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Old 08-24-04, 12:03 PM   #13
Ninjaman09
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Default Re: How did Valve get put on its pedastal anyway?

mezkal:
I said "not sticking to the facts" because I posted nothing but facts in my post and you responded with nothing but opinions. Which I have no problem with, but I was trying to say that I was using Valve's accomplishments and track record as a basis of comparison rather than people's opinions of their one game. Your post wasn't actually even in disagreement with mine, and I wasn't trying to rebut you, except that personally I think Half-Life pales in comparison to other games. So you shouldn't take any offense, as I meant none. Like I said, I loved Half-Life too. However, Valve hasn't made any other games before or since then. Even Bungie had the Marathon games (which rocked) before Halo. So far, they are a "one hit wonder" in PC Games. Therefore, I think they are a grossly overrated developer.

ynnek:
By "in its time" I meant like during its time period. Those games were technically comparable to Half-Life, and could all run about the same on the average to high end system at the time. Well, as long as you had a 3dfx card.
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Old 08-24-04, 12:07 PM   #14
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Default Re: How did Valve get put on its pedastal anyway?

I'm amazed by the number of mods for UT2003 - 2004...it seems new ones pop up every day.

As far as single player mods go, Half LIfe definately had (has) more than any other game...

Half Life was a great and still is an excellent game. Valve, however seem a little pompous after releasing just 1 game...i gave up on team fortress years ago...After 3 good games I'd be confident enough to say that valve was an A+ developer

In terms of game developers that have proven their skills I would have to rank the top 3 as ID, Raven, and Monolith as the most consistent developers. Sure Raven and Monolith had duds (soldier of fortune 2 and contract jack and blood 2) but look at their track record...

Raven: Jedi Outcast, Jedi Academy, Elite Force, Soldier of Fortune, Heretic 2, Heretic, Hexen 2, Hexen

Monolith: Blood, Shogo, no one lives forever, no one lives forever 2, aliens versus predator, and tron 2.0

I'd have to say any one of the monolith games listed above had more mood than half life ...

I hope for Valve's sake that Half Life 2 is the second coming...
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Old 08-24-04, 12:19 PM   #15
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Default Re: How did Valve get put on its pedastal anyway?

Quote:
Originally Posted by intercede007
I mean really.....There are die-hard Cleveland Browns fans. You have to ask?

stfu
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Old 08-24-04, 01:50 PM   #16
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Default Re: How did Valve get put on its pedastal anyway?

do not put a man like Stanley Kubrick in the same step as gabe. thats it for that issue.
now, as far as games go, hl was one of best, if not THE best in the fps genre.
but graphics are not everything, there are many old games considered better then todays games. take final fantasy 7 for xemple. in my opinion it is the best game ever, simply because of story. and even today i keep playing it on my ps. but lets not get off topic here.
valve should be considered as one of the best simply because they made a game that made us look at games in a different light. 90% of the games today have stories that are far better to the ones we see in movies.
the way i see it, there is no way that hl2 will be just another game, and it will most deffenetly out-do doom3. but still, i look at doom3 as one of the games that will change the future. i has the best looking engine, and i look at it like a simple game, only for id to let the public see thier new xcelent engin at work.
so id is a pinoneer in its field. valve only make great games. they didnt invent anything new, they just took it to the next level.
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Old 08-24-04, 02:20 PM   #17
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Default Re: How did Valve get put on its pedastal anyway?

Quote:
Originally Posted by H3avyM3tal
valve only make great games. they didnt invent anything new, they just took it to the next level.
What game besides Half-Life has Valve done? And don't even start on the expansion packs because Gearbox did those. Valve has shown they are, so far, nothing but a one-trick pony. Granted other developers can be put into the same general boat, but many also have more than one game to put on their resumes.

That said, Half-Life is probably my favorite game of all time. The actual story itself certainly falls well short of being innovative. But Valve mastered the incorporation of the story into gameplay. It didn't have the "tacked on" feel that many games in this genre had (and continue to have). In my opinion, nearly everything you did in Half-Life had a purpose. There were points where it made you think - it wasn't all about going in guns a-blazin', kill everything in sight, lather, rinse and repeat.

From everything I've seen about HL2, it looks like this is an element Valve has not forgotten. There will be a reason behind most everything you do, only it will be on a much larger scale than in the first game.

I've said it before, but I think it bear repeating. Half-Life made an awful lot of gamers and the media very jaded about the whole FPS genre. It set the bar so high that most of its successors (not counting MP only titles like Quake 3 and Unreal Tournament) weren't (to quote Derek Smart's Desktop Commander) "worthy to lick their filth-encrusted boots."

I think Far Cry started to change all that. It didn't do it with story so much as it did with its environments and the interactivity contained therein. Though it was frustrating as hell at points, Far Cry was the most enjoyable first-person experience I've had since Half-Life. I find myself wanting to replay it more than finishing Doom 3 or Painkiller.
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Old 08-24-04, 02:30 PM   #18
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Default Re: How did Valve get put on its pedastal anyway?

my bad, i meant to say valve only made a great game.
hey im with you on the game, but its far from being the best of the best.
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Old 08-24-04, 02:39 PM   #19
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Default Re: How did Valve get put on its pedastal anyway?

Ugh. Don't get me started on Final Fantasy 7. I appreciate the game for its influence on the acceptance of RPGs as a legitimate game type, and it was a great game on its own merits...but there are a bajillion other RPGs with MUCH better stories. Go play Lunar: Silver Star Story Complete or Skies of Arcadia and tell me FF7 has a better story. Don't talk about character depth or development - aside from Cloud himself and maybe Barrett, there really isn't any at all. Not to mention the ending of the game, which was very anti-climatic and drawn out, not to mention very abstract and confusing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by saturnotaku
What game besides Half-Life has Valve done? And don't even start on the expansion packs because Gearbox did those. Valve has shown they are, so far, nothing but a one-trick pony. Granted other developers can be put into the same general boat, but many also have more than one game to put on their resumes.
*edit - this was posted by saturnotaku - my mistake, I'd just responded to Edge in another thread - sorry! *

Exactly my point.
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Old 08-24-04, 02:43 PM   #20
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Default Re: How did Valve get put on its pedastal anyway?

Hey now! I love FF7 .
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Old 08-24-04, 02:54 PM   #21
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Default Re: How did Valve get put on its pedastal anyway?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninjaman09
Exactly my point.
Except that Edge didn't say it. I did.
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Old 08-24-04, 02:58 PM   #22
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Default Re: How did Valve get put on its pedastal anyway?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninjaman09
Ugh. Don't get me started on Final Fantasy 7. I appreciate the game for its influence on the acceptance of RPGs as a legitimate game type, and it was a great game on its own merits...but there are a bajillion other RPGs with MUCH better stories. Go play Lunar: Silver Star Story Complete or Skies of Arcadia and tell me FF7 has a better story. Don't talk about character depth or development - aside from Cloud himself and maybe Barrett, there really isn't any at all. Not to mention the ending of the game, which was very anti-climatic and drawn out, not to mention very abstract and confusing.



Exactly my point.

I'll have to disagree here. The lunar series is way too childish for me and Skies of Arcadia imo is the most overrated rpg of all time.

No character development aside from barret and cloud? So I guess the whole time we find out bits and pieces of areis's past until all is revealed and Seph kills her....that wasnt character development? RedXIII going from a lab expeirement to finding out he's the new king and protector of his land and what his parents did.....that's not character development? Everything was planned out perfectly imo. From the evil shinra corps, to the deterioration of the planet, to seph, to aeris, to cloud, to barrett....what wasnt to like?

FF7 was brilliant. While I feel FF2 and 3 for snes (or 4 and 6 if you go by the jap. #'s) had much better stories, FF7 put rpg's on the map. FF3 for snes.best rpg. ever. 7 comes close though.

I havent seen, played or had my eye on a decent rpg yet for the current systems. FF10 and X-2 were the worst in the series to me. And Star Ocean is way too linear. (Least it was...havent tried the ps2 one)

I will say though, as great as the ff series used to be....I havent played a good one since 7....square just aint what it used to be . =/
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Old 08-24-04, 03:00 PM   #23
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Default Re: How did Valve get put on its pedastal anyway?

Quote:
Originally Posted by saturnotaku
Far Cry was the most enjoyable first-person experience I've had since Half-Life. I find myself wanting to replay it more than finishing Doom 3 or Painkiller.
Dam you Sat will you quit steeling my thoughts!!!

Summed it up nicely

That being said I fear no matter how good HL2 is or isn't it may just fail due to the fact the first one was so good. Did they set the bar so high from the first one that they can not make it? Only time will tell....
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Old 08-24-04, 03:05 PM   #24
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Default Re: How did Valve get put on its pedastal anyway?

[/quote]Go play Lunar: Silver Star Story Complete or Skies of Arcadia and tell me FF7 has a better story.[quote]

Sorry to go off topic but I played them all, RPG fanatic here and FFVII frigging story wowed me. Everything came together and you really felt for every characters especially when Aerith was killed so early on and you thought for sure she would be back...but she wouldnt. I wont lie it even choked me up a little and was a stunning. Skies of Arcadia although great cannot hold a candle story wise in anyway and shouldnt even be mentioned in the same breath IMO, Lunar came close but again..... It has been some 7 or more years since I played it and still not many if any other RPG has captivated me like it did. Still one of the only rpg'd next to Chrono Trigger that I think about to this day and hold every rpg I play to. Hell there should be a rule no other RPG's should be mentioned in the same breath as Chrono Cross and FFVII and some other classics...they stand on there own and shouldnt be compared.

back on topic..........
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