Go Back   nV News Forums > Linux Support Forums > NVIDIA Linux

Newegg Daily Deals

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old 07-09-06, 06:27 AM   #25
Linuxhippy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 585
Default Re: 2D accaleration is simply a joke!

@zbiggy: I talked about _real_ Linux users, not sold boxes.
According to web-browser user-statistics Linux desktop users surfing the net are about 2-3% overall, o.k. there are web-browsers which allow to manipulate the agent-string, so we are max. at about 5%.

When talking about gamers (since everybody else should be fine with even the most crappy onboard hardware if good drivers exist) which are the group NVidia makes money with we are at about maybe at 1% of the total game market.

lg Clemens
Linuxhippy is offline  
Old 07-09-06, 06:51 AM   #26
zbiggy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 623
Default Re: 2D accaleration is simply a joke!

Quote:
Originally Posted by nusgnaf
Does UniChrome works well under linux? I ask this because if I read the faq on http://unichrome.sf.net correctly, the linux driver lacks xvmc support, doesn't this mean that it cannot do hardware mpeg2 acceleration?
There are 6 kinds of Unichrome driver (5 open + 1 proprietary). The link you are talking about is open source project. Nvidia in open source driver does not provide XvMC too. However one of opensource VIA drivers can do XvMC for MPEG-2 stream using VLD = CPU usage 5% during decoding.

The proprietary drivers from VIA contain support for most chipsets, mpeg2 and mpeg4 acceleration. Thare are special VLD versions of xine and mplayer:

http://www.viaarena.com/default.aspx...=29&DCatType=1

Via also provides accelerated frame buffer driver for text console so there are no glitches as with nvidia and vesafb.

So there is choice for Linux users. I hope Nvidia improve 2D with new driver release as xorg7.1 is more OpenGL accelerated. I do not have Unichrome but as XElef says Unichrome is faster than geforce I think I could give it a try with my next hardware upgrade.
zbiggy is offline  
Old 07-09-06, 07:15 AM   #27
Linuxhippy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 585
Default Re: 2D accaleration is simply a joke!

Quote:
I hope Nvidia improve 2D with new driver release as xorg7.1 is more OpenGL accelerated.
What? Xorg7.1's rendering does not have anything to do with OpenGL.
XGL on the other side is a complete different topic, you get high-level accaleration but you'll have to pay a large overhead-penality on simple primitives (lines and small fills for example) which are also _very_ important for 2D applications. Not to speak about the overhead they introdcuce when running OpenGL apps!

lg Clemens
Linuxhippy is offline  
Old 07-09-06, 07:50 AM   #28
SquireSCA
Gun-Monkey
 
SquireSCA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 362
Default Re: 2D accaleration is simply a joke!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Linuxhippy
First of all, not Linux catches up but the drivers of the manufacturers catch up.
The solution is even simpler, buy hardware of companies that actually really care about Linux support. XElef mentioned that he is quite happy with UniChrome.


First of all why do you think anybody is interested in your personal failure story - and why do you call Linux the reason for _your_ failure, when so many others are using it on desktop happily?
What you call "ease-of-use" are in my eyes descisions made for the customers with no way out, however to understand the system itself you need time and you have to be open for new stuff ... if not you are simply not "linux ready".

lg Clemens

Because as a consumer I am not willing to downgrade or use inferior hardware in order to get Linux to work.

I don't care if it is Linux or the drivers, the bottem line is that if you use Linux, you encounter the issies. Windows lets me use pretty much anything that I want, Linux does not. Therefore it has not "caught up" to Windows, whether it be directly(Linux) or indirectly(Vendor drivers).

And we have not even addressed issue like game titles or software titles.

If Linux works for you, and you can hunt and peck to find older hardware that works fine, that's great. But that's not for me.

For people like me that want the latest hardware and want to play the latest games and nit have to worry about support, Linux is simply not ready for primetime.
__________________
Coolermaster Centurion5 w/Antec NeoHE 550W
Asus P5B Deluxe/Core2Quad 6600 at 2.4Ghz
4GB Corsair TwinX DDR2 800Mhz
BFG 8800GT OC Edition
Gateway 24" LCD
Dell 2005FPW 20.1" LCD
Creative Labs X-Fi/Logitech Z680 speakers
74GB WD Raptor/400GB Seagate SATA
Samsung 16x Dual-Layer DVDRW/Liteon 16X DVDROM
Vista 64bit
SquireSCA is offline  
Old 07-09-06, 07:58 AM   #29
energyman76b
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Clausthal/Germany
Posts: 1,104
Default Re: 2D accaleration is simply a joke!

Quote:
Originally Posted by SquireSCA
The solution is simple:

Stick with Windows until Linux catches up in regards to hardware support and ease of use.

I too want to make the switch to Linux, but I am not willing to downgrade my hardware or cripple it with a lack of driver support. So I will continue to use XP or Vista Beta2 until Linux becomes a viable option.
Windows is no option for me. Too unstable, to insecure. Unusable.

From my point of view windows is a usability nightmare.

I am living without windows for many years now. I don't want to go ever baxck to that catastrophe. Thank you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SquireSCA
I have wasted literally weeks of my life trying to get Linux to work for me over the past several years. It never does, unless I am willing to make a lot of sacrifices or compromises, which I am not.

I know that it probably is not what you wanted to hear, but it is the hard fact that I had to finally accept.
I did not. When I started with linux (Suse 6.2) I was ready to completly switch in less than 6 month. It was perfect for me from day one.

Yes, in the first time, I destroyed it several times. But I also destroyed windows several times - and it was always easier to repair linux than windows. Oh, the reinstallation was also faster.
energyman76b is offline  
Old 07-09-06, 08:03 AM   #30
SquireSCA
Gun-Monkey
 
SquireSCA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 362
Default Re: 2D accaleration is simply a joke!

Windows is no option for me. Too unstable, to insecure. Unusable.

Dude, that might have been the case 7 years ago, it is not anymore. You are hanging onto myths. They are myths every bit as much as when people claim that "Linux requires everything to be done from the command line". It sounds great in an argument, but we both know it is BS. Both Linux and WIndows have come a loooong way since those days.

From my point of view windows is a usability nightmare.

Well, you are allowed to have an opinion and bias.

I am living without windows for many years now. I don't want to go ever baxck to that catastrophe. Thank you.

Again, your choice to make. I however won't resign myself to inferior hardware and a lack of good game titles simply so that I can say I am Windows-free.

I did not. When I started with linux (Suse 6.2) I was ready to completly switch in less than 6 month. It was perfect for me from day one.

Yes, in the first time, I destroyed it several times. But I also destroyed windows several times - and it was always easier to repair linux than windows. Oh, the reinstallation was also faster.


Again, if all I needed a PC for was typing docs, internet, basic multimedia and stuff, I would use Linux as well.
__________________
Coolermaster Centurion5 w/Antec NeoHE 550W
Asus P5B Deluxe/Core2Quad 6600 at 2.4Ghz
4GB Corsair TwinX DDR2 800Mhz
BFG 8800GT OC Edition
Gateway 24" LCD
Dell 2005FPW 20.1" LCD
Creative Labs X-Fi/Logitech Z680 speakers
74GB WD Raptor/400GB Seagate SATA
Samsung 16x Dual-Layer DVDRW/Liteon 16X DVDROM
Vista 64bit
SquireSCA is offline  
Old 07-09-06, 08:22 AM   #31
zbiggy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 623
Default Re: 2D accaleration is simply a joke!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Linuxhippy
@zbiggy: I talked about _real_ Linux users, not sold boxes.
According to web-browser user-statistics Linux desktop users surfing the net are about 2-3% overall, o.k. there are web-browsers which allow to manipulate the agent-string, so we are max. at about 5%.

When talking about gamers (since everybody else should be fine with even the most crappy onboard hardware if good drivers exist) which are the group NVidia makes money with we are at about maybe at 1% of the total game market.

lg Clemens
For company every user is sold box. This is sad I know but I do not believe when company says 'we made it especially for you'. What about employees in company with blocked Internet access to make them more focused on work to do? They still use Linux driver but they do not browse the web. In company only several people really need Internet access to do their work.

Linux for professional use is very good. The only thing is to find right hardware to reach high performance and stability. If something is going wrong you simply get source code, make a fix, build it, replace binaries with those fixed and system runs again. Fast, simple and effective. Take a look at Windows: have only binaries, something wrong happens, you can only call tech support and pray if they fix it or not. Binary patching is hard and illegal so why anybody would like to take the risk if Linux is available?

If you want games what you are doing here? Windows is a GOS (game operating system) worse than game consoles. I use Linux at home to avoid hostile junk from Internet and watch DVDs. No deinterlacing however sometimes make me angry when use Nvidia's XvMC.
zbiggy is offline  
Old 07-09-06, 08:22 AM   #32
nusgnaf
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3
Default Re: 2D accaleration is simply a joke!

Quote:
Originally Posted by zbiggy
There are 6 kinds of Unichrome driver (5 open + 1 proprietary). The link you are talking about is open source project. Nvidia in open source driver does not provide XvMC too. However one of opensource VIA drivers can do XvMC for MPEG-2 stream using VLD = CPU usage 5% during decoding.

The proprietary drivers from VIA contain support for most chipsets, mpeg2 and mpeg4 acceleration. Thare are special VLD versions of xine and mplayer:

http://www.viaarena.com/default.aspx...=29&DCatType=1

Via also provides accelerated frame buffer driver for text console so there are no glitches as with nvidia and vesafb.

So there is choice for Linux users. I hope Nvidia improve 2D with new driver release as xorg7.1 is more OpenGL accelerated. I do not have Unichrome but as XElef says Unichrome is faster than geforce I think I could give it a try with my next hardware upgrade.
Thanks for more info. Unforutnately VIA didn't produce competitive chipset these days. Those P4M800/KT890 really nees liftup on spec.
nusgnaf is offline  

Old 07-09-06, 08:38 AM   #33
energyman76b
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Clausthal/Germany
Posts: 1,104
Default Re: 2D accaleration is simply a joke!

Quote:
Originally Posted by SquireSCA
Windows is no option for me. Too unstable, to insecure. Unusable.

Dude, that might have been the case 7 years ago, it is not anymore. You are hanging onto myths. They are myths every bit as much as when people claim that "Linux requires everything to be done from the command line". It sounds great in an argument, but we both know it is BS. Both Linux and WIndows have come a loooong way since those days.
dude, every months hundreds of new windows viruses appear. Every week another criticial security hole is found, and Microsoft needs sometimes YEARS to fix them. That are facts, no myths.

Unstable - if you have a winsdows box with NOTHING else running, it is stable. Sadly you need: an antivirus solution, a firewall, not oine but two spyware detection&removal tools. And some other 'security' and 'privacy solutions' which, in combination, suck away performance and make it unstable. That is not a myth. That is my experience dealing with windows users every day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SquireSCA
From my point of view windows is a usability nightmare.

Well, you are allowed to have an opinion and bias.
Yes, and my opinion and bias makes me hate abominations like the registry, idiotic stuff like \, a braindead shell and the fact that driver managment is hell. 'you have to install the driver form the mainboard vendor, than the one from the chipset vendor and than the graphics-driver - and make sure you don't have any graphic drivers installed - and don't install the soundblaster driver before the graphic driver'. You'll find rubbish like that in every windows related forum.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SquireSCA
I am living without windows for many years now. I don't want to go ever baxck to that catastrophe. Thank you.

Again, your choice to make. I however won't resign myself to inferior hardware and a lack of good game titles simply so that I can say I am Windows-free.
Amd64, 939DualSata2, Audigy2, Geforce 6600.
Inferior hardware?
I am playing ut2004, vegastrike, wesnoth, freevciv and some other minor games. Lack of good titles?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SquireSCA
I did not. When I started with linux (Suse 6.2) I was ready to completly switch in less than 6 month. It was perfect for me from day one.

Yes, in the first time, I destroyed it several times. But I also destroyed windows several times - and it was always easier to repair linux than windows. Oh, the reinstallation was also faster.


Again, if all I needed a PC for was typing docs, internet, basic multimedia and stuff, I would use Linux as well.
and as you can see, I use it for: basic multimedia stuff (mp3/ogg encoding/playing, video encoding/watching, flash stuff, typing, playing. I don't miss anything.

Except the gaping security holes and the 60 000 Viruses.
energyman76b is offline  
Old 07-09-06, 09:01 AM   #34
zbiggy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 623
Default Re: 2D accaleration is simply a joke!

Quote:
Originally Posted by SquireSCA
The solution is simple:

Stick with Windows until Linux catches up in regards to hardware support and ease of use.
I do not want Linux to catch up. I'm afraid if Linux will be less complicated more users will appear and all threats known from Windows will come to Linux too going after newbie users migration.

I would like to keep the present situation: Linux - clean, stable, performance platform for professional work and Windows as home system for newbies with all threats focusing on it only. This is good state because I don't have to do virus or spyware scanning so I can do other things and do not have to be careful when browsing.

The more boxes mr. Gates sell the more safe Linux is. So I wish mr. Gates bigger and bigger number of customers every year.

If I make sure Via is really faster than Nvidia and tech support is good too I will change my present geforce-nforce brothers to Via unichrome.
zbiggy is offline  
Old 07-09-06, 09:02 AM   #35
SquireSCA
Gun-Monkey
 
SquireSCA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 362
Default Re: 2D accaleration is simply a joke!

dude, every months hundreds of new windows viruses appear. Every week another criticial security hole is found, and Microsoft needs sometimes YEARS to fix them. That are facts, no myths.

Yes, yes, viruses. Of course, with 9 out of 10 PC's running Windows, that is where one would expect to find them. So Linux and MacOS don't get viruses. Neither do fat chics, because nobody wants to F them. ;-)

Unstable - if you have a winsdows box with NOTHING else running, it is stable. Sadly you need: an antivirus solution, a firewall, not oine but two spyware detection&removal tools. And some other 'security' and 'privacy solutions' which, in combination, suck away performance and make it unstable. That is not a myth. That is my experience dealing with windows users every day.

Sadly, I do not see those problems. AVG provides a great and free virus scanner. And MS provides a good and free spyware scanner. Other than that, I have no problems. And with the literal terabytes of pr0n and warez that I have downloaded over the past decade, I have yet to get slammed by a virus. And as for stability, another myth. You know the #1 thing that causes instability? Buggy device drivers, not the OS. And if you want to take the stance that it is not Linux's fault for lack of driver support, that it is the hadrware vendor's fault, then you should apply that same logic here. XP has proven for most people to be extremely stable.

I have had more instability in Linux than I have had with XP, in all seriousness. I would get Konqueror crashes and the X server would lock, etc...

Yes, and my opinion and bias makes me hate abominations like the registry, idiotic stuff like \, a braindead shell and the fact that driver managment is hell. 'you have to install the driver form the mainboard vendor, than the one from the chipset vendor and than the graphics-driver - and make sure you don't have any graphic drivers installed - and don't install the soundblaster driver before the graphic driver'. You'll find rubbish like that in every windows related forum.

And you find them all in the Linux forums as well. Forums tend to be havens for the people having problems, and that is not limited to any one OS.

Amd64, 939DualSata2, Audigy2, Geforce 6600.
Inferior hardware?


Yeah, inferior. 2+ year old sound card, 2 year old bargain level video card, etc... Compared to a 7800GTX SLI and X-Fi rig, it is inferior. I did not say that it would not suit your needs, but it it old outdated stuff, and nothing that I would consider buying personally.

I am playing ut2004, vegastrike, wesnoth, freevciv and some other minor games. Lack of good titles?

Yeah, I see a few basic games, and UT2004, which is going on 3 years old now. Try getting COD2, FEAR, HALO, Serious Sam2 and some other games running well at 1680x1050 4xFSAA 16xAniso and all the eye candy cranked up under Linux.

and as you can see, I use it for: basic multimedia stuff (mp3/ogg encoding/playing, video encoding/watching, flash stuff, typing, playing. I don't miss anything.

Except the gaping security holes and the 60 000 Viruses.


If Linux works for you, great. If you are happy with it, kudos. I wish I could get it to work for me. I scour distrowatch *daily*, reading every review I can find, burning stacks of ISO's and trying them out, but at the end of the day, there is really only one OS that does everything that I need it to, and that is Windows.

I wish that it were otherwise, as I like the notion of a free OS with free apps and customization and all that. You seem to think that I am some Windoers fanboi here to bash teh Nix, but you would be wrong, sir.

I would love to see Linux challenge Windows in the desktop market and bring about the same competition that AMD brought to the CPU market, where we can all afford fabulous chips from either company.

I just don't see it happening, yet. That's just an honest assessment of where things are today. it is not bashing, and a year from now it could be en entirely different story.
__________________
Coolermaster Centurion5 w/Antec NeoHE 550W
Asus P5B Deluxe/Core2Quad 6600 at 2.4Ghz
4GB Corsair TwinX DDR2 800Mhz
BFG 8800GT OC Edition
Gateway 24" LCD
Dell 2005FPW 20.1" LCD
Creative Labs X-Fi/Logitech Z680 speakers
74GB WD Raptor/400GB Seagate SATA
Samsung 16x Dual-Layer DVDRW/Liteon 16X DVDROM
Vista 64bit
SquireSCA is offline  
Old 07-09-06, 09:08 AM   #36
SquireSCA
Gun-Monkey
 
SquireSCA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 362
Default Re: 2D accaleration is simply a joke!

Quote:
Originally Posted by zbiggy
I do not want Linux to catch up. I'm afraid if Linux will be less complicated more users will appear and all threats known from Windows will come to Linux too going after newbie users migration.

I would like to keep the present situation: Linux - clean, stable, performance platform for professional work and Windows as home system for newbies with all threats focusing on it only. This is good state because I don't have to do virus or spyware scanning so I can do other things and do not have to be careful when browsing.

The more boxes mr. Gates sell the more safe Linux is. So I wish mr. Gates bigger and bigger number of customers every year.

If I make sure Via is really faster than Nvidia and tech support is good too I will change my present geforce-nforce brothers to Via unichrome.
No, what you want is for your "elite club" to stay elite and not be dilluted by having the unwashed masses coming over to Linux. It's akin to the Mac mentalilty.

You are different and think that all Windows users are inferior and newbies and that only a select few are smart enough to use Linux. Subconciously(or maybe not), that is part of the appeal of Linux, is it not?

You see yourself as different and special, and in a way you might be by virtue of the fact that you are in the vast minority.

But if Linux suddenly got a 40% desktop marketshare, then you would no longer be special. You would be average, and deep down I think that bothers many Linux and Mac fans.

Pointing out areas where Linux can improve is not bashing. It's constructive criticism.

I will agree that were Linux to become a mainstream desktop OS, it would encounter many of the issues that Windows currently has. In the effort to be everything to everybody, compromises would have to be made and that would open it up to vulnerabilities and all that fun stuff.

So I partly see what you are saying, and I agree on that count.
__________________
Coolermaster Centurion5 w/Antec NeoHE 550W
Asus P5B Deluxe/Core2Quad 6600 at 2.4Ghz
4GB Corsair TwinX DDR2 800Mhz
BFG 8800GT OC Edition
Gateway 24" LCD
Dell 2005FPW 20.1" LCD
Creative Labs X-Fi/Logitech Z680 speakers
74GB WD Raptor/400GB Seagate SATA
Samsung 16x Dual-Layer DVDRW/Liteon 16X DVDROM
Vista 64bit
SquireSCA is offline  
Closed Thread


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Gaikai_Inc: RT @stamenicn: I'm simply amazed by how well this thing works. This is th News Archived News Items 0 06-16-12 11:40 AM
Saturday Crapshoot: Quest For Glory 4 1/2 News Gaming Headlines 0 06-09-12 11:10 AM
Simply Wonderful: SimCity Dated For February 2013 News Archived News Items 0 06-02-12 09:40 AM
One of my joke posts were removed Kruno Feedback Forum 10 09-18-02 09:22 PM

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:21 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©1998 - 2014, nV News.