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Old 03-14-07, 01:41 PM   #97
Xion X2
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Default Re: Double Experience Weekend on Vanguard... Again

Quote:
Originally Posted by UDawg
Ya know Xi, you hav gotten me totaly wrong. I have followed Vanguard for the last two years. I was so excited about this game. Once I got into the BETA my excitement was killed. Then I said I will give the game a try after what Tyger said about it. I really wanted to like this game and in fact I do like the game even with its flaws. As I have said before I think the flaws will be worked out over time but they still frustrated me. That being said I decided to go back to WoW because I have time for only one MMO and Vanguard was just not enough to pull me away from WoW.
Hey, that's cool bro. I totally understand what it's like to get your hopes up for a game and then it not live up to expectations.

And yeah, two MMOs at once is overwhelming. If you like WoW better, then good for you. I may give it a try later on now that I'm completely hooked on MMOs. I'm sure that even with its dated graphics I would still like it. When I picked it up before, I didn't really get the whole MMO thing. Vanguard has changed that for good.
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Old 03-14-07, 01:41 PM   #98
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Default Re: Double Experience Weekend on Vanguard... Again

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Originally Posted by Xion X2
Don't flatter yourself. I was looking for some more up-to-date screens of WoW (remember my request for that a few posts up?) and figured there would be a few on the Warcraft thread here. In the process, I ran across some pretty hilarious quotes of yours--a completely different opinion of WoW that you were putting on display.



Oh, I think it's valid anyway. Because a lot of the same things you've criticized Vanguard for in comparison to WoW you also criticized WoW for on that thread I quoted you on.



I agree.



Legitimate complaint. It is slightly annoying to me as well.

See? I have absolutely, 100% no problem with you criticizing Vanguard! That has nothing to do with it.



Well, I will extend you that courtesy if you also extend it to me. You called me a fanboy previously when I have posted several complaints about Vanguard myself on these forums. I've never gotten why you thought that about me after some of the comments that I've made about the game.



And you were doing so well. No, no, no, NO, NO!

I don't get upset when you criticize Vanguard. Stop perpetuating this silly little myth of yours. I only get upset when people try to back up their criticism with bull*(#@ complaints that make no sense. Like you saying the game is "one-dimensional," for example. WTF? Grinding, crafting, harvesting, diplomacy, questing--how does that make it one-dimensional.

Say it's boring. Say it lags. Say there's too much grinding. Say the graphics aren't fantasy-style enough for you. Whatever. But don't espouse bull(#*@ reasons for backing up your criticism of it. It just makes it look like you're searching for things instead of being truthful.



Not at all. I've seen them, but they were never really a part of the discussion, so I didn't feel the need to comment on them.



What is a "drudge?" I think you meant "grudge," which I'm not. I "let it go" a long time ago.. right up to the point I saw you spouting inaccuracies again. The only reason I replied is because your comments were in direct contradiction to the facts. That's all. It had nothing to do with me having my widdle feewings hurt, so stop trying to perpetuate that myth, please.
don't hate me bacause I have typ-o-itis.

What have I contradicted? LOL Every thing I stated is a fact that has been backed up by all who have played Vanguard.

I have never said WoW was a perfect game or the greatest game. That is why your point isn't valid. I actually gave up WoW 4 times for three months at at time because the game was ****ty. I look at vanguard and it has the same problem but in this case I am not willing to work through them like I did with WoW. Besides PVP in Halaa is friking awesome. The expansion Burning Crusade is worth full price alone. It is a fantastic addition to this game. It is something Vanguard will never be.
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Old 03-14-07, 01:45 PM   #99
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Default Re: Double Experience Weekend on Vanguard... Again

Newbie MMO question here, guys:

Quote:
Leveling up in WoW you can either grind quests, mobs, instances
What are these "instances" I keep hearing you guys talk about? I'm always hearing this as an advantage to WoW, and I'm curious as to what it is.

Also, no hard feelings w/ any of you guys. S'all good.
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Old 03-14-07, 01:51 PM   #100
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Default Re: Double Experience Weekend on Vanguard... Again

Quote:
Originally Posted by UDawg
What have I contradicted?
The "one-dimensional" comment triggered it all, I think.

Quote:
I have never said WoW was a perfect game or the greatest game. That is why your point isn't valid.
Come on, UDawg. You've been very critical of Vanguard in relation to WoW--so much that it's not even funny. It's a very valid point for me to make.

WoW had lots of optimization issues up front as you mentioned on that thread I quoted you on. Meanwhile, you've continually blasted Vanguard for these same issues while COMPARING them to how well WoW runs!

Can you not see how hypocritical that is? You said yourself that it took months and months for WoW to get optimized, so how is it fair to blast Vanguard for these same issues while comparing it to a game that once had the same problems when it was released?

Quote:
I actually gave up WoW 4 times for three months at at time because the game was ****ty. I look at vanguard and it has the same problem but in this case I am not willing to work through them like I did with WoW.
Now we're getting somewhere. That's what I had a problem with, because never before have you ever mentioned, while criticizing Vanguard, that WoW had some of these same problems. All you ever talked about was how well optimized it was by comparison.
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Old 03-14-07, 02:05 PM   #101
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Default Re: Double Experience Weekend on Vanguard... Again

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Originally Posted by Xion X2
Hey, that's cool bro. I totally understand what it's like to get your hopes up for a game and then it not live up to expectations.

And yeah, two MMOs at once is overwhelming. If you like WoW better, then good for you. I may give it a try later on now that I'm completely hooked on MMOs. I'm sure that even with its dated graphics I would still like it. When I picked it up before, I didn't really get the whole MMO thing. Vanguard has changed that for good.
Most people love WoW's PVP and it is fantastic. The problem is you have to lvl to get up to the good PVP. Anyway, that is where it is at for me. I love killing the other faction. I love going on bombing runs over Halaa and the TOTEM OF DEATH. LOL! Good times.
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Old 03-14-07, 02:08 PM   #102
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Default Re: Double Experience Weekend on Vanguard... Again

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xion X2
The "one-dimensional" comment triggered it all, I think.



Come on, UDawg. You've been very critical of Vanguard in relation to WoW--so much that it's not even funny. It's a very valid point for me to make.

WoW had lots of optimization issues up front as you mentioned on that thread I quoted you on. Meanwhile, you've continually blasted Vanguard for these same issues while COMPARING them to how well WoW runs!

Can you not see how hypocritical that is? You said yourself that it took months and months for WoW to get optimized, so how is it fair to blast Vanguard for these same issues while comparing it to a game that once had the same problems when it was released?



Now we're getting somewhere. That's what I had a problem with, because never before have you ever mentioned, while criticizing Vanguard, that WoW had some of these same problems. All you ever talked about was how well optimized it was by comparison.
No way, I hated WoW much more than I disliked Vanguard at that time. I just have to choose and I am already establish in WoW. If both games came out the same time I would have a hard time making my decission on which to play. While WoW's graphics don't bother me, I think that Vanguard's graphics are fantastic and most likely would chose Vanguard but then again I would never have known how much fun the pvp was.
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Old 03-14-07, 02:24 PM   #103
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Default Re: Double Experience Weekend on Vanguard... Again

What is PVP, exactly? I know that VG has a few PVP servers but I've never tried it. You do know VG has PVP too, right? (even though I have no earthly idea what it means as I've just admitted. )
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Old 03-14-07, 02:33 PM   #104
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Default Re: Double Experience Weekend on Vanguard... Again

Quote:
Originally Posted by Xion X2
What are these "instances" I keep hearing you guys talk about? I'm always hearing this as an advantage to WoW, and I'm curious as to what it is.
Instances are dungeons that are set up so that once a group enters, they are in a unique zone and cannot interact with other groups. This allows the dungeons to be heavily tweaked for scripted events and boss encounters with a high degree of strategy. Instances are the reason people play WoW endgame aside from PvP (which means Player versus Player). The bosses in these instances drop rare or epic gear which allows people to progress their characters beyond simply leveling them (leveling to 70 is a small portion of WoW).

Endgame WoW raiding and PvP is what has kept me playing for all this time. Grouping up with friends to tackle new challenges has always kept the game exciting for me. The expansion is even better because it allows you to do this on a smaller scale (5 to 10 man groups) and still enhance your character. Previously all raiding was done with 40-man groups for the major instances and 20-man groups for the smaller zones. 25-man groups are the current raid cap.
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Old 03-14-07, 02:50 PM   #105
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Default Re: Double Experience Weekend on Vanguard... Again

40-man groups? Wow. The biggest group I've been in so far on Vanguard was six people, heh. I have heard others on VG talk about "raids," so I get now that it means bigger grouping.

That sounds cool, though, thanks. If I understand you right, no other groups would be in the dungeon besides yours? Because I recall a few times on VG that there have been other groups up ahead of mine who were killing enemies, etc. Sometimes this is annoying, but sometimes it's a plus--like if your group isn't quite strong enough. You can then team up with the group in front of you to complete the quest.

But I do like the idea of "instancing" in the way that you explain it.
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Old 03-14-07, 03:42 PM   #106
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Default Re: Double Experience Weekend on Vanguard... Again

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Sometimes this is annoying, but sometimes it's a plus--like if your group isn't quite strong enough. You can then team up with the group in front of you to complete the quest.
That's what instances are designed to prevent. They force you to utilize your class's skills to the fullest extent and coordinate with your group members to succeed and are balanced around their intended group size. While many of the 5-man instances before TBC were fairly do-able with a couple poor players, the instances at level 70 force the group to work together and each player makes a big difference. The endgame instances have an unofficial chain of difficulty, as well as "heroic mode" versions which introduce much stronger enemies and leave little room for mistakes, but reward the party with better loot and various other benefits. Then endgame raiding comes into play. The first instance would be Karazhan, Medivh's tower. It's a very large dungeon that requires a group of 10 players to defeat quite a few bosses (I believe there are over 11) as well as quite a large amount of "trash" mobs.

Instances reset either once you manually reset them (for normal 5-mans) or on a timer (for raids). Most raids reset weekly, that is, all the bosses and trash mobs return to be killed again. Most guilds schedule their raids around this timer (Tuesdays, usually). Raid "progression" means the amount of bosses your guild is capable of killing. Raiding provides players with the best possible loot in the game at the highest difficulty. When people call WoW "easy" they may be correct in referring to the leveling process (on a non-PvP server anyway) but as far as endgame raiding in the expansion is concerned, I'd be interested to see what could be more difficult. Communication and coordination issues aside, many of the fights are very difficult to learn and master. The penalty for death in WoW becomes very noticable when you die over and over again all night long and have to pay significant sums of cash to repair your gear.

The Burning Crusade raiding endgame is tremendous in scope, containing a 10-man and 4 25-man instances (at release, several more are planned) all of which require guilds to complete Heroic Difficulty 5-man instances as well as requisite 10 and 25 man raid instances.

And characters can choose to skip raiding and still experience a rich endgame with the Battlegrounds and Arena instances. These instances are for team-based PvP with different objectives depending on the instance. Killing enemies or winning arena matches nets you points to spend on new powerful gear, which is designed to make you more competitive and powerful in PvP. Raiding gear does not necessarily help you in PvP, and vice versa.
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Old 03-14-07, 03:55 PM   #107
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Default Re: Double Experience Weekend on Vanguard... Again

bah,

I hate instances. I will never play an MMORPG based off instances EVER again.
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Old 03-14-07, 04:05 PM   #108
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Default Re: Double Experience Weekend on Vanguard... Again

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What is PVP, exactly? I know that VG has a few PVP servers but I've never tried it. You do know VG has PVP too, right? (even though I have no earthly idea what it means as I've just admitted. )
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-KbRomI5z0c

This is an example of a PVP battle ground. They are instances in the game where you do nothing but control points, capture flags and kill as many of the other team as possible. Good fun and this is where the physics engine comes into play. You realize just how important it is when you are pvping.
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