I know nobody really knows but is a GTX480 going to be faster then a HD5970

[shadow001]

Originally Posted by XMAN52373

Its hald assed no matter how you cut it. it wouldn't take up more system resources to leave the stuff on teh screen with todays being able to culling to remove what ian't seen.

Add the buffer requirements for high resolution,AA and texture storage on top,or that a lot more memory is being consumed on the video card,when it's powering up 3 displays in eyefinity.


And in a multiplayer game like bad company 2,if the locations off all objects remain on the ground and you use LOD to only load it when you can actually see it,that information also has to be uploaded to every client playing the game on that server,so that all players see it as well,the exact same way you do....Might work well when you're on a lan,not so well with the web being much slower and ping screwing things up though.

[Rollo]

Originally Posted by shadow001

I'm not in marketing actually,as it requires the single ability to bull**** while keeping a straight face,and source wise,i read many different ones,not just charlie's btw...I'm too old and experienced to get Bull****ted either way basically and let's just say(to put it mildly)the statements you've been making are hardly on an even keel here.

As you are to old to to bullsh*t with a straight face, did you wear a crazy grin as you posted the following bullsh*t, in half of one thread no less:

Originally Posted by shadow001

They did release the NV 30(Aka 5800 ultra),and like Fermi,it was late,used more power,cooler was noisy as hell and a lot more expensive than the 9700 pro...


About the only thing left not to make it NV 30 revision 2.0 is how it performs,but Nvidia is still keeping that a secret so it's not exactly confidence inspiring here,though i'm hoping for the best,since with both companies competing for our money,it means faster cards,sooner,for less money.

Considering the amount of holdup's they've had so far,in my view,the first generation of Fermi gives the impression that it simply isn't that great to begin with...Patience and understanding only go so far,and we're not that far away from the 5 month mark since the HD5870 was released.

so let's hope that this thing really gets released in march and that availability is actually decent,and not just slightly better than a paper launch where a lot of users won't be able to find one,even after waiting for them this long.

In short,HD5970's are monsters,and ATI are going to EOL the current HD5800/5900 lineup by the end of march supposedly,as new refresh cards are going to be released by early april it seems.....Right when Fermi is supposed to be released incidently.


Looks like ATI are already preparing a warm welcome for Fermi.


Anyhow,the overall situation for Nvidia is pretty crappy given that ATI has basically introduced their entire lineup of DX11 cards,covering from 60$ budget cards,all the way to the highest end ones,before nvidia releases even their first high end DX11 model,so they're lagging behind in a huge way here,not just on the high end,but all price points and models,which the lower end versions are the ones that sell in large volumes and pay the bills.



Anyone care to bet when we'll see a midrange 250$ card based on the fermi architecture from Nvidia?

It's really a bit of a strech to state it's the supposed release period either,just unconfirmed rumors,even if they're coming from several hardware sites....The definitive answer is with Nvidia,and they've been silent on release dates,performance,power use and prices.


With ATI possibly releasing refreshes of all their cards in that same rumored timeframe that Fermi is supposed to be released,and even if Fermi did have a performance lead with the original HD5800 lineup,will that be the same with the refresh versions?


Has fermi's window of oportunity to shine as the fastest card on the market come and gone,given all the delays it's suffered so far?.....That's the main question.

If it's over 500$ and finally gets released,beating the current HD5870 cards by the rumored 20%,then you'll have the same situation that existed between the HD4870 cards and the GTX280,or between the HD4890 and the GTX285 cards.....Nvidia charging a large premium for a relatively small lead in overall performance,even if you discount the card being released 6 months late,compared to when the HD5870 was released.


And it still doesn't beat the HD5970 cards anyhow,not to mention that there could be refresh cards from ATI shortly after Fermi is released,so Nvidia really screwed up here,at least when it comes to the first generation of the GF100,and it's time to look past that to be honest,into the second or third generation of Fermi,hopefully using a smaller fab process.

Ouch if true,and even though it comes from charlie over at semi accurate,which is widely known he's got no love for Nvidia to say the least,he has been pretty accurate with regards to fermi issues over past 6 months,so his sources,whoever they are,have been providing accurate information.


http://www.semiaccurate.com/2010/02/...and-unfixable/


Seems the A3 yeilds are still way too low for any sort of high volume availability,and that to fix it and the high power draw,doesn't require a simpler and faster metal respin like what they've been doing for the last 3 revisions so far(A1 to A3),but a full base layer respin which would include new masks,and delay fermi at least another 3~6 months in the process.


Also seems that the clock speeds for it hit 600 Mhz at most,even with 64 SP's disabled,and only 5000 to 8000 cards available on the first run,with the actual performance lead with the reduced clocks and shaders will be about 12% faster than cypress overall,and that's with the card using 280 watts of power,versus the 188 watts than cypress uses,while the HD5970 remains untouchable basically....This is not good

I left out all your off topic posts about how great ATi is, and the second half of the thread's FUD, because I was becoming nauseous.

Like I said, you're here to pimp ATi and try to damage NVIDIA, no two ways about it. As such, I'm just going to keep pointing out your apparently viral activities.

[shadow001]

Originally Posted by Rollo

As you are to old to to bullsh*t with a straight face, did you wear a crazy grin as you posted the following bullsh*t, in half of one thread no less:



I left out all your off topic posts about how great ATi is, and the second half of the thread's FUD, because I was becoming nauseous.

Like I said, you're here to pimp ATi and try to damage NVIDIA, no two ways about it. As such, I'm just going to keep pointing out your apparently viral activities.

Please,all of those are valid questions which we have yet to get direct answers,and you know it all too well,but still keep on going posting FUD of your own like "Once Fermi is released there won't be many HD5*** sales from that point onwards" or "Fermi will be worth the wait"


Give it a break already.....I'm enjoying at least a few games in DX11 already with 3 monitors,and have been able to do so now for about 3 months,and even longer still for those who bought HD5870's way back in september,and there's no 2 way's about arguing that simple FACT no matter how you twist it.....Nvidia served the top performance crown on a silver platter to ATI by being this late to the game.

[Rollo]

Originally Posted by shadow001

Please,all of those are valid questions which we have yet to get direct answers,and you know it all too well,but still keep on going posting FUD of your own like "Once Fermi is released there won't be many HD5*** sales from that point onwards" or "Fermi will be worth the wait"


Give it a break already.....I'm enjoying at least a few games in DX11 already with 3 monitors,and have been able to do so now for about 3 months,and even longer still for those who bought HD5870's way back in september,and there's no 2 way's about arguing that simple FACT no matter how you twist it.....Nvidia served the top performance crown on a silver platter to ATI by being this late to the game.

LOL

Originally Posted by shadow001

He just doesn't get that unified standards always win out to make software using a particular feature a lot more popular,and was bragging that he's got 8 games using that feature

But of course your 2 DX11 games trump 8 PhysX games, right?

Did ATi give you the cards and monitors for your work here? Can you post receipts with your name/address blurred in the next few hours? If so, I'll leave the "viral" alone and just call you a garden variety troll.

But honestly, given the work you put into pimping ATi and posting FUD about NVIDIA, I'm kind of doubting it. LMK if you don't have the capability to post the receipts, I'll shoot you my email addy.

[Rollo]

Originally Posted by shadow001

FACT no matter how you twist it.....Nvidia served the top performance crown on a silver platter to ATI by being this late to the game.

I've never disputed that. Just like you can't dispute they lost discrete marketshare without any competition in the market yet- I guess more people want those features than you think, eh?

Consider how that must seem to ATi-

They had plenty of stock of their 5770 and 5750- the high volume cards- for 10/12 weeks of Q4 2009.....and they LOST marketshare.

They had the DX11 high end all to themselves for all of Q4 2009, good stock for probably half of it......and they LOST marketshare.

They had a VERY strong line of DX10.1 cards competing against dwindling stocks of NVIDIA DX10 cards for all of Q4 2009.....and they LOST marketshare.

The poor slobs at ATi must be thinking "Did a gypsy curse us?!? Is Rollo really the devil?! Is our fanboy Shadow001 not posting the right FUD?!? We couldn't get people to buy our cards with a $100 bill taped to the box!!!"

[shadow001]

Originally Posted by Rollo

LOL

There's no LOL about it,When ATI designed Cypress they also have to keep in mind that Nvidia is there to compete,so the company tries to get the best part it can on the market,but got a huge break when Nvidia simply didn't show up for the fight,and suffered all these delays as an extra bonus for ATI,anyone with half a brain can see that quite clearly....

But of course your 2 DX11 games trump 8 PhysX games, right?

Did ATi give you the cards and monitors for your work here? Can you post receipts with your name/address blurred in the next few hours? If so, I'll leave the "viral" alone and just call you a garden variety troll.

Actually it's more than 2 games as there's also aliens vs predator and battleforge along with Dirt 2 and battlefield bad company 2 of course,and this is with only one company having their DX11 cards out,and it took 2 years,since Nvidia bought Ageia in february 2008,for you to have 8 GPU physics titles...Something to think about when the amount of time is considered,but of course you'll also twist that in some way that benefits your argument somehow.


And no,unlike you,i pay for my hardware and don't have to lick Nvidia's ass all the time....Just so you know.

But honestly, given the work you put into pimping ATi and posting FUD about NVIDIA, I'm kind of doubting it. LMK if you don't have the capability to post the receipts, I'll shoot you my email addy.

I'm a very distant 2nd compared to you in the FUD area mate,and i ask the hard questions,which still haven't been answered and want straight no bull**** answers basically.

[shadow001]

Originally Posted by Rollo

I've never disputed that. Just like you can't dispute they lost discrete marketshare without any competition in the market yet- I guess more people want those features than you think, eh?

Consider how that must seem to ATi-

They had plenty of stock of their 5770 and 5750- the high volume cards- for 10/12 weeks of Q4 2009.....and they LOST marketshare.

They had the DX11 high end all to themselves for all of Q4 2009, good stock for probably half of it......and they LOST marketshare.

They had a VERY strong line of DX10.1 cards competing against dwindling stocks of NVIDIA DX10 cards for all of Q4 2009.....and they LOST marketshare.

The poor slobs at ATi must be thinking "Did a gypsy curse us?!? Is Rollo really the devil?! Is our fanboy Shadow001 not posting the right FUD?!? We couldn't get people to buy our cards with a $100 bill taped to the box!!!"

Well,considering that Nvidia only made 131 million net profit for the 4th quarter of 2009 according to the investors report,which is far below what they usually make by a very large amount usually(about 400 million on average),i don't think they're all smiles right now,but that's just me.

[Johnny C]

@ Rollo

Ok,

I'm going to start with your reply to my post about Physx, and I know we've had a talk about you actually reading what people post before you throw caution to the wind and criticize them, their hardware choices and/or sexual orientation.

My statement was to the effect that I would not wait for Fermi due to physx....not that physx wasn't good or that I didn't think much of it, you so kindly added that in. I simply made a point that physx does work with an ATi system, works well and offers people with an older nV card kicking around a use for it along with some eye candy. So in the future if you're going to reply to something I've posted at least do me the courtesy of actually reading what I've written.

Now, market share, you are completely right....AMD has lost market share to nV as of the latest steam survey(which we'll all agree is impartial and represents the actual market at large). What you missed posting up....is that nV's gain in market share was in the lowest of the low performance segments including laptop video and low end GT 2X0 series cards. The most gain being had by the GTS 150 (whatever rebranded 8000 series it happens to be)

AMD on the other hand had the most gains in the highest performance field with the 5700/5800 series.

http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurv...card/?sort=chg

So what this tells me is....more people who know nothing about computers and are buying the web browsing/banking and facebook machine choose nVidia...(and they probably don't choose it's just that the OEM that built it got a smoking deal on a card that can barely load windows and slapped it in there knowing no one would every check or care, and honestly at this level it doesn't matter what you have for graphics be it Intel, nV, AMD whatever.....it all sucks)

Which means that gamers, enthusiasts etc. (people who actually choose components or build computers themselves) have chosen AMD. AMD is the clear choice right now and will be until March 26/2010...after that things may change.

Now can we please get back on Topic which is about the graphics card performance not feature sets, proprietary APIs, or any other green vs red bull**** that doesn't involve benchmarks or tests by people in the know.

[Rollo]

Originally Posted by shadow001

And no,unlike you,i pay for my hardware and don't have to lick Nvidia's ass all the time....Just so you know.

.

I notice you didn't post the receipts. How hard is that? Log on to the Etailer, pull up your account and shoot a screenshot? Or snap a picture with your phone or camera if you went to B&M?

When I saw how very much trouble you went to in that one thread alone to pimp ATi and throw FUD at NVIDIA, and how you're sporting $1200 worth of ATi video cards plus three monitors, my spidey sense started tingling.

Not that I don't think people can afford that kind of stuff, I can myself, but most people don't. And then there's the matter of the hours and hours you spend on the NVIDIA fan site posting how great ATi cards are, and why Charlie says NVIDIA sux.

To me, that makes you a rare breed of troll. So how about taking 10 minutes and humoring us with some receipts? Tell you what- I've purchased $600-$700 worth of PC hardware in the last week or so myself- I'll post receipts if you will.

[Ninja Prime]

Originally Posted by Rollo

I notice you didn't post the receipts. How hard is that? Log on to the Etailer, pull up your account and shoot a screenshot? Or snap a picture with your phone or camera if you went to B&M?

When I saw how very much trouble you went to in that one thread alone to pimp ATi and throw FUD at NVIDIA, and how you're sporting $1200 worth of ATi video cards plus three monitors, my spidey sense started tingling.

Not that I don't think people can afford that kind of stuff, I can myself, but most people don't. And then there's the matter of the hours and hours you spend on the NVIDIA fan site posting how great ATi cards are, and why Charlie says NVIDIA sux.

To me, that makes you a rare breed of troll. So how about taking 10 minutes and humoring us with some receipts? Tell you what- I've purchased $600-$700 worth of PC hardware in the last week or so myself- I'll post receipts if you will.

My douchebag sense is tingling... Oh its rollo.

[shadow001]

Originally Posted by Rollo

I notice you didn't post the receipts. How hard is that? Log on to the Etailer, pull up your account and shoot a screenshot? Or snap a picture with your phone or camera if you went to B&M?

When I saw how very much trouble you went to in that one thread alone to pimp ATi and throw FUD at NVIDIA, and how you're sporting $1200 worth of ATi video cards plus three monitors, my spidey sense started tingling.

Not that I don't think people can afford that kind of stuff, I can myself, but most people don't. And then there's the matter of the hours and hours you spend on the NVIDIA fan site posting how great ATi cards are, and why Charlie says NVIDIA sux.

To me, that makes you a rare breed of troll. So how about taking 10 minutes and humoring us with some receipts? Tell you what- I've purchased $600-$700 worth of PC hardware in the last week or so myself- I'll post receipts if you will.

Rollo,i mean this in the nicest way possible....You're a dumbass,period.


How the hell was Nvidia desperate enough to accept you in their focus group is just mind boggling given all the arguments you've used so far in this thread,it really is.

[shadow001]

Just a quick FYI for anyone who's interested:


http://www.trustedreviews.com/graphi...r-Cent-Fall/p1


And i quote

Ending the 25th of January, nVidia's Q4 period saw a year-on-year drop in revenue from $1.2 billion (£831 million) to $481.1 million (£333 million), a huge 60 per cent decrease. Annual results didn't see quite such mammoth reductions, nVidia recording a 16 per cent year-on-year decrease, from $4.1 billion (£2.83 billion) to $3.4 billion (£2.35 billion).


These revenues equated to a $147 million (£102 million) Q4 and a $30 million (£21 million) annual net loss. Compared to some companies in the technology arena, nVidia looks to have escaped lightly, although that's no consolation to nVidia and its shareholders I'll warrant.


In Nvidia CEO, Jen-Hsun Huang's words: "November fell off a cliff," and CFO MArvin Burkett described December as having been even worse. The implication is that the graphics industry is being especially hard hit by the recession, which is especially bad for nVidia which only makes graphics products - unlike rivals Intel and AMD which have fingers in other pies.


Nvidia hopes to have those fortunes reversed its 9400M notebook platform and Ion desktop systems, once the latter is actually commercially available (should it ever be). So far the uptake of 9400M has been relegated to Apple's latest MacBook line-up, though many other manufacturers are supposed to have systems in the pipeline.


It's going to be interesting to see how nVidia copes in these difficult times.

Not so rosy afterall,but i guess you'll disrecredit these are rumors even when it's Nvidia's own CEO that said it quite clearly,and the fell of the cliff in november part is curiously not much after ATI launched their new cards on the market.....Just saying.