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Old 10-01-02, 12:46 PM   #25
kingsna
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let me explain what this die shrink means to ATI.

as you know manufacturing these 110m transistor chips costs ATI more than making the same chips using .13u process.

now that they've made the chips using .15u and have been able to get 325Mhz from it reliably, they can target the same speed with .13u process BUT get more chips per wafer and less cost of manufaturing per chip since they don't need to improve performance for 9700 pro.

now TSMC has many formulas for making the same chips:

one for maximizing performance but with less yields.

another one for maximum yields but with less performance of what can be achieved with using other methods.

and some other options.

so as you can see ATI can order the chips to be made using the Max yield formula instead of Max performance and save a bundle on overall costs of manufacturing,packaging, power, etc across the board and that's really smart if you ask me and if ATI can keep on doing things like this, nvidia can kiss they're crown forever since they're already behind in performance and everything they make will still be surpassed in 3-4 months of release.

so what i think nvidia should do is to quit fooling around with other projects such as XBOX and start focusing on PC's if they really want to be the king.

peace!
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Old 10-01-02, 01:28 PM   #26
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yes i have to say that ati are on a good wicket hehe (cricket term for in a good posi )they have their card out and can focus on the next one ,if they can do a card like the 9700 and have it out to market in such a short time emagine what their next card is going to be like when they can move to .13 micron and have ironed out the bugs ,oh dont think for one second that nvidia dont have a really good idea of how fast the nv30 will be ,and im sure this is going to be a great battle ,but with all that said it seems as to me nvidia still hold the cards
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Old 10-02-02, 12:04 AM   #27
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Originally posted by jbirney
Why would it be crazy? Its all about staying on the top. Thats what is important to them and good for business.
yeah, that's why nvidia released the GF3 Ti500 which couldn't beat the R8500 across the board in terms of performance eh?

to release another product after 3 months is nothing but ridiculous. that's assuming the rumors are correct in saying there will be a R9700, R9500, and R9500Pro released soon too.

we'll see if nvidia ever releases another Ti4400-esqe product again. from what i've heard, it didn't sell too well. i see no reason why ATI would want to do something like that.

R9700ProPro, R9700Pro, R9700, R9500Pro would all be $200+ high end gaming cards. in other words, too many close performing cards with close price range.
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Old 10-02-02, 01:21 AM   #28
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well for once im really in two minds on how i THINK the nv30 will perform ,one personality says that it will have great features not much of a performance gain over the 9700 if any ,and my other side said that it will really kick butt being %20to%30 faster ,but one thing im thinking is that we will get a vanilla nv30 first up to get them out to market followed by an ultra version later ,like what happend with the gf3,eg. gf3, gf3 500ti and gf3 ti 200 later on ,this i think will be the pattern for the nv30 not like what we saw with the gf4 line ,thats my 1 1/2 cents worth
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Old 10-02-02, 01:24 AM   #29
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nvidia has yet to disappoint i don't think they will start now, if it helps it seems as if the nforce2 sure will not either. they usually succeed. nv30 will be fast, and it sure will be powerful.
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Old 10-02-02, 08:28 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by thcdru2k
nvidia has yet to disappoint i don't think they will start now
I think most would agree that the GF3 Ti and GF4 (8X) launches were less than exciting. In fact, many many NVIDIA fans were quite dissapointed that the GF3 Ti offered no core improvements, features, or anything else. Likewise for the GF4 (8X).
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Old 10-02-02, 10:31 AM   #31
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comeon you cant argue about the geforce 3 and 4 line of cards ,what did you expect ?geforce 3 laid the groundwork for dx8 and the geforce 4 gave for the first time playable aa at high res ,its like when i here people saying the the radeaon 9700 is not impresive ,dont expect a miracle cause its not comin
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Old 10-02-02, 05:47 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally posted by borntosoul
comeon you cant argue about the geforce 3 and 4 line of cards ,what did you expect ?geforce 3 laid the groundwork for dx8 and the geforce 4 gave for the first time playable aa at high res ,its like when i here people saying the the radeaon 9700 is not impresive ,dont expect a miracle cause its not comin
he was obviously talking about the GF3Ti line as a "refresh" of the GF3 and the GF4 with 8x AGP as a refresh of the GF4, and NOT the original cards themselves
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Old 10-03-02, 03:29 AM   #33
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yeh oups sorry didnt see that one too many late nights me thinks
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Old 10-03-02, 07:52 AM   #34
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Actually the GF4 were nothing to get excited about. Just a bit faster and finaly they could support DX8.1. Thats about it. No new features to talk about.
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Old 10-03-02, 08:25 AM   #35
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The GF4 isn't a fully DX8.1 card either.
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Old 10-03-02, 08:28 AM   #36
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The .1 of 8.1 is an ATi extension
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