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Old 07-25-03, 07:22 AM   #85
panzaman
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..what I can't believe is that in here there's still some people ready to fork out 300 400 for and nVidia Card.
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Old 07-25-03, 07:44 AM   #86
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Quote:
Originally posted by Deathlike2
The almost sounds like ATI and their Quack incident a year ago.

The difference is ATI admits it, tells us they will fix it, and fixes it... whereas NVidia admits it, tell us they'll look into the "bugs", and hasn't promised a fix for anything they've done..

Wow... can you believe that?
I could be wrong here, but I dont think ATI ever acknowledged the issue with Quake3.

They did with 3dmark however.
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Old 07-25-03, 08:06 AM   #87
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Quote:
Originally posted by StealthHawk
I thought [H] said, either in an article or in the forums, that they were aware they weren't performing an apples to apples comparison.
They did, then they went on to state that with the way the video card IHV's are going it was going to be impossible to do apples-to-apples comparisons anymore since they rendered things differently...

If you can't win playing by the rules, change the rules...
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Old 07-25-03, 08:30 AM   #88
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I believe ATI did.. someone could probably dig it up somewhere.. probably folks at Rage3D would know better...
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Old 07-25-03, 08:42 AM   #89
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Quote:
Originally posted by Deathlike2
I believe ATI did.. someone could probably dig it up somewhere.. probably folks at Rage3D would know better...
On Quake/Quack? I dunno, I really ain't sure. That was right around what I consider the tail end of the "nasty old" Ati period before they had their rebirth into this extremely uber-cool "new" ATi.

They called it a bug, hemmed & hawwed, and used the same "Well, it's so close you can barely tell a difference in image quality so it's ok.." kind of logic for a while that nVidia is doing right now with their cheats. (At least in the forums their fans did, ATi corporate didn't used to have CM in the forums and such and we damn near NEVER heard from them...kind of like the way nVidia is now...)

I won't defend ATi on Quake/Quack nor their dealing with it except to say that they apparently learned from it and changed their ways (for the better, IMHO) in dealing with such things and pretty much totally revamped their company from the ground up to make sure that kind of crap doesn't happen again.

At least nVidia gave a couple of fluff chats...
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Old 07-25-03, 09:19 AM   #90
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Quote:
Originally posted by ChrisRay
I could be wrong here, but I dont think ATI ever acknowledged the issue with Quake3.

They did with 3dmark however.
I seem to remember that they acknowledged it as a 'bug', and promised to fix it in the next driver release without affecting performance. And they did.
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Old 07-25-03, 09:24 AM   #91
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hanners
I seem to remember that they acknowledged it as a 'bug', and promised to fix it in the next driver release without affecting performance. And they did.
thats pretty much what happened... many sites carried a followup performance roundup of the 8500pre-and post Quak and the overall performance delta remained around the same with the gf3... with improved IQ... ie no issues like there were before...
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Old 07-25-03, 10:29 AM   #92
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Exactly Sazar.. with no questions asked...

You can only wish NVidia will do that...

The proof has to be there...
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Old 07-25-03, 02:16 PM   #93
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ruined
Looks like this will be even more of a non-issue once the next dets are released...
At this point, I'm not taking either Nvidia's or Kyle's word about the quality of a future Detonator set until someone from a site like B3D has a chance to play with them.

I still can't believe people are swallowing NV's bs about this whole thing. They promote their Quality AF as using Trilinear filtering, even using the filter-test app to highlight what it looks like, then swap it out for an inferior method, but ONLY on the most widely used game for current review benchmarks. How someone finds that less than repugnant is beyond me.

And Kyle's claim that the problem was solved before it began is flat out ludicrous. The problem exists because Nvidia's current publicly-released non-beta driver contains the hack. "Fixed before it began" would've been if the hack had been observed in an unofficial/beta driver and then fixed in the following public driver release. Until Nvidia puts an updated non-beta driver on their website that does proper Trilinear when told, and such behavior has been confirmed, the problem is most decidedly not "solved". There may be a solution pending, but that's far from the same thing.
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Old 07-25-03, 03:40 PM   #94
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Quote:
Originally posted by Nazgul
At this point, I'm not taking either Nvidia's or Kyle's word about the quality of a future Detonator set until someone from a site like B3D has a chance to play with them.

I still can't believe people are swallowing NV's bs about this whole thing. They promote their Quality AF as using Trilinear filtering, even using the filter-test app to highlight what it looks like, then swap it out for an inferior method, but ONLY on the most widely used game for current review benchmarks. How someone finds that less than repugnant is beyond me.

And Kyle's claim that the problem was solved before it began is flat out ludicrous. The problem exists because Nvidia's current publicly-released non-beta driver contains the hack. "Fixed before it began" would've been if the hack had been observed in an unofficial/beta driver and then fixed in the following public driver release. Until Nvidia puts an updated non-beta driver on their website that does proper Trilinear when told, and such behavior has been confirmed, the problem is most decidedly not "solved". There may be a solution pending, but that's far from the same thing.
Fanboi! Why don't you take your ATi-loving butt over to Rage3D and hang out with the rest of your nVidia-bashing buddies!





































j/k!

Sorry, I have to step out of character everyone now and then just to add a bit of surrealism to a few peoples day...
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Old 07-25-03, 03:57 PM   #95
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Somebody still needs to buy digiw an air conditioner.
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Old 07-25-03, 04:04 PM   #96
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Quote:
Originally posted by Skuzzy
Somebody still needs to buy digiw an air conditioner.
I just closed up the windows and turned the central air back on, me two day experiment in trying to cut down on me electricity bill is not only officially over but it will NOT be repeated!
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[SIZE=1][I]"It was very important to us that NVIDIA did not know exactly where to aim. As a result they seem to have over-engineered in some aspects creating a power-hungry monster which is going to be very expensive for them to manufacture. We have a beautifully balanced piece of hardware that beats them on pure performance, cost, scalability, future mobile relevance, etc. That's all because they didn't know what to aim at."
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