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Old 08-23-04, 01:13 PM   #73
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Default Re: X-box owners screwed by Id!

Quote:
Originally Posted by steeda
FTR, 480p is not an HD mode.
My Dreamcast can do 480p and on a PC monitor
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Old 08-23-04, 01:19 PM   #74
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Default Re: X-box owners screwed by Id!

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Originally Posted by DaveW
My Dreamcast can do 480p and on a PC monitor
Actually your Dreamcast can 640x480@60hz non interlaced in VGA mode. Not quite the same thing. Close but no cigarillo :P
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Quote:
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In defense of Cooper Lawrence : "I hate gamers and the gaming community."
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Old 08-23-04, 01:31 PM   #75
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Default Re: X-box owners screwed by Id!

Quote:
That isn't "support". FSAA should have been supported out of the box, in the video options menu.
Irrelevant. You said it doesn't work, and I posted to prove it does.

Quote:
It seems you've chosen to ignore the entire subject of my post and nit-pick at a little statement I threw in for support. I'm not here to argue for or against console gaming. My point is that each platform offers an excellent gaming experience depending on what you like to play.
I posted exactly the same thing, at the end of my first post. So you clearly chose to ignore that, and nit pick at MY post.

Quote:
How do you output to HDTV modes from a PC though?
HDTV PC

Quote:
PC's are by design more open. They also have a much higher overhead to get the same things done as the XBOX. What I think is ultimately silly about comparisons like yours is that I can show you a number of real world (HDTV output in progressive mode with 3:2 pulldown AND Hardware Zooming in XBOX Media Centre vs MediaPlayer or even VideoLanClient for that matter) tests where the XBOX trounces a PC. Yes trounces, even with it's "poxy" 733Mhz and 64MB of unified memory.
I agree, I love Media Centre. But be aware that it's BASED off of a PC open source media player. It's not a naitive Xbox application, coded from the ground up. And also be aware that there's a PC version of Xbox Media Centre.
But Media Centre, STILL lacks many decent codecs that are available on PC, including Quicktime 6, new Xvid, etc.. And won't ever support these unless the open source PC verison is updated.

Quote:
Lastly DK, THX is set of standards. Nothing more and, quite often, a lot less (as its largely just a sticker to sell goods as *Approved* by Skywalker sound - marketing guff for the uneducated). The whole Dolby EX - 7 channel argument has quickly been forgotten in the wake of more universal (read : more cheaply licensed) standards such as DTS (which is configurable right up 24 speakers - ask LEXICON they designed it - Movie Theatres use it). THX means precisely dick to *real* audio engineers. I make music. I also worked for one of Australia's leading distriubutors of Aphex pro. audio studio gear. My boss is a true Audiophile. He has a pair of Tannoy Westminsters. Look them up. The only other person who has the same pair (from the same run) is the THE QUEEN. The rest of his speakers are Tannoy studio monitors. His decoder is a LEXICON studio quality decoder. Then we get too his AMPS. Yes he has one (including separate AMP and PRE-AMP), for each speaker pair. Oh and he has 24 speakers in total, including an $8000 subwoofer which is only dwarfed by one of the Westminsters. He laughs at THX. Any serious Audiophile does.
What does this have anything to do with ?
Could anybody here actually afford that kind of kit ?
I'm not sure what you are getting at ?
I have a friend who owns a one-hundred thousand pound Black Lambourghini Diablo, and one of only 7 in the UK. But what would that have anything to do with if you mentioned you had a GTI ?
I'm talking about kit that the average man can afford to buy, not what some rich bloke owns.

Quote:
Instead of poo-pooing the XBOX, why not just give in and get one?
I have an Xbox 1.1, with an Executer 2 Pro, Blue Neon LEDS at the front, and a nice Blue Neon LED for the Executer 2 chip. I have a seagate 120Gb HD in there, and a Pioneer Slot-loading DVD drive to replace the standard Samsung. The harddrive is full of emulators, movies, mp3's and even games I've ripped to the HD. I have UnleashX as my dashboard, and a cromwell BIOS.
You obviously didn't read the bit where I posted I actually owned one.
I also own a chipped PS2 with the messiah,
A Gamecube
Dreamcast
PSOne
Saturn
PC Engine Core GFX
NeoGeo
SNES
N64
NES
And tons more right back to the Atari 2600.
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Old 08-23-04, 01:38 PM   #76
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Default Re: X-box owners screwed by Id!

Quote:
Originally Posted by D.K.Tronics
What does this have anything to do with ?
Could anybody here actually afford that kind of kit ?
I'm not sure what you are getting at ?
I have a friend who owns a one-hundred thousand pound Black Lambourghini Diablo, and one of only 7 in the UK. But what would that have anything to do with if you mentioned you had a GTI ?
I'm talking about kit that the average man can afford to buy, not what some rich bloke owns.
Quite frankly I'm getting at the fact that you were waving it in someone else's face:-

"Ever heard a true THX encoded DVD ? Thought not."

There's no such thing. THX isn't an encoding standard. Mostly it's just a noise floor standard. At most. Generally it's just marketing. If by that you're implying that consumers are idiots, I must say that I take some offence. Or are you implying that the person you were arguing with knows nothing about "enthusiast" Hi Fi because he hasn't heard a "true THX encoded" DVD?

Whatever you're trying to imply, you're wrong. That's what I'm implying

also...

"I agree, I love Media Centre. But be aware that it's BASED off of a PC open source media player. It's not a naitive Xbox application, coded from the ground up. And also be aware that there's a PC version of Xbox Media Centre.
But Media Centre, STILL lacks many decent codecs that are available on PC, including Quicktime 6, new Xvid, etc.. And won't ever support these unless the open source PC verison is updated."

Not totally correct. The ORIGINAL XBOX Media Player was based of FFMPEG sources. Due to the fact that the team wouldn't supply thier source code they couldn't use the same FFPMEG libraries anymore and the project was rewritten entirely from scratch NATIVELY for the XBOX. This is what we no know as XBOX MEDIA CENTRE. Humourously *this* has now been PORTED to PC. HEH and that's what you refer too. The current version of XBMC supports the MANY codecs and file formats (too many too list here) NATIVELY:-

http://www.xboxmediacenter.de/info_project.htm

Any updates that occur are DIRECTLY to the XBOX version as that is the main version. Any PC versions are non contributed ports.

Time to get with the program
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NVJoe
In defense of Cooper Lawrence : "I hate gamers and the gaming community."
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Old 08-23-04, 02:04 PM   #77
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Default Re: X-box owners screwed by Id!

Quote:
Originally Posted by mezkal
For the record 480p, 720p 1080i and some other modes are all classed as HDTV.
480p is not HDTV but rather EDTV. Heck even ProjectorCentral.com believes that is so.
Quote:
PC's are by design more open. They also have a much higher overhead to get the same things done as the XBOX. What I think is ultimately silly about comparisons like yours is that I can show you a number of real world (HDTV output in progressive mode with 3:2 pulldown AND Hardware Zooming in XBOX Media Centre vs MediaPlayer or even VideoLanClient for that matter) tests where the XBOX trounces a PC. Yes trounces, even with it's "poxy" 733Mhz and 64MB of unified memory.
Well there's that PCI card called the Holo3DGraph by Immersive, Inc. for the PC which is basically Faroudja DCDi-in-a-card. Video inputs include S-Video, Composite, Component, SDI, and PDI. Holo3DGraph I uses the FLI2200 chip while the Holo3DGraph II uses the FLI3201 chip. The XBox cannot trounce a low-end PC using this card when it comes to video source material. This config has some limitations though.
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Old 08-23-04, 02:15 PM   #78
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Default Re: X-box owners screwed by Id!

Quote:
Not totally correct. The ORIGINAL XBOX Media Player was based of FFMPEG sources. Due to the fact that the team wouldn't supply thier source code they couldn't use the same FFPMEG libraries anymore and the project was rewritten entirely from scratch NATIVELY for the XBOX. This is what we no know as XBOX MEDIA CENTRE. Humourously *this* has now been PORTED to PC. HEH and that's what you refer too. The current version of XBMC supports the MANY codecs and file formats (too many too list here) NATIVELY:
Taken directly from the XBMC programmer

Quote:
- SHN (Shorten)
- MPC (MusePack)
- APE (Monkey Audio)
- DivX 5.1 and/or 5.2 Pro (FYI, most newer DivX-encodes already play fine in XBMC anyway as it's done via FFmpeg)
- VP62 (VP6v2/VP 6.2)
- QuickTime 5/6+
- 3ivX
- DVR-MS (Microsoft Windows Media Center codec)
- mp3PRO
- DTS-software-decoder
- XMV (Xbox Video format/codec)
...etc. (and so on, and so on, and so on...)

So we hope that we here can explain a bit why we don't do very much with requests or suggestions for new audio/video codec support;

Fact is that we, the Team-XBMC-devs do not add any codecs ourselves to XBMC. XBMC uses MPlayer as our core to play audio/video files and therefore XBMC only support those codecs which MPlayer can demux and decode, (well, most of the media formats MPlayer supports anyway). Sure, we would also love SHN, MPC, etc. support in XBMC too. However we believe that those should be added to MPlayer first and not direct into XBMC. So best thing for you is to kindly ask the MPlayer guys (www.mplayerhq.hu) to add your favorite codec into their player instead of requesting it from us at XBMC. Then if and when MPlayer plays it, you got a big chance that XBMC will be able to play it too.
Have a guess what Mplayer is ? It's a PC player that XBMC takes it's source from.
Guess someone else needs to get with the program.
Oh, and did you notice the codecs, posted above, that it lacks ?
Guess what, the PC doesn't have that problem.
Not that I watch movies on it, anyway.

Quote:
Whatever you're trying to imply, you're wrong. That's what I'm implying
No, I was trying to say that I too have a quality audio system connected to my PC, and that it's not only for home theatre systems in the living room.
Do you see ?
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Old 08-23-04, 02:18 PM   #79
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Default Re: X-box owners screwed by Id!

Quote:
Originally Posted by gmontem
480p is not HDTV but rather EDTV. Heck even ProjectorCentral.com believes that is so.

Well there's that PCI card called the Holo3DGraph by Immersive, Inc. for the PC which is basically Faroudja DCDi-in-a-card. Video inputs include S-Video, Composite, Component, SDI, and PDI. Holo3DGraph I uses the FLI2200 chip while the Holo3DGraph II uses the FLI3201 chip. The XBox cannot trounce a low-end PC using this card when it comes to video source material. This config has some limitations though.
Uhh...You normally compare Apples with Gold Boxed Nashi Pears?

I mean you're right (as far as the card's power goes) but it's hardly a fair comparsion now is it?

and the discussion of EDTV being a solely standalone format is also rather academic as in the real world HDTV's support EDTV modes. Infact for the most case EDTV modes are scaled up and filtered to work in HDTV 1080i res.

But keep going Professori :P
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NVJoe
In defense of Cooper Lawrence : "I hate gamers and the gaming community."
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Old 08-23-04, 02:28 PM   #80
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Default Re: X-box owners screwed by Id!

Quote:
Originally Posted by D.K.Tronics
Have a guess what Mplayer is ? It's a PC player that XBMC takes it's source from.
Guess someone else needs to get with the program.
Oh, and did you notice the codecs, posted above, that it lacks ?
Guess what, the PC doesn't have that problem.
Not that I watch movies on it, anyway.
I know what Mplayer is - it's the Linux alternative to MediaPlayer. Please show me how it still relates to the XBMC project. I couldn't find any reference to it on thier website in their FAQ - http://www.xboxmediacenter.de/info_faq.htm . Now maybe I'm tired, but I really couldn't see any references at too Mplayer anymore.

Oh and they do support Quicktime 5/6 and some other formats via dll integration.

Unless of course I'm totally uninformed I think you're confusing XBMP (XBOX Media Player) with XBMC (XBOX Media Center).

If I'm wrong, enlighten me.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NVJoe
In defense of Cooper Lawrence : "I hate gamers and the gaming community."
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Old 08-23-04, 03:14 PM   #81
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Default Re: X-box owners screwed by Id!

I took that quote directly from their forums, it was posted by the XBMC programmer.
I know it's still based off of the PC media player because I keep up with developments. I often read topics where users want newer codecs support, and are always told the same thing. Unless the PC version gets an update, then we can't do anything about it.

Check out some topics here

link

And I can't get any QT6 movies to play. These include some amazing quality rips of all 4 Lethal Weapon movies I have on 1 DVD-R. Yet I can play my 3 QT5 rips of the Indiana Jones series, again on DVD-R.
I have tried downloading linked DLL's, but got nowhere. I have read many topics on 3ivx movies and QT6, but nobody has been able to play them.

Quote:
Unless of course I'm totally uninformed I think you're confusing XBMP (XBOX Media Player) with XBMC (XBOX Media Center)
Not a chance there. I do still use XBMP, as I find it plays Divx and MP4 movies better than XBMC. This is mainly down to better ISO support, than anything. Although I do often burn off movies in UDF format, and this plays better in XBMC.
I do like XBMC, though. Streaming movies, via relax, or even smb sharing via my PC. Shoutcast support is nice, as is Python support. Skinning is wonderful, and you can even use XBMC as a dash.
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Old 08-23-04, 03:27 PM   #82
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Default Re: X-box owners screwed by Id!

Cool. My Bad. I did say I was tired :P
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Quote:
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In defense of Cooper Lawrence : "I hate gamers and the gaming community."
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Old 08-23-04, 06:27 PM   #83
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Default Re: X-box owners screwed by Id!

480p isn't an HD mode bro :P

http://www.hdtv.net/faq-general.cfm#whatishdtv

Only 720p and 1080i are actually HDTV, everything else is just "something else".

Quote:
What is EDTV and SDTV?

EDTV is Enhanced Definition Television and represents the digital broadcasting format of 480p. This is the standard DVDs are encoded in and the standard that FOX has adopted as their primary broadcast format. This format is inferior to the HDTV formats.
Other good explanations:

http://www.cnet.com/4520-7874_1-5107912-1.html

Quote:
480p - 480 progressive; form of standard-definition digital television (SDTV) comparable to VGA computer displays but not considered high-definition television (HDTV), though 480p is discernibly cleaner and slightly sharper than analog television. The native resolution of DVD is 480p, but that resolution can be seen only if a DVD player outputs a progressive-scan signal and the DTV has progressive-scan or component-video inputs; it is also known as EDTV.
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Old 08-23-04, 06:28 PM   #84
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Default Re: X-box owners screwed by Id!

Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveW
My Dreamcast can do 480p and on a PC monitor
Cool, but 480p still isn't HDTV =) That's what I was clarifying.
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