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Old 03-20-04, 04:24 PM   #1
carpy
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Angry Alternative approach to Linux Driver?

Is there a better combination that NVidia could do with it's driver and still provide some "proprietary" crap?

For instance, could NVidia place all the proprietary "protected" stuff in a library which could span kernels while submitting open source kernel module which might possibly be incorporated into the kernel tree? This at least would save me having to boot to a CLI everytime I shutdown after a kernel upgrade. I shut down the machine so infrequently and the kernel gets updated far less frequently but is done so automagically by SuSE YOU. It's a shock to boot up and suddenly have no GUI. This is the third or fourth time this has happened (been running NVidia for some time now).
While I agree with everyone else in that the driver should be released OSS, perhaps this is a workable compromise which would at least help keep our systems running. I shut down last night during a T-storm, bring up the machine this morning for some tunes, and spent the next 4+ hours trying to make the NVidia driver work (stupidly did an upgrade from 4096 to 5336).
More on that in another thread.

Thanks,
Matt
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Old 03-20-04, 05:01 PM   #2
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Before you blame nvidia get your facts straight first, everytime you upgrade a kernel or install one you have to reinstall the nvidia driver.

It's just a simple case of runing the nvidia installer and then setting up the display, using sax2 or sax2 -m 0=nvidia , it's in the SuSE readme.
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Old 03-21-04, 06:50 PM   #3
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Default duh?

No offense, but duh? My question was whether it was possible for nV to decouple the proprietary code from the kernel module and still have the desired result. The end result should be something where reinstalling the stupid driver would not be so necessary. Personally, if hardware manufacturers would stop sticking so much of their code in the driver which runs much slower than hardware, they wouldn't care if their driver was opensourced!
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Old 03-21-04, 08:07 PM   #4
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Even if they could, they're not going to. So shut the the hell up and be glad that you at least are getting some form of Linux support for your hardware and that NVIDIA has the decency to provide updates every once in a while.
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Old 03-21-04, 09:26 PM   #5
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Don't mind SuLinUX,

Just be thankful that he didn't go on and on about the "other" forum he moderates.
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Old 03-21-04, 10:35 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saturnotaku
Even if they could, they're not going to. So shut the the hell up and be glad that you at least are getting some form of Linux support for your hardware and that NVIDIA has the decency to provide updates every once in a while.
Would you mind explaining just why I should shut the hell up? I am not causing problems here. I'm not really even complaining much. Believe me, you would know it if I were complaining. Why would you get hostile just because I asked the possibilities of another approach to the solution? I'm not bashing or praising nV for their driver. I'm quite happy with it... once I have it working. I'll admit I have experienced some issues getting it to work as expected. The proper way to deal with that as a customer is to unemotionally suggest improvements. That's not even part of this one. This is a question, a suggestion, for improvement. I'm not saying "If you don't do this I'm taking back my nV and getting <VENDOR> because their driver is OSS!" This is a question, the answer to which you obviously have no idea.

Can I get anyone *else's* opinion? Could to proprietary code be sectioned off in a library so that the kernel module could be fully OSS? This would allow the kernel code to be current, even generic, and let the library live on its own. The real question is, would the library still benefit from the same kernel-level priority so as to provide the same high-performance? Would this make sense? Anyone that has a smidgeon of understanding?
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Old 03-21-04, 10:59 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carpy
... Could to proprietary code be sectioned off in a library so that the kernel module could be fully OSS... Would this make sense? Anyone that has a smidgeon of understanding?
Hello Carpy,

I believe that they actually do it that way already. As I understand it, there's two parts to the driver. There's the proprietrary part, which is I believe all binary, and the other "glue code" (as someone else in these forums put it) that can be used for different hardware and software architectures.

Since the kernel is gnu, I don't believe licensing would allow any "binary" or proprietary portions to be added. That is how I understand it anyways.

At the moment it is required for the administrator (or root) to reinstall the driver after a kernel is recompiled, however this probably could be handled no problem with a script file of some sort. Just tag it at the end of your "make" stuff in the kernel. I'm assuming the reason that this is not already done is because too many people who use linux wouldn't use it.

Also, maybe perhaps a kernel option to link to the particular driver you want to install with the kernel? But, you'd have to take that up with the Linux kernel people.

Hope this helps for now.

Regards,

Tamran
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Old 03-22-04, 05:47 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tamran
Don't mind SuLinUX,

Just be thankful that he didn't go on and on about the "other" forum he moderates.
Oh shut up and your welcome to go look.

carpy

No one forces you to update the kernel, in fact it's not like your in the MS world were you have to, we make our own choices. The fact is you dont need to update the kernel if you dont want to and alot of people just go ahead for the sake of it.
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Old 03-22-04, 08:13 AM   #9
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Guys, just a suttle reminder to keep it civil thanks
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Old 03-22-04, 01:15 PM   #10
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Default Re: Alternative approach to Linux Driver?

The Nvidia driver consits of 3 parts: the kernel driver; the glx driver and the kernel interface.
The first 2 are binary and the kernel interface is source code that needs to be compilled against your particular kernel.
re installing the nvidia kernel driver takes all of 30 seconds.
Code:
cd NVIDIA-Linux-x86-1.0-5336-pkg1  
make install
Nope it takes less than 30 seconds.
Sorry, IMHO it is a non issue.
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Old 03-22-04, 01:58 PM   #11
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Default Re: Alternative approach to Linux Driver?

I believe you are missing the point of this thread.

The issue is not whether it takes 30 seconds or 30 minutes to install the new driver.
The issue is that nvidia could release a open source driver that could be incorporated into existing open source projects.
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Old 03-22-04, 02:09 PM   #12
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Default Re: Alternative approach to Linux Driver?

Quote:
Originally Posted by forester
I believe you are missing the point of this thread.

The issue is not whether it takes 30 seconds or 30 minutes to install the new driver.
The issue is that nvidia could release a open source driver that could be incorporated into existing open source projects.
This Issue of opensourcing nvidia driver or parts of them have allready been disscussed extensively in this forum.
I repeat it is a non issue nvidia is not up for it.
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