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Old 03-28-04, 10:57 PM   #13
jAkUp
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Default Re: Far Cry shows how pitiful GeForceFX is in DX9 games

Jeez.. its amazing how much people actually think Far Cry uses alot of CPU power, on my system OC'd and non OC'd, I get nearly THE SAME fps at 1280x1024. Far Cry is a Video dependent game. Just look at it!!! Shaders, DX9, Insane textures, amazing draw distances. What in the hell would lead anyone to believe its CPU dependant??!?!?!?

Physics and AI? Meh, a 2.4 is more than enough to handle that.
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Old 03-28-04, 11:21 PM   #14
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Default Re: Far Cry shows how pitiful GeForceFX is in DX9 games

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drumphil
(better?)
Is there an echo? Did I stutter? Yes, better. In very rare cases on some racing games. You can see here where I've run into a similar occurance with Indy Racing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Drumphil
When you set AA modes you are usually given some indication of the max resolution for that AA mode on a given card.. (does with the ATI control panel anyway).. If you go over that res AA is disabled because the card doesn't have sufficient vram to hold that many pixels. This can happen with any card and is ram size limitation. Unlike texture storage, the frame buffer can't be augmented by AGP accessible system ram, so go over the limit and the AA is turned off, rather than just getting slower, like with textures being accessed from the main system ram.
Thanks for clarification, yeah it's been a long time since I've ever seen that though...been a while since I've had a card with anemic VRAM.
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Sorry my quote usage doesn't meet your high standards for posting..
No worries, didn't mean to hurt your feelings or anything.
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I personally believe that us americans are unable to do so because osama.

People out there in our nation don't have that, And I believe that our education like such as south africa and such as the Iraq.

everywhere "such as". And I believe our education should help the US should help the south africa and the iraq and the asian countries so we can build up our future.
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Old 03-28-04, 11:25 PM   #15
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Default Re: Far Cry shows how pitiful GeForceFX is in DX9 games

Quote:
Originally Posted by jAkUp
Jeez.. its amazing how much people actually think Far Cry uses alot of CPU power, on my system OC'd and non OC'd, I get nearly THE SAME fps at 1280x1024. Far Cry is a Video dependent game. Just look at it!!! Shaders, DX9, Insane textures, amazing draw distances. What in the hell would lead anyone to believe its CPU dependant??!?!?!?

Physics and AI? Meh, a 2.4 is more than enough to handle that.
I think what people are saying jAkUp is that these cards scale with the processor/system. The slower bus speeds can hold back a card like the 5900. So it's not that the game is CPU-dependent. Make sense?
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I personally believe that us americans are unable to do so because osama.

People out there in our nation don't have that, And I believe that our education like such as south africa and such as the Iraq.

everywhere "such as". And I believe our education should help the US should help the south africa and the iraq and the asian countries so we can build up our future.
-- Miss Teen South Carolina

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Old 03-28-04, 11:38 PM   #16
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Default Re: Far Cry shows how pitiful GeForceFX is in DX9 games

Quote:
Originally Posted by jAkUp
Jeez.. its amazing how much people actually think Far Cry uses alot of CPU power, on my system OC'd and non OC'd, I get nearly THE SAME fps at 1280x1024. Far Cry is a Video dependent game. Just look at it!!! Shaders, DX9, Insane textures, amazing draw distances. What in the hell would lead anyone to believe its CPU dependant??!?!?!?

Physics and AI? Meh, a 2.4 is more than enough to handle that.

We're talking about the card not being able to feed data to the CPU and Vice versa,


Bandwith would make a huge issue on this.




Theres also the fact that the 5900 Non Ultra isnt really comparable to a 9800 Pro or 9800XT,


Its below both in terms of where it was marketed at originally. The 5900 doesnt even hit 3000 Multi texturing


I dont doubt the game ran better on the ATI hardware,I really dont, But I havent notice absymal frame rates in the game either.
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Old 03-28-04, 11:41 PM   #17
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Default Re: Far Cry shows how pitiful GeForceFX is in DX9 games

well i dont get that great of fps in farcry and i have a 9800 np i get a little bellow 30fps in 1280x1024 and at 1024x 768 i get well above 30fps. but i have a 2100+ amd, so thats probably the problem?
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Old 03-29-04, 12:36 AM   #18
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Default Re: Far Cry shows how pitiful GeForceFX is in DX9 games

Easy way to test if the cpu / FSB is the problem and that is to run at 1024x768, 800x600 and 640x480 .. of the fps shoots up then it will be the graphics card and not AI / sound / other threads causing the problem.

My guess would be 80:20 video card related.

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Old 03-29-04, 01:50 AM   #19
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Default Re: Far Cry shows how pitiful GeForceFX is in DX9 games

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxPower
Is there an echo? Did I stutter? Yes, better. In very rare cases on some racing games. You can see here where I've run into a similar occurance with Indy Racing.Thanks for clarification, yeah it's been a long time since I've ever seen that though...been a while since I've had a card with anemic VRAM.No worries, didn't mean to hurt your feelings or anything.

I don't know if you stutter or not.. You'll have to tell me that.. As for anemic vram.. How much vram do you have now.. If its 128mb then you will be limited to 1280x1024 with 4xAA turned on.. So 1600x1200 would be AA free and faster in this situation.. And what do my feelings have to do with it.. I perfer having an actual understanding of the issues, rather than competing to be the biggest smart arse with my posts .. Anyways, you got a good sense of humor, so I'm sure you wont be offended.

Quote:
"I think what people are saying jAkUp is that these cards scale with the processor/system. The slower bus speeds can hold back a card like the 5900. So it's not that the game is CPU-dependent. Make sense?"
no, this doesn't make sense.. The slower system bus doesn't hold back the GPU at all, it does however limit the CPU performance. The GPU connects with the rest of the computer using AGP, which is not the bottleneck in GPU performance.. (remember, the AGP port connects to the system ram in the northbridge chip, so memory access for AGP is independent of the cpu, so increasing ram speed helps, but FSB alone doesn't)

Apart from texturing over agp where the memory speed can make a difference, the FSB has no direct effect on the GPU (and then only because most people increase their ram speed when the increase their FSB).. any difference in performance is due to how CPU performance is effected by FSB speed.. I can clarify that a bit (or a lot) more if its needed, but i couldn't be bothered typing more if you get that anyway.
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Old 03-29-04, 02:40 AM   #20
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Default Re: Far Cry shows how pitiful GeForceFX is in DX9 games

http://www.accelenation.com/?ac.id.218.1

Accelenation has a 5950Ultra and p4 and p4e. What tuan did was clock the CPUs from 2.4GHz to 3.2Ghz on various synthetics and games.
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Old 03-29-04, 02:46 AM   #21
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Default Re: Far Cry shows how pitiful GeForceFX is in DX9 games

Quote:
Originally Posted by MUYA
http://www.accelenation.com/?ac.id.218.1

Accelenation has a 5950Ultra and p4 and p4e. What tuan did was clock the CPUs from 2.4GHz to 3.2Ghz on various synthetics and games.
This also shows that the priginal poster should not get a prescott ! Really shows the bad effects of the 30+ pipeline.

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Old 03-29-04, 05:37 AM   #22
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Default Re: Far Cry shows how pitiful GeForceFX is in DX9 games

Quote:
Originally Posted by Drumphil
I don't know if you stutter or not.. You'll have to tell me that.. As for anemic vram.. How much vram do you have now.. If its 128mb then you will be limited to 1280x1024 with 4xAA turned on.. So 1600x1200 would be AA free and faster in this situation.. And what do my feelings have to do with it.. I perfer having an actual understanding of the issues, rather than competing to be the biggest smart arse with my posts .. Anyways, you got a good sense of humor, so I'm sure you wont be offended.



no, this doesn't make sense.. The slower system bus doesn't hold back the GPU at all, it does however limit the CPU performance. The GPU connects with the rest of the computer using AGP, which is not the bottleneck in GPU performance.. (remember, the AGP port connects to the system ram in the northbridge chip, so memory access for AGP is independent of the cpu, so increasing ram speed helps, but FSB alone doesn't)

Apart from texturing over agp where the memory speed can make a difference, the FSB has no direct effect on the GPU (and then only because most people increase their ram speed when the increase their FSB).. any difference in performance is due to how CPU performance is effected by FSB speed.. I can clarify that a bit (or a lot) more if its needed, but i couldn't be bothered typing more if you get that anyway.

Ummm Front Side Bus, Honestly doesnt change much cept the ram speed these Days, Specially on Nforce 2 based boards ect, FSB is an interesting term, Because all its really changing is the Northbridges performance and the way the CPU relates to the Memory, I can still remember when raising it changes the AGP/PCI devices as well... gosh them were the days... Damn I think Vias New Boards for a64 arch dont do that right?

Increasing FSB also Increases Memory, And the guy would recieve a 100 mhz Memory Speed adjustment with a P4C Rather than a P4a @ 100 mhz FSB, So theres qutet a bit of bandwith improvement.

So ya it would make a difference ;p


That being said, No FSB system is going to run its memory Async, It just doesnt make sense as theres no performance gain and the Higher Latencies just slow it down anyway,

Theoretically you could run your memory at a higher frequency than your FSb async as well... But any benefit to Memory bandwith would be lost due to latency issues anyway.


Btw you can even take the most GPU intensive app there is and see Performance increases in Game test 2, 3 and 4 of 3dmark2003 by raising FSB alone :I



Actually that gives me an idea, I should try Running my System Async in the 3dmark2003 tests results, See how it correlates to FSB and see how much an improvement ran.

For instance.

Run it @ 133/166

and 166/166

and 166/133

and 133/133

Just to see How 3dmark2003 graphical tests react to the different Memory and bandwith of the system, So it could theoretically be tested, Even on Far Cry
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Last edited by ChrisRay; 03-29-04 at 05:48 AM.
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Old 03-29-04, 06:09 AM   #23
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Default Re: Far Cry shows how pitiful GeForceFX is in DX9 games

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Ummm Front Side Bus, Honestly doesnt change much cept the ram speed these Days, Specially on Nforce 2 based boards ect, FSB is an interesting term, Because all its really changing is the Northbridges performance and the way the CPU relates to the Memory, I can still remember when raising it changes the AGP/PCI devices as well... gosh them were the days... Damn I think Vias New Boards for a64 arch dont do that right?

Increasing FSB also Increases Memory, And the guy would recieve a 100 mhz Memory Speed adjustment with a P4C Rather than a P4a @ 100 mhz FSB, So theres qutet a bit of bandwith improvement.

So ya it would make a difference ;p
er, last time I checked the nforce was the ONLY chipset that had a functional AGP/PCI lock, so for most people the FSB speed does effect the RAM speed.. (and agp and pci). You can decide wether or not to lock the AGP/PCI on the nforce boards I think..

And please stop using double negatives.. Im still not exactly sure what you are trying to say.

anyways, your test will test how FSB effects benchmark performance, not GPU performance. And increasing FSB will increase the IPC for the CPU, but the IPC rate for the GPU will remain the same, because the GPU has its own ram.
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Old 03-29-04, 08:09 AM   #24
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Talking Re: Far Cry shows how pitiful GeForceFX is in DX9 games

Hush Drummy or I shall frag you in Tribes! :P

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