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Old 08-12-04, 07:54 AM   #85
D.K.Tronics
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Default Re: Disappointments in doom 3

Quote:
Perfect compared to what? Compared to what it was meant to be, or compared to something that it was never going to be? I consider it pretty damn near a perfect version of this sort of game.
I wasn't comparing it to anything. This isn't about comparisons, it's about people on this board that are trying to make out this game is almost perfect. And, like I said, it isn't.

Let me ask you people this,
Why couldn't there have been a checkbox that allows the player to decide if he/she wants to carry a torch AND gun ?
Then surely, *I* get to decide how *I* want to play Doom 3, NOT Carmack, or you lot.
I'm getting a little sick and tired of games designers who
1. Think they are Steven flippin Spielberg
2. Think they can tell the player how He/She should be playing the game.
3. Write fantastic looking engines, but forget about actually writing a game to compliment it.

Thing is, I don't even find complete darkness even remotely scary. I'm not afraid of the dark, so why is it such a used cliche, where it's used as a cheap gimmick to scare people ?
Would you go and watch a horror movie, that was completely filmed in pitch black darkness, and all you could do was listen to sound effects ?
Would you find it scary ?
I would be more frustrated, and p*ssed off, than feeling tension, and fear.

I'm not saying you are all wrong, far from it. But for a game thats taken years to develop, I would of expected a lot more thought put in to it.
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Old 08-12-04, 07:58 AM   #86
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Default Re: Disappointments in doom 3

Perhaps on the easiest setting you have flashlights on your weapons, on the harder settings you have the flashlights only on the shotgun and assault rifle, then on the hardest setting you have the light in your hand and not on your weapons. That would have been quite sensible.
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Old 08-12-04, 08:09 AM   #87
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Default Re: Disappointments in doom 3

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Originally Posted by vampireuk
Perhaps on the easiest setting you have flashlights on your weapons, on the harder settings you have the flashlights only on the shotgun and assault rifle, then on the hardest setting you have the light in your hand and not on your weapons. That would have been quite sensible.
Now that you mention it, that might actually be a pretty decent way of handling it. It wouldn't exactly be a bad compromise.

As long as it doesn't count Nightmare as the actual 'hardest' difficulty... heh, that skill level just isn't fair.
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Old 08-12-04, 08:13 AM   #88
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Default Re: Disappointments in doom 3

Now to contact Carmack and mention those pictures I have of him
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Old 08-12-04, 08:14 AM   #89
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Default Re: Disappointments in doom 3

So... uh, can I see those pictures?

You know, just to... confirm them.
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Old 08-12-04, 09:22 AM   #90
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Default Re: Disappointments in doom 3

Quote:
Originally Posted by D.K.Tronics
I wasn't comparing it to anything. This isn't about comparisons, it's about people on this board that are trying to make out this game is almost perfect. And, like I said, it isn't.
Sorry, but that's an opinion and not a fact. Clearly when you say something is perfect, or not perfect, you are comparing it to something. Most likely you are comparing it to some ideal of what a perfect game is to you. That's not what the game designers are trying to do (not ones that make the game that they want to make).
Quote:

Let me ask you people this,
Why couldn't there have been a checkbox that allows the player to decide if he/she wants to carry a torch AND gun ?
Then surely, *I* get to decide how *I* want to play Doom 3, NOT Carmack, or you lot.
I'm getting a little sick and tired of games designers who
1. Think they are Steven flippin Spielberg
2. Think they can tell the player how He/She should be playing the game.
3. Write fantastic looking engines, but forget about actually writing a game to compliment it.
Once again, that last point there is an opinion, not a fact.

Does it irk you that game designers have the control over how the game turns out, and not you? Surely you don't have the same problem with a movie or a book? Games are trying to tell an interactive story that has the feel that they want to give you. They can't give you all the choice to play the game as you choose, because then the story and feel as they imagined (and created it) has changed, and isn't what they wanted. *Shrugs*.
Quote:
Thing is, I don't even find complete darkness even remotely scary. I'm not afraid of the dark, so why is it such a used cliche, where it's used as a cheap gimmick to scare people ?
Would you go and watch a horror movie, that was completely filmed in pitch black darkness, and all you could do was listen to sound effects ?
Would you find it scary ?
I would be more frustrated, and p*ssed off, than feeling tension, and fear.
Well that's kind of a moot point anyway, cause the game isn't so dark that you can't see where you're going without the flash light.

For me the scariness (should probably call it suspense) of the game comes out of the feeling of something wrong with the place. Something evil, something intangible, but something that can mess with me if it wanted to. The thought that something that you can't see (not even with a flashlight) is watching you, following you, waiting... that's the part that makes it scary or suspensful to me. I actually feel safer and less scared when I'm blasting away at monsters. The dark parts don't scare me as such, but I do get a shock when something comes jumping out of it at me. Shock and fear are different things.

Anyways...
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Old 08-12-04, 10:19 AM   #91
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Default Re: Disappointments in doom 3

Quote:
Originally Posted by D.K.Tronics
I wasn't comparing it to anything. This isn't about comparisons, it's about people on this board that are trying to make out this game is almost perfect. And, like I said, it isn't.
Uh, not really. The typical post from someone who ISN'T whining about every aspect of the game goes like this:

"I liked Doom 3 a lot. It was fun and the atmosphere was creepy and enjoyable."

The typical post from someone who IS whining about every aspect of the game goes like this:

"I H8 THIS GAME LOLZ. OMG ITS SO DARK AND U HAV 2 UZE A FLASHLIGHT LOL11!1! I COULD M4K3 IT BETTER ITS SO UNRELISTC. LOLZ OMG11!!1 ID RATHER PLAY FAR CRY ITS OUTDOORZ11!!"

To which the typical response from someone who ISN'T complaining and crying goes like:

"That's how the game was supposed to be. Stop concentrating on every little flaw and just enjoy it. Nothing's perfect."

And the response from the whining, crying, screaming people goes:

"I H8 THIS GAME LOLZ. OMG ITS SO DARK AND U HAV 2 UZE A FLASHLIGHT LOL11!1! I COULD M4K3 IT BETTER ITS SO UNRELISTC. LOLZ OMG11!!1 ID RATHER PLAY FAR CRY ITS OUTDOORZ11!!"

And so on and so forth. Here's the facts, whiners. Doom 3 has been well recieved and greatly enjoyed by over 90% of the people who've played it as several polls have pointed out. You are what's known as the VOCAL MINORITY. Meaning you can shut the hell up. Obviously none of us can convince you to enjoy the game, so maybe we can stop talking about it? Please? It's getting old. You're all running out of material.

And I totally stole the AOLer speech from one of your posts, Saint Lucifer. It served well in this post too, I think.
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Old 08-12-04, 10:21 AM   #92
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Default Re: Disappointments in doom 3

Quote:
Sorry, but that's an opinion and not a fact.
But It's MY opinion.


Quote:
Clearly when you say something is perfect, or not perfect, you are comparing it to something.
CLEARLY, You have no idea what you are on about


Quote:
Once again, that last point there is an opinion, not a fact.
Millions of people all moaning at the same thing, is NOT just an opinion. If it was just a handful of people across the web, the you'd have a point.

Quote:
Does it irk you that game designers have the control over how the game turns out, and not you?
Did I ask for how I want a game to turn out ?
All I want is a bit of freedom to choose. If I wanted a linear experience, without ANY sort of interaction on my part, then I'll hire a DVD movie.

Quote:
Games are trying to tell an interactive story that has the feel that they want to give you. They can't give you all the choice to play the game as you choose, because then the story and feel as they imagined (and created it) has changed, and isn't what they wanted. *Shrugs*.
For crying out loud, all I ask for is a bit of CHOICE. It's not like I asked if it was possible to do the washing up, Hoover the place clean, Start a David Hasslehoff fan club, run around naked while singing "Sunny days are here again", or open a mars based garden centre for Hell Spawn.

Quote:
Well that's kind of a moot point anyway, cause the game isn't so dark that you can't see where you're going without the flash light.
Right, and I have the monitor brightness on full, the ingame gamma on nearly full, and the ATI CP gamma on not quite but nearly there almost full. And I STILL can't see a damn thing.

To me, it's clearly you have an agenda with those that have differing opinions to you.
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Old 08-12-04, 10:22 AM   #93
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Default Re: Disappointments in doom 3

Best post ever by Ninjaman09 above. Totally agree.
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Old 08-12-04, 10:33 AM   #94
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Default Re: Disappointments in doom 3

Quote:
Originally Posted by D.K.Tronics
Millions of people all moaning at the same thing, is NOT just an opinion. If it was just a handful of people across the web, the you'd have a point.
Actually, it IS just a handful of people across the web that are moaning and crying. See my above post about the vocal minority. By the way, the implication is that the majority aren't saying much because they don't have anything to complain about.

Quote:
Originally Posted by D.K.Tronics
Did I ask for how I want a game to turn out ?
All I want is a bit of freedom to choose. If I wanted a linear experience, without ANY sort of interaction on my part, then I'll hire a DVD movie.
<sarcasm>Yes, what a reasonable and appropriate comparison. I mean, there was no interaction at all when I was using that crane to pick up barrels of toxic waste and dropping them into an incinerator, or the computers that have interactive menu systems that I used.</sarcasm> For comparison, please point out a first person shooter that is so much more interactive. And of course, a first person shooter being rendered in real-time on your PC where you control every movement your character makes it totally comparable to a DVD movie. Brilliant comparison, again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by D.K.Tronics
But It's MY opinion.
Yep, and no one cares.

Quote:
Originally Posted by D.K.Tronics
Right, and I have the monitor brightness on full, the ingame gamma on nearly full, and the ATI CP gamma on not quite but nearly there almost full. And I STILL can't see a damn thing.
I've addressed the "OMG LOLZ THIS G4M3 IZ SO DARK!1!! OMG LOLZ." ridiculousness in previous posts. Suffice it to say you are exaggerating to the point of lunacy and we'll leave it at that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by D.K.Tronics
For crying out loud, all I ask for is a bit of CHOICE. It's not like I asked if it was possible to do the washing up, Hoover the place clean, Start a David Hasslehoff fan club, run around naked while singing "Sunny days are here again", or open a mars based garden centre for Hell Spawn.
Sounds to me like that's exactly what you're asking for. Doom 3 never purported to be anything other than a run-n-gun blast-everything-you-see shooter game with a creepy atmosphere and demons from hell. I don't understand what level of interactivity you were expecting, but what was delivered was far beyond what you usually see in an action FPS like this, especially from id.
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Old 08-12-04, 10:35 AM   #95
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Default Re: Disappointments in doom 3

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninjaman09
Uh, not really. The typical post from someone who ISN'T whining about every aspect of the game goes like this:

"I liked Doom 3 a lot. It was fun and the atmosphere was creepy and enjoyable."

The typical post from someone who IS whining about every aspect of the game goes like this:

"I H8 THIS GAME LOLZ. OMG ITS SO DARK AND U HAV 2 UZE A FLASHLIGHT LOL11!1! I COULD M4K3 IT BETTER ITS SO UNRELISTC. LOLZ OMG11!!1 ID RATHER PLAY FAR CRY ITS OUTDOORZ11!!"

To which the typical response from someone who ISN'T complaining and crying goes like:

"That's how the game was supposed to be. Stop concentrating on every little flaw and just enjoy it. Nothing's perfect."

And the response from the whining, crying, screaming people goes:

"I H8 THIS GAME LOLZ. OMG ITS SO DARK AND U HAV 2 UZE A FLASHLIGHT LOL11!1! I COULD M4K3 IT BETTER ITS SO UNRELISTC. LOLZ OMG11!!1 ID RATHER PLAY FAR CRY ITS OUTDOORZ11!!"

And so on and so forth. Here's the facts, whiners. Doom 3 has been well recieved and greatly enjoyed by over 90% of the people who've played it as several polls have pointed out. You are what's known as the VOCAL MINORITY. Meaning you can shut the hell up. Obviously none of us can convince you to enjoy the game, so maybe we can stop talking about it? Please? It's getting old. You're all running out of material.

And I totally stole the AOLer speech from one of your posts, Saint Lucifer. It served well in this post too, I think.

Quit it with the childish complaining kids, people are bringing up their concerns with a game in a respectful and adult manner, you lot however are dismissing them like little children, almost fanboy like. Show some respect, the game has problems to some people and you have no right to start acting like idiots because somebody does not agree with you.
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Old 08-12-04, 10:37 AM   #96
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Default Re: Disappointments in doom 3

Quote:
Originally Posted by vampireuk
Quit it with the childish complaining kids, people are bringing up their concerns with a game in a respectful and adult manner, you lot however are dismissing them like little children, almost fanboy like. Show some respect, the game has problems to some people and you have no right to start acting like idiots because somebody does not agree with you.
He's still right =)
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