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Old 07-31-03, 11:14 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by Smashed
?

Either I'm really missing something or you have no idea what pun means.
Baaah! Can't a person have fun with words when they are happy...lol. It made sense to me at the time... I was punning in relation to something that was discussed some time ago.

Although I could see your point as well...lol, ahh.. oh well. I will choose more carefully next time so that everyone atleast has a chance to see my humor...

Yes, I am aware of the definitions of "Pun," thank you for your concern.

Peace,

hehe...
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Old 07-31-03, 11:18 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hellbinder
Also, You guys are completely ignoring the statement where the guy says Nvidia last Quarter was FLAT.
Maybe the meaning of "Flat" is unchanged... as in not increasing, nor decreasing?

I dunno... you waste the time on this.. I am done with it.

Peace,

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Old 08-01-03, 04:06 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hellbinder
Further the marketshare information from Q1 is not *Fanboy BS*. Ati gained 1%, and Nvidia Lost 2%.
Ok, you're going to have to give us a source for this. The only market share reports I've seen this year had NVIDIA gaining market share. I haven't heard of NVIDIA losing any market share yet.

edit: your information is false. http://www.globetechnology.com/servl...20030429/RATII

Quote:
Nvidia Corp. had the biggest share of the overall graphics accelerator market in the first quarter, beating Intel Corp. and ATI Technologies Inc., according to market research firm Mercury Research Inc.

For the sixth successive quarter, Nvidia claimed the top spot, increasing one percentage point to 31 per cent.

Intel maintained its second spot with 29 per cent while ATI grew one percentage point to 19 per cent.
According to that, NVIDIA grew in Q1.
 
Old 08-01-03, 05:35 AM   #28
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not only according to Nvidia but also according to Mercury Research.
I followed every report from them.
Since R300 was launched ATI did not gain even 1% of market share at Nvidia's expense.
All they gained since then was 1 to 2 % over that whole period at the expense of some smaller companies like SIS, VIA and so on.

That is pretty bad if you ask me. As i said. I Haven't seen any semiconductor company gaining so little with such a lead.
As you know there is no lead anymore.

Nvidia is at full acceleration at this time.
DX9 from top to bottom and new products will come very soon.
No R360 one man show in fall. NV36 around the corner.
And of course they will accept lower profits in order to prevent ATI gaining market share.
Well with 1 billion dollars in cash and years with huge profits they can afford that pretty long but won't need it.
It will take only a few quaters until they can increase their prices and margins again.

ATI had a big chance during the last quaters but unfortunatly they did not everything right to profit from it (Radeon9500 and Radeon9200 series)
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Old 08-01-03, 08:23 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally posted by Malfunction
Maybe the meaning of "Flat" is unchanged... as in not increasing, nor decreasing?
Yeah it means unchanged. Saying that the overall market share of Nv is unchanged, but there some variation in the different specific market shares
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Old 08-01-03, 09:12 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by Richthofen
That is pretty bad if you ask me. As i said. I Haven't seen any semiconductor company gaining so little with such a lead.
As you know there is no lead anymore.
Well I disagree. Look at ATIs finical records. They go from losing money to their first profitable qrt in a long time!
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Old 08-01-03, 11:08 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hellbinder
I dont think you understand what you are reading. that is DX9 hardware Shipped in Q2. not Dx9 hardware SOLD in Q2. Not to mention a lot of it shipped really LATE.

Further the marketshare information from Q1 is not *Fanboy BS*. Ati gained 1%, and Nvidia Lost 2%.

I would like to remind everyone that the same sources for this information were claiming that ATi had *shipped 1 million R300's* litterally months before it was an actual reality.
All this is really a mute point. I mean if I have learned anything in the last year it is that the big [N] knows how to BS. I am sure they hired all those Ex-Arthur Andersen accountants to cook there books. You really think you can believe earning statements? In the imortal words of [N]'s Haung... They must be smoking something hallucenigenic.
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Old 08-01-03, 11:14 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally posted by jbirney
Well I disagree. Look at ATIs finical records. They go from losing money to their first profitable qrt in a long time!
yeah but too late.
What was it 12 Mio profits?
In the 3rd 02 it was +8 or something like that.
4th 02 it was -35
1st 03 -1 or 2
2nd 12 Mio.
That are their numbers since the R300 launch.
Still long way until they get even some percentage points back of all that money they lost in the past.

The point is - haven't gained any substantial marketshare is always a bad thing if your are the smaller one.
Once your competitor is back on track and Nvidia definatly is, your future depends on the competitors pricing.
As it was already said. Nvidia is willing to give some profits away and they can afford that.

ATI can't. It does not need much to bring them back in red numbers.
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Old 08-01-03, 01:55 PM   #33
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Hmmm.....

I could have sworn that I read that Nvidia had lost 1-2% and Ati had gained 1%.

Oh well..

Still does not change the fact that % of products shipped does not = % of market.

This also just goes to show you that Nvidia can Lie, Cheat, steal, and probably kill people.. and for some reason the masses still think they are the best. Just like they have gotten away with stringing people along for nearly a year inticing them to *wait for the 9700pro killer*.. becuase its obviously going to be better etc etc. Yet even the 5900U is inferior in Dx9 performance and other features. Does it matter? no....

There was a lot of talk that Nvidia was having troubble signing any of the big OEMs over the last year, most of which went with ATI cards. Still.. I think the magority of OEM systems that use add in cards ship with Some flavor of MX card.

At any rate, ATi profits are up, they are gaining some ground, and they still have the bets overall DX9 hardware for sale. i think as more developers begin to endorse ATi the market share will continue to slowly eek towards a closer median.
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Old 08-01-03, 02:25 PM   #34
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Look at it this way Hellbinder. ATi will have to continue to make great products is all, Win/Win for everyone. Keeps Nvidia on their toes and keeps ATi from making mistakes. ATi doesn't have the capital to make a mistake and rise from it, although maybe they will if they keep producing better performing products instead of repackaging (trend's that suck).

To tell you the truth, I like the AMD/Intel scenario. Keeps innovation alive even in a poor market like we have had, didn't you notice that?

Peace,


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Old 08-01-03, 02:41 PM   #35
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Well, it took nearly 2 years for 3DFX to fully lose brand recognition.

But... Contrarly to nVidia, they didn't have parts which were near in performance to their competition. The V5 5500 got killed by the GF2 GTS.

So, first of all, I estimate that in a position where you are still nearly as good, at least to the customer's eyes, it would take more time to lose your brand recognition. At least 2 years and a half I guess. And when is that, exactly?
That's H1 2005. Eh.

And then there's the NV40, and I'd be very surprised if the NV40 wasn't at least nearly as good as the R420 again. My guess right now is, performance-wise, it'd be a mixed bag. And the NV40 would win hands down feature-wise. Of course, that doesn't even mean anything: because a mixed bag is never really balanced...

For nVidia to seriously get in trouble, they'd need to fail to deliver with the NV40. And to nullify the R3xx advantage, nVidia would have to deliver on time, with performance better than the R420, and it should be available at least 3 months before the R420.
And frankly, that last scenario is not very likely at all...


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Old 08-01-03, 03:12 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally posted by reever2
And this is a surprise how? Everybody know BS marketing(*coughdx95200cough*) works wonders
Advertisement without substance does not work. There are two major reasons nVidia's FX line is doing well:

1. Offering a DX9 part to the mainstream (<$100) market.

2. nVidia's history: a long history of stability, reliability, and good performance means quite a lot. ATI is currently trying to live down a history of the exact opposite nature.
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