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Old 04-08-10, 11:02 PM   #433
Xion X2
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Default Re: Your opinion on the GTX 470 & 480

Can you guys quit trying to stir the pot? For chrissakes, can we just discuss the graphics card industry for once without the few of you trying to turn everything into an ATI/NV deathmatch?

Just once, maybe?
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Old 04-08-10, 11:05 PM   #434
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Default Re: Your opinion on the GTX 470 & 480

so what, everyone from the red team can stir the damn pot, but when you try to say something positive about fermi, suddenly is a bad thing.
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Old 04-08-10, 11:06 PM   #435
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Can you guys quit trying to stir the pot? For chrissakes, can we just discuss the graphics card industry for once without the few of you trying to turn everything into an ATI/NV deathmatch?

Just once, maybe?
Sure thing, once Nvidia gets the same treatment ATI seems to get by so many around here when it comes to questionable driver happenings.
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Old 04-08-10, 11:06 PM   #436
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so what, everyone from the red team can stir the damn pot, but when you try to say something positive about fermi, suddenly is a bad thing.
Who is this "red team" that you speak of, and provide examples, please?
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Old 04-08-10, 11:08 PM   #437
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Sure thing, once Nvidia gets the same treatment ATI seems to get by so many around here when it comes to questionable driver happenings.
I'd say it's the other way around. Several around here were claiming that ATI was cheating with the Crysis thing when the exact same (or similar) bug happened as in Metro with Nvidia. I think that's the only point that Ninja and myself were trying to make. What applies to one should apply to the other.

Then you guys get your shorts in a wad and think that somehow that's an attack on Nvidia? How? You need to drop the gloves and quit being so damn sensitive.

Personally, I feel they were both simple driver bugs and nothing else.
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Old 04-08-10, 11:15 PM   #438
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Who is this "red team" that you speak of, and provide examples, please?
Ninja Prime for starters?

And for the record incase you haven't been reading any of the posts I've made. I've said its too hot and too pricey. Noise is a non issue for me and the performance is ok for now. But either way, I'm waiting for a refresh. GF100 isn't an epic fail or a fail, its just an over priced too hot meh for me.
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Old 04-08-10, 11:16 PM   #439
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I'd say it's the other way around. Several around here were claiming that ATI was cheating with the Crysis thing when the exact same (or similar) bug happened as in Metro with Nvidia. I think that's the only point that Ninja and myself were trying to make. What applies to one should apply to the other.

Then you guys get your shorts in a wad and think that somehow that's an attack on Nvidia? How? You need to drop the gloves and quit being so damn sensitive.

Personally, I feel they were both simple driver bugs and nothing else.
And it isn't a driver bug, but an APP bug as it affects both ATI and Nvidia equally.
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Old 04-08-10, 11:23 PM   #440
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Ninja Prime for starters?

And for the record incase you haven't been reading any of the posts I've made. I've said its too hot and too pricey. Noise is a non issue for me and the performance is ok for now. But either way, I'm waiting for a refresh. GF100 isn't an epic fail or a fail, its just an over priced too hot meh for me.
I don't know much about Ninja, but I do know that he's said he's owned several Nvidia cards in the past and even owns one currently (a 280, I think?)

So how does he get labeled as the "red team?" Help me, because I'm not making the connection here? Or is it that anyone who doesn't tow the Rollo party line considered as such?

You guys misread Ninja's post in reference to the [H] article. He was simply turning the tables since many here accused ATI of cheating in the Crysis bench when the same thing happened to Nvidia with Metro.

The problem is that whenever someone makes a comment like this, a fair non-partisan comment, some of you are too quick on the trigger and immediately take it as an attack or personal insult. In effect, he was saying "wake up.. it happens to both companies."
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Old 04-08-10, 11:24 PM   #441
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Default Re: Your opinion on the GTX 470 & 480

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And it isn't a driver bug, but an APP bug as it affects both ATI and Nvidia equally.
It doesn't affect them equally as they clearly stated that there was no blurring on the ATI card on the very high quality setting like there was with Nvidia. Just when AA was enabled:

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The left hand side of that comparison is from a screenshot taken on a GeForce GTX 480, the right side on a Radeon HD 5870. You don’t have to look very close to see the difference.
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Old 04-08-10, 11:29 PM   #442
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I don't know much about Ninja, but I do know that he's said he's owned several Nvidia cards in the past and even owns one currently (a 280, I think?)

So how does he get labeled as the "red team?" Help me, because I'm not making the connection here? Or is it that anyone who doesn't tow the Rollo party line considered as such?

You guys misread Ninja's post in reference to the [H] article. He was simply turning the tables since many here accused ATI of cheating in the Crysis bench when the same thing happened to Nvidia with Metro.

The problem is that whenever someone makes a comment like this, a fair non-partisan comment, some of you are too quick on the trigger and immediately take it as an attack or personal insult. In effect, he was saying "wake up.. it happens to both companies."
For someone who has owned Nvidia in the past, he sure has been very negative the last 2 years around here. Antoher problem with the way he wrote his post is quite simply had he READ it, he'd have known it isn't something you would use to try and make your point as it happens to both companies cards, not just one. Also Toss clearly said it was his conclusion, not the sites. Personally, seeing as how this issues has popped up until the recent driver, I'd call it a bug aswell even without ATI saying anything unless the performance boost was outside of there claims for the driver. IE, they claim 10% and the game shows 20%.
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Old 04-08-10, 11:32 PM   #443
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It doesn't effect them equally as they clearly stated that there was no blurring on the ATI card on the very high quality setting like there was with Nvidia. Just when AA was enabled:
Ah no, they say that WIthout AA both look the same, With AAA(in game algorithim) only Nvidia has an issue, when 4xMSAA is used, both cards have the issue and it only affects the high quality setting for both cards as High settings and lower, the problem is not present on either card under any setting.

"The difference vanishes. So this issue is specific to the "Very High" Quality setting, which lead us initially to believe that AAA or some other shader or effect used with the "Very High" setting.


We reached out to NVIDIA about this issue, and they responded thusly:



Apparently this is an app bug. It is visible in AAA mode only on GTX480/470. And in MSAA mode on both GTX480/470 and Radeon 5000 series. 4A Games are working to address this bug. I would guess the ETA is about 2 weeks or so.



So there you have it. NVIDIA is aware of the issue, and they say it is an application problem, not a driver or hardware problem. They also said that it affected AMD video cards as well, if MSAA was enabled. So of course, we looked at that too.






The above screenshot was taken with both video cards using 4X MSAA on the "Very High" Quality setting. As you can see, there is no difference in image quality.


So NVIDIA’s answer seems to be accurate. The issue affects the "Very High" Quality setting only. If you are using Analytical AA, it only affects the GeForce GTX 480 and GeForce GTX 470. If you enable 4X MSAA, it also affects the Radeon HD 5000 series video cards."
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Old 04-08-10, 11:45 PM   #444
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hes been like that even months before fermi was released, all negative
I've been negative about NVs PR douche attitude and trying to cover up what is the truth. Just because I don't stroke a green peen doesn't mean I'm against NV completely.
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