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Old 05-16-04, 09:38 PM   #145
hovz
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Default Re: I Played FarCry with Pixel Shader 3.0

no, its clearly obvious ati is cheating. i have no respect for ati or nvidia. they have made it impossible to judge a card on the hardware. now its just who can hide there cheats better. then when they get caught they claim its a bug. ud figure the ati and nvidia fan boys would smarten up after the 5th or 6th time these companies get caught cheating. that being said there is still only ati or nvidia, so u rly have no choice if you want a good performing 3d card. i still think the r420 is a good margin faster than nv40 where it counts, the exception being doom 3, not many other big games will be in open gl. r420 is a decent gap ahead of nv40 in pixel shading. thsi will only increase as ati improves its drivers(it will on nv40 too but sooner or later the register limitations will take a toll). you can see that both the pro and xt have abnormally low fillrates in the syntehtic benchmarks, they will definitly improve. and i think far cry is a perfect example of how things will play out int he future. nvidia will up their speed, but so will ati and in the end the pro will match or beat the nv40 in most dirext x 9 games with aa and af.
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Old 05-16-04, 09:40 PM   #146
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Default Re: I Played FarCry with Pixel Shader 3.0

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Originally Posted by Ruined
hovz perhaps you should check out the news that ATI is cheating with their ansiotropic filtering methods by using brilinear all the time and hiding it from the user by disabling it only when colored mipmaps are requested (deliberately hiding AF optimizations from the user)... look at top threads in r3d and b3d. I'd be skeptical with ATI's performance numbers at this point in time.
It will be fun to dig up all of the old comments of people defending nvidia on their filtering tricks, who now are cursing ati for filtering tricks
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Old 05-16-04, 09:43 PM   #147
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Default Re: I Played FarCry with Pixel Shader 3.0

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Originally Posted by reever2
It will be fun to dig up all of the old comments of people defending nvidia on their filtering tricks, who now are cursing ati for filtering tricks
Heh, the difference is Nvidia did not deliberately trick the user with brilinear, you could see it in mipmaps. ATi deliberately disables the optimization when mip map colors are turned on, deceiving the user by making him thinking he is getting trilinear AF when he's not.
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Old 05-16-04, 09:48 PM   #148
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Default Re: I Played FarCry with Pixel Shader 3.0

hey guys .. stay on topic.. this thread is about Farcry and SM3.0.
there are other threads for that.. ~thanks..

BTw.. SM3.0 can increase performance in FArcry in many diferent ways .. Crytek developers already told that .. with a nice summary..

Quote:
Andrey Khonich – Crytek, Makers of Far Cry

GD: A lot of attention has been paid to NVIDIA's support of Pixel Shader 3.0 - can you specifically think of anything PS 3.0 can be used for that can't be done in PS 2.0?

Andrey: In VS3.0 Shader model actually is possible to support general displacement mapping (with smart Shader design when vertex Shader has to do something during waiting for texture access).

In PS3.0 shaders it’s possible to decrease number of shaders using dynamic branching (one Shader for general lighting) and in such way decrease number of Shader switches and as result increase speed, and also we can utilize dynamic conditional early reject for some cases in both PS and VS and this also will increase speed. As to NV40 generally possible to use co-issues better to take advantage of super-scalar architecture (we can execute 4 instructions per cycle in a single pipeline).

-Handle several light sources in single pixel shaders by using dynamic loops in PS3.0.
- Decrease number of passes for 2-sided lighting using additional face register in PS3.0.
- Use geometry instancing to decrease number of draw-calls (remove CPU limitations as much as possible).
- Unrestricted dependent texture read capabilities to produce more advanced post-processing effects and other in-game complex particles/surfaces effects (like water).
- Full swizzle support in PS3.0 to make better instructions co-issue and as result speedup performance.
- Increase quality of lighting calculations using 32 bit precision in pixel shaders on NV40.
- Take advantage of using 10 texture interpolators in PS3.0 Shader model to reduce number of passes in some cases.
- Easily do multiple pass high-dynamic-range rendering on FP16 targets.
- Speed up post-processing a lot by using MRT capabilities and mip-mapping support on non-power-of-two textures.
i bolded only performance benefits mentioned with SM3.0 according to CRytek. so SM3.0(PS3.0+VS3.0) well implemented can show significant increases in performance. but also better effects. it will be nice if Nvidia release HIgher quality videos ,specially the one in the pirate ship ,that way people will be able to see VS3.0 in action in the greatest looking realitime displaced water ,with foam and splashes.

Last edited by Nv40; 05-16-04 at 10:08 PM.
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Old 05-16-04, 09:51 PM   #149
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Default Re: I Played FarCry with Pixel Shader 3.0

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Originally Posted by Nv40
hey guys .. stay on topic.. this thread is about Farcry and SM3.0.
there are other threads for that.. ~thanks..

BTw.. SM3.0 can increase performance in FArcry in many diferent ways .. Crytek developers already told that .. with a nice summary..
It will be interesting to see the performance of the expansion on both the 6800 and x800... If the x800 can display similar visual effects in sm2.0, how much of a hit it takes, and how the 6800 does in comparison in sm3.0.
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Old 05-16-04, 09:58 PM   #150
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Default Re: I Played FarCry with Pixel Shader 3.0

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It will be fun to dig up all of the old comments of people defending nvidia on their filtering tricks, who now are cursing ati for filtering tricks
isnt it the other way around ..... its going to be fun reading all the people that bashed (and man that's alot) nvidia now defending ati..... even db from b3d is looking to defend ati .....
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Old 05-16-04, 10:12 PM   #151
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Default Re: I Played FarCry with Pixel Shader 3.0

I'm personally an equal opportunity curser, and am EAGERLY awaiting an answer as to WTF is going on.
Especially since the same behavior was seen in OLD driver sets.

We'll soon see won't we.......

Sorry for the OT
Now back to our scheduled programming....
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Old 05-16-04, 10:17 PM   #152
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Default Re: I Played FarCry with Pixel Shader 3.0

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Originally Posted by reever2
It will be fun to dig up all of the old comments of people defending nvidia on their filtering tricks, who now are cursing ati for filtering tricks
Reever2 I can't believe you of all people should say this. You have been one of NVIDIA's biggest critics, never missing a chance to point a negative issue about them. Look at your own posts before you dig up others. The facts are not all in so wait before you take this opportunity to argue with my forum members. You wont get a PM either. You've got a chip on your shoulder that's really getting on my nerves. You need to go to a site that you enjoy instead of complaining here all the time.
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Old 05-16-04, 10:21 PM   #153
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Default Re: I Played FarCry with Pixel Shader 3.0

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Originally Posted by MikeC
Reever2 I can't believe you of all people should say this. You have been one of NVIDIA's biggest critics never missed a chance to point a negative issue about them. Look at your own posts before you dig up others. The facts are not all in so wait before you take this opportunity to argue with my forum members. You wont get a PM either. You've got a chip on your shoulder that's really getting on my nerves. You need to go to a site that you enjoy instead of complaining here all the time.
Hey i'm not saying i'm going to post anything, but just fun to see how this whole process works when one company does one thing, some people say something, then the other cmpany does it, different people come in say the same thing, ones who did it last time say the opposite
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Old 05-16-04, 10:27 PM   #154
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Default Re: I Played FarCry with Pixel Shader 3.0

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Originally Posted by reever2
Hey i'm not saying i'm going to post anything, but just fun to see how this whole process works when one company does one thing, some people say something, then the other cmpany does it, different people come in say the same thing, ones who did it last time say the opposite
I still say you should go to a site you enjoy instead of complaining here ALL the time. Don't try and exclude yourself from "some people" either.
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Old 05-16-04, 11:07 PM   #155
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Default Re: I Played FarCry with Pixel Shader 3.0

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Hey i'm not saying i'm going to post anything
Great! Sounds like a plan. Seriously though man, you sound like guys who call into a sports talk radio shows and complain or criticize. The radio hosts will will always tell the guys (who are just wasting their time) to just tune into another station...that there are plenty of other radio stations for them to listen to.
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Old 05-16-04, 11:51 PM   #156
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Default Re: I Played FarCry with Pixel Shader 3.0

AMEN! bout time sumbody put the boots on to be rid of the pessimistic fanboyism dribble! Them boots look good on yah Mike
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