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Old 05-13-07, 06:08 PM   #61
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Default Re: More AMD Awesomness (Barcelona & R600)

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Originally Posted by radekhulan
Intel was the first to come up with 64-bit Itanium, true new platform, while AMD came up with primitive x86_64 extension
Itanic was junk, and a major major reason Intel lost the lead in the x86 realm until the release of the Core 2's. It was a billion dollar blunder based on assumptions that, while not totally incorrect, were not going to be necessary or advantageous for several generations after its initial debut... and then the industry would pick another way to solve the problem anyways (multi-core). EPIC architecture never worked as well as Intel had hoped. Neat idea on paper, very very very difficult to pull off well. Good for some applications, but not all.

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Originally Posted by radekhulan
Never heard of Itanium, a true 64-bit platform? AMD64 is just a primitive x86 extension, not a true 64b platform, and was launched AFTER Itanium..
x86-64 is most definitely a true 64 bit CPU. Who cares if it's an extension of the x86 ISA? The ISA itself is essentially a wrapper around the core of a modern CPU anyways (they're very RISC-ish internally).

I suppose you're going to tell us next that the 386 through Pentium 4 weren't "true" 32 bit chips?

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Unfortunately, even Intel wasn't strong enough to "sell" Itanium to the masses, because of poor 32-bit compatibility (=emulated), so we still have to live with obsolete x86 (or x86_64)
Intel wasn't strong enough to "sell" the Itanium to the masses because AMD had an alternative platform that was faster except for specialized applications that loved the Itanic's architecture, much much much cheaper, and had no compatibility issues. Intel's plan was to grab the entire industry by the balls and force them to switch to the Itanic. AMD spoiled that party big time. If you really want an Itanium that badly, feel free to buy one, they're still out there.

Itanic and internal politics hampered the design of the netburst architecture (since they assumed Netburst would be their last x86 architecture). Netburst turned out to have severe limitations, which allowed AMD to jump ahead of Intel with CPU's that were at least as fast, with feature advantages (x86-64, native dual core), and much lower power consumption. Intel was caught with their pants down and spent a couple years losing marketshare like crazy until they could get the Core 2's out the door.
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Old 05-13-07, 09:51 PM   #62
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Default Re: More AMD Awesomness (Barcelona & R600)

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Originally Posted by DMx
The 4x4 system has been designed for the CPUs to work together with the ram and the graphics card, Intel still hasn't even got an on-board NB or memory controller, they still use the same old tech FSB.
Well, FYI, the Nehalem chips will have onboard memory controller, so AMD's advantage will be lost.
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Old 05-13-07, 09:58 PM   #63
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Default Re: More AMD Awesomness (Barcelona & R600)

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Originally Posted by Amuro
Well, FYI, the Nehalem chips will have onboard memory controller, so AMD's advantage will be lost.
You are doing a apples to oranges speculation....it is not as simple as that

The way Intel implement a memory controller is important here...philosophy, features, specs and other things come into mind. This was posted by someone a few weeks ago with respect to differening stratergies....performance will be decided by what Intel decide is ROI and hitting the theoretical...
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Old 05-13-07, 10:08 PM   #64
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Default Re: More AMD Awesomness (Barcelona & R600)

Well Intel's MC could be better or worse...
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Old 05-13-07, 10:10 PM   #65
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Default Re: More AMD Awesomness (Barcelona & R600)

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Originally Posted by Amuro
Well, FYI, the Nehalem chips will have onboard memory controller, so AMD's advantage will be lost.
Not really, the superior architecture of K10 alone should be enough to destroy the intel chips even with onboard memory controllers.
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Old 05-13-07, 10:14 PM   #66
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Default Re: More AMD Awesomness (Barcelona & R600)

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Originally Posted by a12ctic
Not really, the superior architecture of K10 alone should be enough to destroy the intel chips even with onboard memory controllers.
Really? We shall see then. Whoever puts the best processor gets my money. BTW, how superior is the K10 when compared to Nehalem, which is the successor to Core 2?
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Old 05-13-07, 10:24 PM   #67
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Default Re: More AMD Awesomness (Barcelona & R600)

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Originally Posted by MUYA
Well Intel's MC could be better or worse...
Correct, AMD's could be better or worse too, unlike DMx's prediction.
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Old 05-13-07, 10:24 PM   #68
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Default Re: More AMD Awesomness (Barcelona & R600)

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Originally Posted by Amuro
Well, FYI, the Nehalem chips will have onboard memory controller, so AMD's advantage will be lost.
Not to sound fanboyish, but AMD have had on-board NB and MC for ages. They have optimized it and are preparing to integrate graphics.
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Old 05-13-07, 10:27 PM   #69
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Default Re: More AMD Awesomness (Barcelona & R600)

More info from Anandtech, see first post.
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Old 05-13-07, 10:27 PM   #70
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Default Re: More AMD Awesomness (Barcelona & R600)

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Originally Posted by DMx
Not to sound fanboyish, but AMD have had on-board NB and MC for ages. They have optimized it and are preparing to integrate graphics.
Yeah, but like I said, Nehalem will have both on-die memory controller and graphcis proccessor, so we don't really know which one is really better until the products are out. But I do know that Intel's very aggressive right now, with Penryn and Nehalem coming out back to back.
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Old 05-13-07, 10:37 PM   #71
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Default Re: More AMD Awesomness (Barcelona & R600)

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Originally Posted by Amuro
Yeah, but like I said, Nehalem will have both on-die memory controller and graphcis proccessor, so we don't really know which one is really better until the products are out. But I do know that Intel's very aggressive right now, with Penryn and Nehalem coming out back to back.
On-board graphics? Is it NVIDIA or ATi?

No? sorry it sucks.
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Old 05-13-07, 10:48 PM   #72
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Default Re: More AMD Awesomness (Barcelona & R600)

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Originally Posted by DMx
On-board graphics? Is it NVIDIA or ATi?

No? sorry it sucks.
I think Amuro is saying.."on-die" as opposed to "on-board"

Fusion?
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