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Old 10-22-03, 11:11 PM   #25
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Im really confused about the 60fps cap, I really can tell the diffrence between a game running at 60fps and 100, but if JC says its ok then i guess so heh.

But what he could be talking about is for collision detection (physics engine) and stuff like that, because it could insantly predict what frame an object should hit a wall or other object, not guess.

And on another note, it dose seem that all id based games use FPS for alot of things, im not sure why but they do example.

In Quake 2 Expert CTF McKinly Revial

Anyways, everyone can hook out of the sniper area in the middle, but its harder to get back in. but if you bind a key to use the hook and set max fps at 5 anyone with a bit of skill can fit though the small space witch is pritty much imossible with out the little secret.
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Old 10-22-03, 11:15 PM   #26
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I wish more games would (include the option to) cap the frame rate. The actual performance hit that comes with using vsync usually means that you won't always achieve that 60 FPS mark in certain situations.
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Old 10-22-03, 11:25 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by NickSpolec
I wish more games would (include the option to) cap the frame rate. The actual performance hit that comes with using vsync usually means that you won't always achieve that 60 FPS mark in certain situations.
all id games allow you to do it : D
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Old 10-23-03, 12:45 AM   #28
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but 60Hz is unbearable for static situations like a desktop, how can it be enough for a game with added motion of POV?

this game must be really slow.

I don't buy this BS about problems with different inputs at different frame rates. seems to me if you could write decent code you could solve the problem directly.

next we'll have ID games capping the number of speakers to 2 because people with better systems can hear things others can't.

and lets cap the number of bindable mouse buttons to 1 so mac users don't get let behind.
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Old 10-23-03, 12:48 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally posted by OWA
Yeah, that was what I was going to bring up. They don't have to be the same. Halo has the 30 fps cap that is supposed to make the game play smoother (more consistent) but you can still set your refresh rate to 85hz or whatever you want.
no not the fps cap, the game tic. they let you set your fps cap at the same as the game tic so that everything is in sync but even if you turn vsync off the game logic still runs at 30hz.


and rth, like i said this has nothing to do with refresh rate either, it is simply how many times a second the game logic updates.

Last edited by kyleb; 10-23-03 at 01:25 AM.
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Old 10-23-03, 02:09 AM   #30
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Let me repeat what Carmack said...
Quote:
The game tic simulation, including player movement, runs at 60hz, so if it rendered any faster, it would just be rendering identical frames
the games tic simulation "Including" player movelment. It is not only about the Movment and Physics engine.

This does have something to do with Refresh Rate. Being that regardless of the rate Set, for benchmarking purposes the game will only ever render 60 new frames per second.
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Old 10-23-03, 03:14 AM   #31
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Quote:
This does have something to do with Refresh Rate. Being that regardless of the rate Set, for benchmarking purposes the game will only ever render 60 new frames per second.
I think you need to emphasise that NEW bit some more. Without vsync for example, you could quite easily render 100 frames in a second, but there will only be 60 unique frames in that set, because the game data has only updated 60 times in that second.

Personally, I'm a little disapointed. I would've preferred it if the game tick was adjustable, to say 30hz, 60hz, 85hz, and 100hz. Otherwise you're gonna get a jerking problem on smooth moving objects.

For example, if the game tick is 60hz, and you're rendering at 100fps, on a 100hz monitor, with vsync on, then you're gonna get an old frame, every couple of frames, giving a jerky appearance. Theres no way on earth it will sync correctly. 60hz updates viewed through a 100hz window, is never gonna sync properly.

So if you want the absolute smoothest option you will have to set your monitor to 60hz.

It probably wont be noticable to most ppl, but it will still be there.

Caps are always bad for these types of reasons, but I understand it makes physics, and jump prediction alot easier to code. This is one of the reasons pro q3 players use insane frame-rates, because it makes them reach certain jumps you just cant do on sub-100fps situations.
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Old 10-23-03, 03:51 AM   #32
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I think all games should be capped at 29.977 fps just like DVDs. They run smooth at it!! Film runs at 24 fps, or 48fps for slow motion. I don't see why computers have to render more than 30. If everything in games were animated at 29.977 fps just like TV, and DVD, because half of 60hz would be 29.977 fps or 30 fps as we all like to think of it...the world would be a better place. The games wouldn't run slow because everything would be smooth as silk at 29.977 fps. Guess we'll have to wait for that one day too
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Old 10-23-03, 04:01 AM   #33
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http://www.100fps.com/how_many_frame...humans_see.htm
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Old 10-23-03, 04:49 AM   #34
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Why are people making such a big deal out of the 60fps caps? It's nothing new. Just because you can't go above 60fps doesn't mean it automaticly sucks.

Just take some random game where your fps is below 60fps.Lets say it runs at 45fps. This will still be smooth even though at all refreshrates it will have to show some frames twice or more ( I didn't say render ) when v-synch is enabled.

And benchies are still possible, some dumb timedemo/flythrough doesn't need a fps cap.
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Old 10-23-03, 04:53 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally posted by Toaster
And benchies are still possible, some dumb timedemo/flythrough doesn't need a fps cap.
But what would be the point? The whole idea of a Doom III benchmark is going to be to show performance of boards in Doom III - If the timedemo is doing things differently to the game then it's a waste of time.
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Old 10-23-03, 05:02 AM   #36
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hanners
But what would be the point? The whole idea of a Doom III benchmark is going to be to show performance of boards in Doom III - If the timedemo is doing things differently to the game then it's a waste of time.
A timedemo can just crap out as many fps as possible following some fixed cam-path? Like that flyby thing from ut2003, gamelogic becomes a non issue in that case. The CPU isn't really that important in this case, since it is either fast enough to push 60 ticks per second or it's to slow ( which will give you slowdown as in bullettime )
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