re: F U Carmack!

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I'd buy a 360 controller just for that.

Been meaning to get one actually...

Can you get a real Microsoft-made wired 360 controller in any color other than white?
I don't think so... I don't think you can even get the wired ones new anymore, they're all wireless now.
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Old 07-30-09, 03:06 AM   #80
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Default Re: F U Carmack!

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I don't think so... I don't think you can even get the wired ones new anymore, they're all wireless now.
I see them all over online stores for $30.

I don't want to worry about batteries and I don't need a wireless one, so I'll just grab a plain old wired 360 controller.

There isn't any difference between the ones for Windows and Xbox are there? I know the PC one comes with XP drivers but that's meaningless to me. I have Vista on every system I use.
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Old 07-30-09, 03:13 AM   #81
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Default Re: F U Carmack!

Yeah, I have the wired one for the same reasons... it works on PC, Windows finds the drivers automatically, and it works on Xbox for when my girlfriend wants to play Scrabble or something with me.
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Old 07-30-09, 03:27 AM   #82
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Default Re: F U Carmack!

Just ordered one from Amazon for $29 with free shipping.

I think I've only used a controller on my PC once or twice in the past year, and I only really ever use them for emulators, but considering the wide support for the 360 controller its kind of dumb not to get one for some games. I've been using Playstation 1 and Playstation 2 controllers on a USB adapter for 6-7 years now. They've always been great (the button-style D-Pad is second to none for lots of games) but it can be a pain to get working in newer games.

The other day my brother and I were messing around with his new setup in the living room running on a 42" LCD and we were looking for some games to play. I was digging through my bucket-o-freeware and found Knytt. Its a strange side scrolling platform-jumping-exploration game and its a TON of fun. We played it with his Adesso wireless keyboard for about 3 minutes before giving up on that (laggy and unresponsive keys). I used Pinnacle Game Profiler to set up the 360 controller to work with Knytt and the change was massive. Not only was it easier for us both to play (swap back and forth), the controller itself worked incredibly well... as did Pinnacle.
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Old 07-30-09, 05:10 AM   #83
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Default Re: F U Carmack!

Seriously who cares about companies that move to consoles, for every one that moves, another 2 pop up for the PC.

We still have the growing MMO industry for now at least. and Starwars the old republic is going to be the biggest thing since wow. (p.s i hate wow)
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Old 07-30-09, 06:33 AM   #84
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Default Re: F U Carmack!

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Seriously who cares about companies that move to consoles, for every one that moves, another 2 pop up for the PC.

We still have the growing MMO industry for now at least. and Starwars the old republic is going to be the biggest thing since wow. (p.s i hate wow)
Honestly, most MMO devs can diaf, or at least the publishers/ceos forcing decisions into the game, I feel they have just kind of missed the plot, and WoW hasnt helped.
I could rant all day about MMOs so I think I will just leave it there so I dont make too many enemies :P


Also, as far as controllers go, I use



And despite the big FPS button on it, no I dont use it to play FPS games, and I hate playing FPS without a keyboard and mouse with a passion, though I did recently have a cousin over who wanted to use the controller in L4D, so I set it up, he went walkabout so I gave it a go, managed to get through half the first level in no mercy, then near the end just sprinted past all the zombies because I was sick of the clumsy aiming, did the same thing in the second level, then I quit.
And sure, console FPS use fuzzy targeting, which is just a cheap hack to make up for lack of accuracy.
While I am on that topic, I keep watching L4D2 videos, which are all done on the 360 version, and notice how badly they suck due to the sticks, and found it extremely satisfying to see him grabbed by a charger and slammed into the ground repeatidly.....

Yes, I am a PC fanboy, well, when it comes to FPS games anyway :P (I own every current gen console, and a PSP/PS2, for other games)


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I haven't used a game controller since the original NES. Can you have a 360 controller hooked to the PC and use the keyboard mouse for FPS aspect and game controller for the driving part?
As already said, it does depend on the game, but one of my friends had a joystick which he used in BF1942 just for the flying, and used a keyboard and mouse for everything else, I havent tried it myself, but doesnt quake 4 have some vehicle parts? I know its not made by id but itd be the closest thing to compare for swapping controls, either that or quake wars.

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It just irks me that when a console style game or console centric game gets "ported" to the PC, the PC fanboy community lashes out at the developer, when they should just plug in the gamepad and play. Gamepads are another control mechanism that the PC supports, yet the PC fanboy crowd shuns it.
Honestly, its because alot of us prefer keyboard and mouse over the controllers, especially for any kind of 3d shooter, heck even those 2d sidescroller shooters that can use the mouse for aiming, and generally, game developers dont just "make the game for another platform", thats not the issue, the issue is consoles dont have widespread keyboard + mouse support, sure you can use them, if a game supports it, but they will always optimise and balance for the gamepad, and generally that leaves PC with a simplified UI, less options, and poor mouse support, I mean if you look at System Shock 2 vs Bioshock, which is ment to be the "spiritual successor", it has no inventory, stupid minigames, and less complexity all around, though luckily they did a good job at making mouse controls work.
Other "ports" suffer from poor performance and poor mouse camera control.

Though, I will say, that was more of an issue in the past, ports to PC are getting better mouse support, but still suffer from the gameplay being simplified for the simpler controller interface.

Regardless, theres no point boosting the perks of PCs, or discussing console flaws since people will just use whatever the hell they prefer anyway, which also makes my entire post pointless
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