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Old 01-28-10, 12:15 PM   #157
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Default Re: 5870/5970 vs. GF100 (Fermi)

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Originally Posted by slaWter View Post
Fermi already won the battle for me. I'm selling the 5970.
I wish I lived close...I would buy that thing
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Old 01-28-10, 12:57 PM   #158
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Default Re: 5870/5970 vs. GF100 (Fermi)

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Originally Posted by gulizard View Post
How is that wrong? I can go to newegg and find a dozen people that have quoted the drivers being awful, some of them being first time owners of ATI's to people who have had ATI Cards in the past and switched back?
Newegg, huh? Enough said there, I think.

Quote:
When I had ATI the drivers were junky. When one nearly burns your house down, you would be concerned.
I understand your personal experience, believe me. If that'd happened to me, I'd probably be cautious as well.

What you need to understand, though, is you are a single case out of probably millions that this has not happened to. Just because you had a negative experience does not mean it's a "garbage card." If your experiences are repeated enough to be common, THEN and only then is it justified to call ATI's quality control "garbage" and try to parade it around as fact instead of your own personal experience.

For me, I've had the exact OPPOSITE experience that you have. In my opinion, and in my experience, Nvidia's quality control has been lacking over the past few years. I've owned a total of 5 different generations of ATI cards over the years that have been flawless. Haven't had a single issue with any of them. Yet, I've owned the following Nvidia cards over the last few years that have given me lots of trouble:
  • 7900GTX - 1st card DOA. 2nd card, memory issue, froze for 60 seconds at a time while playing games
  • 8800GTX - Both initial cards had wrong resistors (68c) and would clock down to desktop speeds while gaming (VR Zone reported this in an article around G80's launch. Here was a thread on it: http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/show...resistor+issue) Had to RMA both cards. Next card died after a month. Had to RMA again. 3 bad G80 cards in a span of two months.



I didn't own the 280, but there was a thread here with over 280 replies from users who had overheating problems with the card due to the heat spreader not making proper contact with the graphics chip:

http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/show...80+overheating

I'm not saying any of this to trash Nvidia. I still buy Nvidia products. Owned a GTX260 not that long ago. And I realize that my experiences do not always represent the majority.

I do honestly believe, though, that ATI's quality control is better. I don't see nearly as many issues popping up with their GPUs as I do with Nvidia's, and my own personal experience reflects that. At the same time, I don't consider Nvidia's products "garbage" and will buy them again at some point in the future, most likely.
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Old 01-28-10, 02:11 PM   #159
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Default Re: 5870/5970 vs. GF100 (Fermi)

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Originally Posted by slaWter View Post
Fermi already won the battle for me. I'm selling the 5970.
Ditto.

5970 is being picked up on Saturday.
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Old 01-28-10, 06:06 PM   #160
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Default Re: 5870/5970 vs. GF100 (Fermi)

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Originally Posted by Xion X2 View Post
Newegg, huh? Enough said there, I think.



I understand your personal experience, believe me. If that'd happened to me, I'd probably be cautious as well.

What you need to understand, though, is you are a single case out of probably millions that this has not happened to. Just because you had a negative experience does not mean it's a "garbage card." If your experiences are repeated enough to be common, THEN and only then is it justified to call ATI's quality control "garbage" and try to parade it around as fact instead of your own personal experience.

For me, I've had the exact OPPOSITE experience that you have. In my opinion, and in my experience, Nvidia's quality control has been lacking over the past few years. I've owned a total of 5 different generations of ATI cards over the years that have been flawless. Haven't had a single issue with any of them. Yet, I've owned the following Nvidia cards over the last few years that have given me lots of trouble:
  • 7900GTX - 1st card DOA. 2nd card, memory issue, froze for 60 seconds at a time while playing games
  • 8800GTX - Both initial cards had wrong resistors (68c) and would clock down to desktop speeds while gaming (VR Zone reported this in an article around G80's launch. Here was a thread on it: http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/show...resistor+issue) Had to RMA both cards. Next card died after a month. Had to RMA again. 3 bad G80 cards in a span of two months.



I didn't own the 280, but there was a thread here with over 280 replies from users who had overheating problems with the card due to the heat spreader not making proper contact with the graphics chip:

http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/show...80+overheating

I'm not saying any of this to trash Nvidia. I still buy Nvidia products. Owned a GTX260 not that long ago. And I realize that my experiences do not always represent the majority.

I do honestly believe, though, that ATI's quality control is better. I don't see nearly as many issues popping up with their GPUs as I do with Nvidia's, and my own personal experience reflects that. At the same time, I don't consider Nvidia's products "garbage" and will buy them again at some point in the future, most likely.
The quality control thing might be due to the fact that ATi actually manufactures all of the high end reference cards themselves with the AIB partners only adding a sticker and packaging. AIB partners are responsible for actually fabricating non-reference designs(includes coolers).

nV isn't responsible for anything but the chip really, the AIB partner is responsible for the rest.
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Old 01-28-10, 06:48 PM   #161
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Default Re: 5870/5970 vs. GF100 (Fermi)

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Originally Posted by SexyRaptor View Post
Dude, guys, ninja and gulizard, both of you guys are 30 years old. Both of you guys should have learned some humbleness by now. Reading this entire argument is painful, and it's pointless. Prime likes ninjas, and gulizard likes tupac, gots him some dual stacks, and has a large penis. So what?

I know you guys have families and probably a son you could be playing catch with and spending time with. But instead you guys choose to bicker, and waste time attacking each other about pointless, minute crap that won't matter a in a few months. Come on gentlemen, stop acting like insecure high schoolers who are too stubborn to realize that their ego's are getting them no where.
Am I the only one who lol'd at a Raptor telling a Lizard off?



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Old 01-28-10, 06:52 PM   #162
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Default Re: 5870/5970 vs. GF100 (Fermi)

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Originally Posted by gulizard View Post
Bet your E-Penis got hard didn't it. Its an unoffical review. The name of the site isn't ATINEWS DUMB ASS. I still have yet to see MikeC say hes using an ATI card. This forum is fine for ATI, but jesus stop saying ATI is a superior card to nvidia, because that simply isn't true.
Who do you think I bought my 4870 from?

Mike is obviously running an Nvidia-centric site but he is also open to new tech and he does in fact use other cards to provide all users of this forum, and denizens of da INTRANETS, information they can use to form their own decisions and acquire the best products.

This is why he is respected and people listen to his recommendations and gripes.

Also, Mike has yet to (IMO and AFAIK) come forth and say AMD SUCKS and DON'T USE AMD CARDS.

Please do not project your personal biases onto Mike and use that as a crutch for your arguments.

This thread is about AMD latest gen compared to Nvidia's forth-coming latest gen. Getting all fanboyed up will not make a lick of difference in the grand-scheme of things when it comes to actual performance numbers, IQ and feature-set.
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Old 01-29-10, 02:32 AM   #163
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Default Re: 5870/5970 vs. GF100 (Fermi)

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Originally Posted by Sazar View Post
Who do you think I bought my 4870 from?

Mike is obviously running an Nvidia-centric site but he is also open to new tech and he does in fact use other cards to provide all users of this forum, and denizens of da INTRANETS, information they can use to form their own decisions and acquire the best products.

This is why he is respected and people listen to his recommendations and gripes.

Also, Mike has yet to (IMO and AFAIK) come forth and say AMD SUCKS and DON'T USE AMD CARDS.

Please do not project your personal biases onto Mike and use that as a crutch for your arguments.

This thread is about AMD latest gen compared to Nvidia's forth-coming latest gen. Getting all fanboyed up will not make a lick of difference in the grand-scheme of things when it comes to actual performance numbers, IQ and feature-set.
Thank you. I didn't know Mike had ATI cards, He sold it though. Meaning he didn't exactly use it as a main card.

I never seen Mike say nothing bad. If you were a owner of a site this big would you?

XionX2. I understand your experience as well. I have had the opposite with nvidia cards. I had a 6800 GT go out, and XFX replaced it right away with a new card. You get bad ones and good ones. However that was the only nvidia card I owned. I think the manufactures can mess up as well. EVGA has been rock solid with me. As far as ATI goes, this was back when it was an ATI card. This wasn't a sapphire, or any of that. It was an actual ATI brand card. Meaning ATI made it.

As for drivers, lots of people dislike ATI's drivers. I hate change, so if you ask me my opinion of a nvidia card, I've been using it longest, and have fell in love with the drivers both new and old. I defended you because you never attacked me for having an opinion. I did mention a few facts that weren't really facts but a majority of people agreed over the ones that disagreed.

I have stayed from this thread just to show I didn't have to post. I don't want to start a flame war here. I like this forum. Lets keep it friendly... XionX2 I respect you for your intelligence. You seem very very smart with hardware, which is a great thing. I've read other post, and never had any issues with the post you made.. Still don't.
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Old 01-29-10, 11:50 AM   #164
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Default Re: 5870/5970 vs. GF100 (Fermi)

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Originally Posted by gulizard View Post
Thank you. I didn't know Mike had ATI cards, He sold it though. Meaning he didn't exactly use it as a main card.

I never seen Mike say nothing bad. If you were a owner of a site this big would you?

XionX2. I understand your experience as well. I have had the opposite with nvidia cards. I had a 6800 GT go out, and XFX replaced it right away with a new card. You get bad ones and good ones. However that was the only nvidia card I owned. I think the manufactures can mess up as well. EVGA has been rock solid with me. As far as ATI goes, this was back when it was an ATI card. This wasn't a sapphire, or any of that. It was an actual ATI brand card. Meaning ATI made it.

As for drivers, lots of people dislike ATI's drivers. I hate change, so if you ask me my opinion of a nvidia card, I've been using it longest, and have fell in love with the drivers both new and old. I defended you because you never attacked me for having an opinion. I did mention a few facts that weren't really facts but a majority of people agreed over the ones that disagreed.

I have stayed from this thread just to show I didn't have to post. I don't want to start a flame war here. I like this forum. Lets keep it friendly... XionX2 I respect you for your intelligence. You seem very very smart with hardware, which is a great thing. I've read other post, and never had any issues with the post you made.. Still don't.
Good to see you understand and hear others opinions gulizard. I too have had the same personal experiences that XionX2 has, but you won't see me calling Nvidia's cards garbage either. Both companies have good and bad in them. It just grates on me when fanboys on either side blast the other.

Anyhoo........looking forward to some real world benches on GF100 Fermi cards.....then watch ATI release thier refresh to counter. Gotta love competiion!!!

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Old 01-29-10, 11:50 AM   #165
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Default Re: 5870/5970 vs. GF100 (Fermi)

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Originally Posted by Xion X2 View Post
Newegg, huh? Enough said there, I think.



I understand your personal experience, believe me. If that'd happened to me, I'd probably be cautious as well.

What you need to understand, though, is you are a single case out of probably millions that this has not happened to. Just because you had a negative experience does not mean it's a "garbage card." If your experiences are repeated enough to be common, THEN and only then is it justified to call ATI's quality control "garbage" and try to parade it around as fact instead of your own personal experience.

For me, I've had the exact OPPOSITE experience that you have. In my opinion, and in my experience, Nvidia's quality control has been lacking over the past few years. I've owned a total of 5 different generations of ATI cards over the years that have been flawless. Haven't had a single issue with any of them. Yet, I've owned the following Nvidia cards over the last few years that have given me lots of trouble:
  • 7900GTX - 1st card DOA. 2nd card, memory issue, froze for 60 seconds at a time while playing games
  • 8800GTX - Both initial cards had wrong resistors (68c) and would clock down to desktop speeds while gaming (VR Zone reported this in an article around G80's launch. Here was a thread on it: http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/show...resistor+issue) Had to RMA both cards. Next card died after a month. Had to RMA again. 3 bad G80 cards in a span of two months.



I didn't own the 280, but there was a thread here with over 280 replies from users who had overheating problems with the card due to the heat spreader not making proper contact with the graphics chip:

http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/show...80+overheating

I'm not saying any of this to trash Nvidia. I still buy Nvidia products. Owned a GTX260 not that long ago. And I realize that my experiences do not always represent the majority.

I do honestly believe, though, that ATI's quality control is better. I don't see nearly as many issues popping up with their GPUs as I do with Nvidia's, and my own personal experience reflects that. At the same time, I don't consider Nvidia's products "garbage" and will buy them again at some point in the future, most likely.
+1

Well said.

Kapt
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Old 01-29-10, 01:29 PM   #166
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Default Re: 5870/5970 vs. GF100 (Fermi)

I have to ask- those of you that are selling your 5970... what are you replacing it with?

And why are you selling it? Fermi wont be available for a couple more months at the earliest...?
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Old 01-29-10, 01:58 PM   #167
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Default Re: 5870/5970 vs. GF100 (Fermi)

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Originally Posted by slaWter View Post
I'm replacing it with my good old 280s SLI. It's slower but performance isn't everything. But my second 280 is at my parents place, so for now it's just one 280. My plan is to get two Fermis in March.
The reason I sold the 5970 are the awful drivers. Game support was ok but I had troubles with FRAPS, DXVA, MPCHC and the system wasn't stable anymore. Had quite a few crashes in games and while watching movies.
So you already own the 280s then... okay. Was afraid that maybe you were selling the 5970s just to purchase a couple of considerably slower cards.

As to drivers- can't comment as I don't own ATi. However, as of the past couple years I see just as many complaints regarding ATi drivers, as I do nVidia. So it seems to me that both companies would be comparable in regards to the quality of their drivers... nVidia *maybe* being ever so slightly ahead due to greater SLi compatibility and other such "features" that most folks wouldn't care about (to be honest... most folk don't run multiple video cards nor PhysX).

Unless Fermi proves to be God's gift to man-kind, I'm hoping to get a couple of ATi's refreshes... 5890 or what ever they'll be called- assuming the price isn't too high per card and I have the cash.

But for now, even at 1680 x 1050, these 8800GTXs are doing great. lol... I'm actually more conscerned about investing in an additional 8GB of RAM as I prefer no page file and have already had problems in regards to not having enough RAM (have 4GB currently).
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Old 01-29-10, 03:38 PM   #168
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Default Re: 5870/5970 vs. GF100 (Fermi)

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Originally Posted by slaWter View Post
Yeah I never even thought about selling the nV cards. I just got the 5970 to try it out and to see how ATI is doing. Like with the 4870X2 a year ago.
Hardware is kick ass but I still don't like their drivers. Game compatibility was better than a year ago but I had other minor but crazy annoying bugs.

I'll try ATI in a year or so again and who knows, maybe I'll like it and keep the card. But as for know, they have a lot of work to do but are heading in the right direction IMO. Looking forward to future ATI products and drivers...
Yeah... some of the problems you mentioned I had no idea what you were talking about.

I think if you're like me, where you just fire up the game- go to the in-game settings and max it out and just play like that you'll be fine with ATi. nVidia seems to have better support for over-riding in-game settings. Like some titles not allowing for AA in-game, I've heard people complain about not being able to force it via the CCC (while other's claim to do it just fine).

I'm neutral- if nVidia's offerings are within my price range and offer better performance (higher FPS, lower power consumption, less heat, etc) than ATi's I'll go with nVidia. That's looking very unlikely however so I'm "prepared" to go ATi with my next purchase.

I'm just so grateful that X58 allows for CrossFire and SLi. Really, it's the main selling point for me with the Core i7 platform.
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