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Old 11-06-09, 01:53 AM   #1
Elvin Presler
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Default BAM! Spontaneous Shut Down

Here's a little issue I am having with Windows 7 64. Keep in mind, only Windows 7. If I slap XP Pro or Vista 64 on here, no problems.

It spontaneously and instantaneously dies and shuts down like it wants to reboot, gets a couple lines in to the post text from the bios, then hangs there until I hit the reset/power button. It does this 2-3 times a day, seemingly at random, twice I noticed it was while watching flash video on Youtube. Another time it was right at the end of burning a CD...made it into a coaster

I know what you're thinking..."Dude, what kind of cheap, whack job power supply are you running?"

A 1 year old Topower TOP 650XPT 650w (good luck finding any info on it...it doesn't seem to exist) with 4 20a 12 volt rails I think it was. It's running one hard drive, one DVDRW, and one Geforce GTS 250.

Does anyone know if Windows 7 somehow consumes more power, exposing a weakness in the power supply or something? Or is Win 7 just friggin unstable as hell? I read about an identical issue where they were saying it had to do with Windows Task Scheduler and some tasks in there, but I disabled/deleted almost all of them and that didn't help.

On that note, I did see a lot of "phone home" crap in those tasks. Made a note to wipe that junk out in my tweaking routine for the future.
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Old 11-06-09, 06:17 AM   #2
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Default Re: BAM! Spontaneous Shut Down

1. Bios update ...
2. And also please disable any power saving features from bios (NO cool n' quiet or such, if their are such options !).
3. Within windows set your working profile to max power consumption. No hdd shutdown, only monitor if you like ! (rightclick on desktop / personalize / screen savers ... and please go to every advanced detail you can set, don't just stop there). Also : NO sleep, NO hibernate !
4. Windows 7 sata driver might also be a problem, so use the latest one from your manufacturer, EVEN IF IT MEANS FORCING IT WITH A MANUAL INSTALL over the "original microsoft" 's one. (device managager / update driver / browse / select folder with previously extracted (as a simple rar archive) driver)

NOTE : step 2 and 3 are a good advice for desktops no matter what ... trust me. Smooth ride on every application, no hickups or "tremors" of performance (ex. :games) etc.

Good luck !

P.S. If you want I can guide you to use Windows Server 2008 R2 - it's better than Windows 7 in all the aspects that really count : stability, performance ... longevity (installs and unninstalls, etc.) eidythedancer@yahoo.com
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Old 11-06-09, 06:24 AM   #3
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Default Re: BAM! Spontaneous Shut Down

i always disable windows defender and user UAC (both annoying)

and use kaspersky internet security instead
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Old 11-06-09, 03:22 PM   #4
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Default Re: BAM! Spontaneous Shut Down

Guess I should have specified that...

The moment a new Windows install boots to the desktop, I commence to turning off all fluff that I know of. I disable all the following (depending on the OS) in every place I can find it, control panels, services, gpedit, where ever:

UAC, System Restore, Volume Shadow Copies, Readyboost, Superfetch, Defender, Windows Firewall, Gadgets Platform, Indexing and Search, Error Reporting, Wake on LAN stuff, Cool n Quiet and S.M.A.R.T in the BIOS, Set high performance mode and disable screensavers, sleep and HDD shutdown set to never, Hibernation disabled via "powercfg -H off", no Desktop Composition, or shadows, transparency, fading, or any other desktop bling bling.

The sata driver I had not considered. Are there any that aren't for raid? I'll have to look around on that one.

See anything I missed there? I probably forgot a couple things that I turn off. I think I'll go slap my Windows 7 Image back on here and try it out a bit more (using XP now). I'm eyeballing this Antec power supply just in case too. Topower makes some decent PSU's but I don't really trust mine being I can find no info on it.

EDIT: I restored my image of Windows 7 Pro 64, did chkdsk /f, then was about to check and make sure I had unchecked indexing from the drives, right clicked "Backup (D)" to see properties, got an hourglass, no menu. Thought hmmm, I'll try to open it from my desktop shortcut...
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Old 11-06-09, 04:11 PM   #5
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Default Re: BAM! Spontaneous Shut Down

next time you install it, don't disable anything and see how it goes, disabling to much is probably your problem, you just disabled something you shouldn't have.
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Old 11-06-09, 04:14 PM   #6
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Default Re: BAM! Spontaneous Shut Down

Especially in 7. 7 already is optimized for best long term performance. When you disable stuff, it might seem faster, but you sacrifice long term speed and stability.
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Old 11-06-09, 04:16 PM   #7
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Default Re: BAM! Spontaneous Shut Down

I was thinking that too and have already reinstalled and run it totally default other than Nvidia drivers, sound card drivers...still failed. I don't go too nuts disabling services in 7 yet. I'm not getting any complaints in Event Viewer or anything.

Just now it did that Explorer crash/lockup from my previous post so I rebooted, right clicked that drive and it did it again! I killed the process with the dialog shown, explorer restarted, then I repeated it and it worked fine....go figure. So I can barely browse my friggin drives even without Windows 7 failing on me.

Most of the stuff I disable, are not for performance so much as to stop annoyances. System restore, Volume shadow Copies hogs many gigs of drive space and I NEVER use it because I have complete images of my partition, for example. UAC does nothing but spam me. Defender, Firewall, useless to me.

Maybe one of my drivers for my sound card or something is just crap for Win 7. That would not be unusual for a new OS.
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Old 11-06-09, 04:39 PM   #8
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Default Re: BAM! Spontaneous Shut Down

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elvin Presler View Post
It spontaneously and instantaneously dies and shuts down like it wants to reboot, gets a couple lines in to the post text from the bios, then hangs there until I hit the reset/power button.
This had hardware problems written all over. First check ALL your temps and report.
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Old 11-06-09, 05:02 PM   #9
Elvin Presler
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Default Re: BAM! Spontaneous Shut Down

That's what I am thinking too. It seems to scream bad power supply to me...except...it is fine in XP Pro, Vista 32 or 64, and only does this in Windows 7. That does not mean I am blaming Windows 7 yet. Maybe 7 has something that exposes the PSU weakness, but I don't know if or what that is yet.

What I did do yesterday was take apart the power supply to clean it out (there was barely even dust on the heatsinks yet) yank the little fan out of the bottom of my PSU and bolted a bigger one over the hole from the outside (left the second fan that blows out the back alone) to see if that changes anything. It sounds like a jet now, but no way is it getting hot in there! Also my case is an older, big, roomy Antec, all clean and dust free, with a 120mm fan bolted onto the side blowing over the Video card and CPU area. It's not hot in there.
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Old 11-06-09, 06:15 PM   #10
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Default Re: BAM! Spontaneous Shut Down

Hmmm...still getting the explorer hang/crash problem when I right click my D: drive. It's doing it right now at this moment. Going to just let it go for a while without interfering and see what it does. Maybe I can get something in Event Viewer that will clue me in.

Edit: Nope...total Windows Explorer lock up. Oddly if I ctrl+alt+del and get into task manager and use "switch to" back to Firefox, I can resume posting here, but with frozen start menu covering my screen. I'm trying to get a screen shot of that as I type this *snap-flash*, but can not open Photoshop to paste it in due to having a frozen start menu.

Edit: ...here's the screenshot. I had to end process on "Computer" and let explorer restart to continue. Then after that I can right click my D drive (second partition on single drive) and get a menu...the problem goes away. WTF? I can't imagine how I could have hosed it with my tweaks yet as there aren't many done. This is pretty close to a default install.

All I got out of Event Viewer was "Information" (not error) Winlogon: "The shell stopped unexpectedly and explorer.exe was restarted."
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Old 11-06-09, 06:38 PM   #11
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Default Re: BAM! Spontaneous Shut Down

Have you tired updating your bios like previously said? That would be my first step. Also do you have the latest windows 7 chipset drivers installed?

This really seems to be hardware related but if it doesn't happen in vista or xp.....

Try the bios first.
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Old 11-06-09, 06:58 PM   #12
Elvin Presler
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Default Re: BAM! Spontaneous Shut Down

There are no chipset drivers to my knowledge beyond windows XP.

It's an Asus M3A78 (http://www.asus.com/product.aspx?P_ID=5pvgDAXJUV2orYzn) with AMD 770 / SB700 chips.

My BIOS is pretty current, but after just checking Asus there is a new one that "Fix Windows7 WHQL bug" whatever that is. I'll give that a try. The explorer lockup thing is probably caused by some incompatible software, like the SPTD thing Alcohol 120 installs to control a virtual drive. The random shutdown part will take some time to see if a new bios helps.

I reloaded my image backup that was made before anything is installed (not even sound video drivers). Going to go bare minimum with no Alcohol 120 or other "risky" software for a while and see what I come up with.

Edit: The explorer hang/crash seems to have stopped. The spontaneous crash/shutdow did not. Made it almost one day than BAM! I don't know if I should blame Windows 7 or my power supply. I'm buying that Antec Truepower New 750 in a few days...we'll see.

Last edited by Elvin Presler; 11-08-09 at 09:34 PM.
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