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Old 01-26-03, 01:32 PM   #37
junkieclown
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Thanks for your tenacious attempts to help and advise....

I didn't mention it before but 2.4.20 with rml's preempt patch is one kernel variant I've tried -just before trying -ac2.

[jazbo@wheel jazbo]$ ll /boot/vmlinuz*
lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 21 Dec 27 15:56 /boot/vmlinuz -> vmlinuz-2.4.18-19.8.0
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 1114125 Sep 4 12:27 /boot/vmlinuz-2.4.18-14
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 1109334 Dec 12 04:56 /boot/vmlinuz-2.4.18-19.8.0
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 992790 Jan 1 01:45 /boot/vmlinuz-2.4.20-ac2
-rw-r--r-- 1 root root 983201 Dec 28 01:33 /boot/vmlinuz-2.4.20-preempt

I have a plan to get some tech support from a local store that specializes in workstations and actually includes mentions of Linux in its self-promotion. I bought the mboard, cpu and ram from them. I'm hoping that for a nominal bench fee, they will help me substitute some different GF4 cards into this rig and possibly come up with a different result.
In my gut though, I know there is an answer in an improved future version of Nvidia's Linux driver and GLX. People with this mboard have no trouble running their GF4 cards -which won't run opengl for them under linux- with Nvidia's WIndows drivers. I have seen my own GF4 card running 3d games fine on Windose98 w/ a sis735 --only to crash on the same board when running Nvidia's Linux GLX .
GF4 ti4200 is supposedly a tightly controlled (by Nvidia) hardware specification-- aside from the heatsink&fan, all ti4200 boards look alike right down the position and type of capacitors you see sticking out of the board.

I am at the point where I have to get a definitely supported hardware configuration (like an Intel chipset mobo and cpu ) donate my not-really-supported VIA/Amd hardware to a relative and just move on. I got this stuff as a Xmas gift and here it is nearly Valentine's Day. I should be billing/sueing Nvidia for my lost time, spent sorting out the lies of their Linux support propaganda, but that would be like expecting to get a refund check from Microsoft for an unused Windose installation you wipe from a newly purchased laptop.
Even if a different GF4 board magically works for me, the problem is the slipshod character of Nvidia's support for Linux and the Via chipsets. They're letting this stuff run out the door without much testing it truly appears to me.
Nvidia's WINDOWS drivers for this Nvidia spec approved board WORK (because they did their testing there), and their Linux driver DOES NOT - (because --whatever reason-- but they haven't caught on to the fact that there are tons of problems or don't care) that's what it comes to in the end.

I believed them, and now I am out the money.
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Old 01-26-03, 05:30 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally posted by junkieclown
all ti4200 boards look alike right down the position and type of capacitors you see sticking out of the board.
Seriously? Maybe you can help me, then. I think FTI Computer (the place I got mine from, I would never buy anything from them again, though) managed to deprive me of a capacitor on my board.

What type of cap is in position C2267 on yours?
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Old 01-26-03, 07:17 PM   #39
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If it's important to you have a look for yourself
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Old 01-26-03, 08:22 PM   #40
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Hmm... unfortunately, I can't read off the capacitance or voltage from that picture... I can see the cap, but just not the values I'd need in order to find a replacement.

Well, thanks, I'll look around images.google.com for a bigger pic of the card.

Unless you want to check that cap and let me know what it says on top... if not, though, that's fine. Thanks.
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Old 02-01-03, 03:01 PM   #41
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Been running a Quadro4 900 XGL for a few days now. Works great - wish it was mine.
The card is from Dell and is essentially a GF4 4600 Ti tuned for accuracy instead of fps.

So on a ECS K7S5A the following cards works for me:
Leadtek WinFast GeForce2 MX DH Pro
Dell Quadro2 MXR
Dell Quadro4 900 XGL

This one does not:
Gainward GeForce4 Ultra/650 (4200 Ti)
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Old 02-06-03, 04:59 PM   #42
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Thanks Lte that is very interesting information.

Here is another bit of information I have just encountered :
(the description of crashing artifacts in WIndows although skimpy, sounds like what I see )
excessivehardware.com

Gainward Geforce4 Ti 4200 Problem
Thursday, January 09, 2003
Posted by: Teo Katsuragi

This morning I decided to take matters a step further. I wanted to rid us of the "perhaps only some are bad", way of thinking. I used to work at a pc upgrades store, and this morning I walked into the store with a printed copy of this thread, and asked that I be allowed to take one of the staff, and 26 (the entire stock) Gainward GF4 Ti4200 64mb Ultra/650 TV Powerpacks (Golden sample version), with me for some controlled testing. After reading just 3 pages of the printed material, my ex boss agreed. So in the car went 26 cards and Alan, off to my house where my test bed machine stood.

Test Machine

Windows XP
DirectX 8.1
Drivers Supplied by the Gainward Geforce4 Ti 4200 CD
Epox 8k3a+ (it has proved to be fairly stable for me since I got it so long ago)
Athlon XP 1900+
512mb Corsair ram
400watt PSU
SoundBlaster Audigy

The testing phase

The test was to run each card once through a full bout of 3dMark3001SE, including the dreaded nature test.





Results:

8 cards made it to high polygon count + 4 lights, then PSOD (Pink Screen Of Death).
9 cards made it to nature test, then PSOD.
6 cards PSOD'd ar random points during testing.
2 cards caused BSOD's during windows boot.

One card made it through all testing without a PSOD... so out of 26 cards one made it through 3dMark2001SE. But thatís not even the worse part. After realizing this, Alan called his boss with our findings as I reboxed the cards, ready to be shipped back to Gainward. During this, I had set the one working card to loop the 33dMark demo. After packing about 15 cards, Alan drew my attention to the blank monitor. The CPU fan was notably louder, after hitting the power button on the machine and pulling out the card. I realized this card would not be PSOD'ing anymore, nor would it be working again either. One of capacitors now has a hole in the side of it.
So there you have it, 26 cards, 23 PSOD'ers 2 BSOD'ers, and 1 suicidal.

Given the blatant evidence that these cards are ALL dodgy, both myself and Alan returned to the store. As I walked in with details of my findings, I noticed a man with his son, looked around 19, stood at the counter, as me and Alan walked past carrying a piled high tower of the Gainward cards, the kid remarked, "Ah look, they have them in stock now, we wont have to come back!Ē After returning from the storeroom, I showed the kid and his dad my findings, and recommended another card. Gainward lost a sale, but at least I left the place knowing that there was one less person that would go away angry.

Since this event this morning, the 64mb Gainward Geforce4 Ti 4200 have been removed from the price list of the store, and removed from the shelves, the entire stock of 64mb cards is being sent back. Maybe if more stores do this they will have more happy customers and less angry ones.

AMDMBís Forums have been the primary contributor to the information regarding the Gainward Geforce4 Ti 4200 issue. The great people on their forum are one of the first to isolate this problem and have been attempting to take action on it. You can read the full 43 page post here on their forums

-Teo Katsuragi

Update:
We just received an email from Gainward and they are preparing an official statement. According to our PR contact, "Gainward will take care of our customers. This situation is NOT taken lightly by Gainward." We will keep you updated as this story develops.

It looks as if this problem does not include all Gainward Geforce4 Ti 4200ís. We have reports of a few isolated incidents of people having a Gainward Geforce4 Ti 4200 and it functioning perfectly normal. Except most of those people also say that overclocking the card any whatsoever will induce crashes, PSOD, and the dreaded checkerboard screen.

Here is a photo of a defective card, and here is a photo of a card that has been "working flawlessly, 3DMark was complete a billion times at default speeds and at 300/600 overclocked." The problem seems to be the capacitors in the top right corner of the card.

If you do believe your card is defective then you can contact Gainward's RMA dept. The phone number for the RMA department is 800-539-2273. Once you have done that, Gainward will give you a UPS call tag and UPS will come and pick up your video card. Gainward is taking full responsibility and even paying for the shipping.


[b]Bwkaz: the values on the top of the capacitor location you gave are (on this sorry piece of **** Gainward ti4200) as follows:
2 5
470
2 5 A

I suppose there must be decimal points where I put spaces.

another forum where Gainward Ti4200 is under discussion and criticism for being a fudge up card:
amdmb.com

Last edited by junkieclown; 02-06-03 at 05:29 PM.
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Old 02-06-03, 05:06 PM   #43
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bwkaz: The values ontop of the capacitor location you asked about are as follows:

2 5
470
2 5 A (that's leetle capital A superscript --i don't know if that signifies anything about a multiplier/divisor)

At least that's how it looks of my Gainward ti4200. Which doesn't work!
I have put spaces where it seems there should probably be decimal points.
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Old 02-06-03, 06:07 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally posted by junkieclown
2 5
470
2 5 A (that's leetle capital A superscript --i don't know if that signifies anything about a multiplier/divisor)
OK, thanks. That's probably 470 microfarads (uF), and 2.5 volts or something. In any case, if I were to grab a 5V, 470uF cap, it might work. I don't know what the 2.5A is, but I am pretty sure it's not amps.

Thanks again.
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Old 02-07-03, 10:09 AM   #45
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try the tar ball for the kernel from nvidia site
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Old 02-07-03, 01:37 PM   #46
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You could say that is the first thing I tried, since I always install that way.

The problem isn't installing the nvidia kernel module, or getting X to start, or even getting OpenGL apps to start , the problem is crashing in 3d.

I do not have the only ti4200 card mentioned in this thread with a 3d stability problem, but mine (Gainward Ti4200 Ultra/650 ) is essentially under recall from the manufacturer.

The original poster had a PNY ti4200 and a similar problem.
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